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1x at the Tour

cantunamunch

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Primoz

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So I run my mouth all day about 2x on the road and then...
Well TJV did switch to Sram before this season, so I guess it's expected, when you have to use gear from company that is not able to produce properly working front derailleur :roflmao:
PS: But I have to give them credit for marketing 1x in mtb... it has its flaws and minuses, but all in all, it really is better then 2x/3x for mtb. And without Srams incapability of producing properly working (front) derailleurs, we would most likely never have 1x on mtb. So hats off for them incompetence... sometimes it's good thing :roflmao:
 

cantunamunch

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OK, super-dropped seatstays, how do we feel about them?

It's almost like they're trying to squeeze the disc brake caliper forward? Are 140mm discs too big for roadies or what? 160 obviously are...

Specifically looking at Powless' Cannondale SuperSix Evo4 (superdropped, the stay meets the seat tube at approx 2:15am on the back wheel - drive side)

1688568557665.png


vs.
Arkea Bianchis (the stays leave the dropouts at a more open angle then join into a flat strut that meets the seat tube at 1:30am on the back wheel, conceivably this could still allow a bigger disc brake fitment in the rear)

1688568370489.png
 
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scott43

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Used to be for comfort. Not sure for disc size. Bigger disc better cooling. And brake power. Swept area is the measure for that. Rear brake.. Easy to lock the rear but for long descents maybe bigger disc is better for best dissipation. I'm not sure if there's a good structural reason for moving the seatstays dish from the top tube.
 

cantunamunch

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I sort of feel Cannondale are just messing about for styling/ market appeal reasons - and now doing the exact opposite of what they did back in the 90s with the chainstay strut bikes.

Not sure for disc size. Bigger disc better cooling. And brake power. Swept area is the measure for that. Rear brake.. Easy to lock the rear but for long descents maybe bigger disc is better for best dissipation.

Yep, we're working from the same rules of thumb. So why are C'dale intentionally making the space available for disc brake calipers smaller ? That geo barely works for a 140mm rotor on a 58cm nominal frame...
 
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Tony S

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OK, super-dropped seatstays, how do we feel about them?

It's almost like they're trying to squeeze the disc brake caliper forward? Are 140mm discs too big for roadies or what? 160 obviously are...

Specifically looking at Powless' Cannondale SuperSix Evo4 (superdropped, the stay meets the seat tube at approx 2:15am on the back wheel - drive side)

View attachment 206925

vs.
Arkea Bianchis (the stays leave the dropouts at a more open angle then join into a flat strut that meets the seat tube at 1:30am on the back wheel, conceivably this could still allow a bigger disc brake fitment in the rear)

View attachment 206924
Watching today's stage now. Obviously a different thing with all the climbing.

Camera has been spending a lot of time on van Aert, Pedersen, and Campenaerts. Pedersen's Trek Madone (?) with the interrupted seat tube and the heavy-looking stays is aesthetically hideous compared with the Ridley and Cervélo of the other two riders. Wout was clearly on the climbers' model today. R5?

Modest seat stay drops as on the UAE Colnagos are attractive enough. I agree that the Cannondale looks like someone is trying to make an impression.

Functionally, can I assume that frames have gotten SO stiff now that creating strong geometric shapes is not only not necessary anymore, but actually undesirable?
 
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scott43

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Yeah the ability to build any shape and lay up the carbon fibre in specific ways leads to light and very strong frames. The size of the frame in the BB area is quite large, very rigid. The chain stays are rigid but narrow, seat stays are very thin. Plus CF has some flexibility. I imagine there is some better ride quality as a result. I rode my buddy's cervelo r5 after doing dying work on it. The strength and lightness is incredible. The creaking of the BB on the other hand...
 

cantunamunch

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Pedersen's Trek Madone (?) with the interrupted seat tube and the heavy-looking stays is aesthetically hideous compared with the Ridley and Cervélo of the other two riders.

Something about that Trek makes me think Bontrager missed an ugliness trick by not going with a sawtooth / ridged wheel profile like on a zipp 454 or princeton Mach.

My top notion as to what that 'something' is - the large tire-to-downtube gap.
 

cantunamunch

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Modest seat stay drops as on the UAE Colnagos are attractive enough. I agree that the Cannondale looks like someone is trying to make an impression.

Cannondale are not alone.

BMC, for example, did the super-dropped stays on Ben O'Connor's proto - and also threw in more than a few S5ish/Madoneish elements.

1688647500783.png


Factor did it on the O2 VAM:

1688647664670.png


I think LOOK also did it on this year's 795 Blade RS but I couldn't find a good pic.

Arguably, all those bikes actually look better than the C-dale.
 

cantunamunch

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Looking at it I suppose there is some aero advantage as well..

That whole weird rider-leg swirly area, with a vorticity change at the wheel, is just a massive black hole of :huh::huh::huh: So...maybe?...or maybe it's aero for looks?...or maybe it's "keeping up with Canyon style"
1688652150224.png


Honestly, I kind of like both Bianchi's take and Willier Triestina's take where they just go "screw that fashion noise, you want aero, here is something we KNOW":

1688652386437.png


(pics from BikeRadar here https://www.bikeradar.com/features/pro-bike/tour-de-france-bikes/ )
 
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chris_the_wrench

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Well TJV did switch to Sram before this season, so I guess it's expected, when you have to use gear from company that is not able to produce properly working front derailleur

you possibly referring to the red titanium front derailleur? How every pro was running a force? Or some of their other shenanigans like the red 22 disc recall…
 

Tom K.

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They ride whatever the people that pay them say...

Some truth at some levels, but not those two guys. They can ride what they want, and command commensurate compensation.
 

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