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A tale of two 188cm GS skis

DocGKR

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Out of perverse curiosity, a bit ago I had acquired two pairs of new 2021 188 cm 65mm wide Nordica GS skis w/identical Marker Piston Plates, both tuned 0.5/3. These have just been sitting in the garage waiting for me to get to them. Since Solden was cancelled, I was bored and needed something ski related to do, so I decided to finally mount up the skis and get them ready for race testing as soon as the snow falls at Palisades. I rummaged around and found a couple of pairs of Marker Race/Comp 20 bindings to throw on the skis.

What was interesting, is that while both are 188cm in length, one pair is a Junior ski offering a 25m radius, while the other is a 30m women’s FIS ski. I figured this will make an interesting comparison. Below is how they are listed in the 2021 Nordica Race Catalogue:

188.jpeg


Curiously, while the 30m FIS ski is labeled “stiff”, when hand flexing they are actually a bit softer compared to the Junior 25m ski.

Even stranger, although both skis are from the same vendor, same year, same 188cm length, same plates, differing only in the turn radius, the Piston plates on the Junior ski (on L) came from the factory mounted 1.2 centimeters behind the ones on the FIS ski (on R):

25 & 30 188.jpeg


Now I am itching in anticipation to get on snow and be able to do some back to back subjective testing to resolve this conundrum!
 
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Tony S

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Curiously, while the 30m FIS ski is labeled “stiff”, when hand flexing they are actually a bit softer compared to the Junior 25m ski.
Maybe that makes sense. Maybe a 30m ski of a given length should be expected to flex easier than a 25m doppelganger. Put a different way, sidecut is one thing; skiability is another. Scots has been saying this forever.
 

slow-line-fast

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While not quite the same, I have the 188/30 vs 184/25 test lined up for this season. I will see what proves faster for me on east coast GS sets.
Interested to hear about this as well. I guess we’d expect the 25m to feel faster and the 30m to actually be faster, but in tighter sets maybe 25m is both.

Onward with GS science
 

bbbradley

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Interested to hear about this as well. I guess we’d expect the 25m to feel faster and the 30m to actually be faster, but in tighter sets maybe 25m is both.

Onward with GS science
While my experiment isn't as controlled as the good Drs, (comparing Rossi/Look 101/65/81 to Blizzard/Marker 102/65/87 ), it will, if nothing else help me decide if the 30m are a help or a hindrance.

Rough estimates/recollections from last season...Eastern races have a field of ~50-60 skiers at a normal GS race, of that I would say there are no more than 5 skiers on 30m, and I've rarely seen another in my age bracket (M5) on 30m skis.
 

Petrus

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Maybe that makes sense. Maybe a 30m ski of a given length should be expected to flex easier than a 25m doppelganger. Put a different way, sidecut is one thing; skiability is another. Scots has been saying this forever.

I would expect the opposite since the 25m is a junior ski it should be softer than the 30m.
Waiting for the outcome of this interesting experiment.
 

bbbradley

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I would expect the opposite since the 25m is a junior ski it should be softer than the 30m.
Waiting for the outcome of this interesting experiment.
Inexact and uncalibrated as my hands are...my 25m jr ski feels stiffer than my 30m adult ski.
 

slow-line-fast

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My little wish is that the direct observations here can move us away from 'flex is important!' (which we all know, but have zero specific information to operate on) toward information about which GS skis have which flex.
 

slow-line-fast

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It has been my experience that many of the current 188/30m FIS GS skis are softer and more even flexing than the 180-187cm/21-27m Junior and Masters GS skis.
How does this general difference affect how they ski, in comparison? Ease of hooking up and tightening turn radius with higher edge angles, performance in gates, etc. Keeping skier the same. Thanks.
 

cloudymind

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interesting
have you measured the actual width of the skis? they should be a little different because the position of the binding doesn't make a huge difference with the radius.
also can the plate position have an effect on the stiffness? or maybe the women ski is offered even in an extra-stiff version? because the recomended binding looks more aggressive compared to the junior.
but on the other side probably the junior ski is more budget-oriented since would probably used for a short period and the cheaper binding is already strong enough.

i'm looking for a long radius soft ski and i find the marketing of manufacturers really obscure. also probably wooden skis have a small tollerance and racers test each before buying. i noticed they use to mark the skis.
 

anders_nor

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maybe its because 188's are often bought by us amateur older, less skilled riders? aka masters, and we like the 188s

some of the junior riders are just... insanely good.
 

skix

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Isn't there a wrong assumption being made here? To comply with competition rules the radii are listed as being greater or equal to a number. So the true radius is not known for either ski. Both could have a radius of 30.

... edit to add ... radius is determined by sidecut shape so are the skis identical in shape or does the >=25 ski have a noticeably smaller curved sidecut?
 
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Swede

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Radie is probably a little more that the exact number on the ski. The woman's ski with a more forward plate seems to be mounted for personal adjustment, someone wanted a little more tail. Will have some impact on how it skis, so take that into consideration. Bon chance!
 

JTurner

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I don't have the most accurate tools to measure, merely a ruler vs calipers, here is what I measured on 3 pairs of GS skis:

View attachment 182189
What dimensions are printed on those Rossi’s? The ones I have had from 2017-2019 say 101-65-81, and if that’s what yours say they’re measuring up quite a bit narrower in the shovel. But I do vaguely recall they changed at one point and some years may be different.
 

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