... kind of risk, deep buried weak layer cannot be mitigated unless you ski 20 degree terrain, and (SOME) clients don't want that...
... kind of risk, deep buried weak layer cannot be mitigated unless you ski 20 degree terrain, and (SOME) clients don't want that...
Yeah and I'd say it's more common still. You paid for the cat day. Everyone is going. It's probably fine. There's always a risk. Etc. Easy to fall into the trap. Most times nothing happens.Plus at that altitude they’re just...dumb. And ridiculously tired. If they’re not 100% committed to a cutoff before they go, I think they enter the Russian Roulette phase.
Very interesting article (although the title is kind of misleading)
The Inherent Dangers of Backcountry Skiing in Colorado’s Mountains
What can a fatal backcountry skiing accident on Jones Pass, on the west side of the Continental Divide, teach us about Colorado’s snowcat outfitters? And can these quintessential Centennial State adventures ever truly be safe?www.5280.com
Very good point.I will say that a guide apparently "forgetting" that a run is underneath a steep headwall (which the avy report has specifically advised guides to avoid) during a quite literally historic avalanche cycle is... concerning. You have to wonder how often similar mistakes like that are made but nothing happens so no one gives it a second thought.
The problem with saying something (paraphrased) like "things don't go wrong very often" or "it seemed fine when I went cat skiing" is that avalanches are inherently low feedback phenomena. Most of the time, even if you make terrible decisions, nothing bad happens. Just due to the general low probability of avalanches, nothing will happen on most runs whether you make the right decision or not. We as humans are terrible at learning in such an environment, and likewise terrible at evaluating other's decision make under such conditions because, after all, their decisions always seem to work out. Bruce Tremper pretty much beats this idea to death in Staying Alive in Avalanche Terrain.
I can't make any evaluation of whether these services are actually doing a good job or not. But just because things generally seem to work out doesn't necessarily mean the operation is really as safe as it seems.
I will say that a guide apparently "forgetting" that a run is underneath a steep headwall (which the avy report has specifically advised guides to avoid) during a quite literally historic avalanche cycle is... concerning. You have to wonder how often similar mistakes like that are made but nothing happens so no one gives it a second thought.
Yep, and this is something you can ask about before booking a trip: do you have a snow safety program where someone is logging snow conditions in your tenure every day? What qualifications does that person have? Experience? What are the certifications of your guides?This is all absolutely true. Where I make that judgment is in the sheer number of hours that these operations are out there: all day every day all season long. They are skiing much much more vertical than even a go-getter who is out there a couple days a week on foot. So, probability and all that. If an operation is logging that much time without incident, I feel pretty good about it.
Yep, and this is something you can ask about before booking a trip: do you have a snow safety program where someone is logging snow conditions in your tenure every day? What qualifications does that person have? Experience? What are the certifications of your guides?
Any reputable cat operation will have absolutely no problem answering such questions...
Mike