Individual Review Augment Skis -- Buyer Beware

[dovski]

I don't think anyone is questioning the quality of Augment skis and no one should be ranting about ski shops. I do however think that OP raises some legitimate customer service issues with regard to how Augment's US agent handled the situation. Let's be clear everyone makes mistakes and even the best quality brands have products that are defective. With skis it is also possible greatly impact their performance with a bad tune.

I believe OP got a pair of skis that at the very least had a bad factory tune. What I don't know is if the shop OP took his skis to corrected that or gave him anther bad tune, which is always possible, but the reality of the situation that this is not relevant. Augment told OP via email that they would replace the skis, had they followed through that would have been great customer service, instead they had the skis tuned and sent them back to OP and questioned OP's knowledge, this is bad customer service. At the very least they should have contacted OP and said hey we think we can fix these skis with a correct tune, let;s try that rather than replacing them. Had they done that I do not think we would be having this conversation today.

Clearly in @DocGKR's case they delivered great customer service, so not all bad. What I do think is interesting are the points @Muleski raised. This is a European craft specialty ski company. Their skis are distributed through an agent with limited resources and supply. With that in mind how do they provide proactive customer service and warranty replacements when needed. With my Arc'Teryx jacket, I need a knew Zipper pull. Arc'Teryx wants me to mail the jacket to them after which it will take close to a month for them to repair and send the jacket back to me - this is a long time so I am waiting until the end of ski season to do this. This is a North America based company, so can only imagine how much longer and complicated it must be for Augment.

 

[Muleski]

And, again, I don’t know what they are doing. I have great confidence in the product, “the material”, but there is more to it. I’d like to be a bit educated as to who and what Augment USA is. That’s all. Because it sounds very lean.

And yeah....challenging year for bringing any product into the USA.

 

[Muleski]

Interesting reading.....and at odds with a recent experience I had with Augment.

Bottom line--Augment USA did right and sent out a new pair of skis. I even offered to pay for the new pair and they would NOT take my money.

As a result, I will be purchasing more Augment skis--likely a lot more.

FWIW--the AM98's had the best tune I have ever seen on a pair of skis direct from the factory. Far better then some other recent custom and high end skis I have acquired that also have a 4 digit retail price.....

This is all very good to know. Encouraging. The fact that they replaced the skis....both were willing to do so, and had the skis to be able to do...is great. Still curious about "Augment USA," though.

 

[AngryAnalyst]

To the comment that "we are a small market for ski goods," who is "We?" If it's the United States, well....we are about 50% of the total global market. Not so small. In fact, the biggest market.

That part of my post wasn’t carefully thought out. I had it in my head that total US skier days were about the same as Austria or something and equipment sales were roughly inline. If Europe as a whole isn’t way bigger I stand corrected.

The rest - yes, that is more or less how I understood this to work (though you have a lot more detail than I do).

 

[ScotsSkier]

OK, I have been trying to stay out of this as I believe it is an issue that should be resolved between the involved parties and, without hearing from both sides, i am not going to comment in case anyone thinks I am conflicted.

However wrt quality. I have probably spent more time on and tested/raced/bought more Augment skis than most everyone here. I can say without doubt that every race ski I have had or tested has come with THE best tune out of the box of any race product, bar none! . And as @Muleski has pointed out I have had been fortunate enough to have owned a whole lot of different top end race skis including several ex world cup skis .

My Augment race skis have ALL come with a consistent .5/3 tune and great grind out of the box. No extra prep required. unlike for example Rossi/Dynastar (as well as most other brands) race stock which normally needs a grind and several hours of work first. (and typically an extra $150-200 to get a race ski set up right) In fact when my current race skis arrived last year they basically got a few coats of wax, 4 or 5 test runs and then straight into the race course, giving me 4 FIS International Masters podiums first time out. And the feedback and experiences of all the athletes who I have put on my skis and those who have bought them has been the same. So i have absolutely no qualms in vouching for the quality of the product. Will some come with a less than optimal tune? Well no matter how good the QC there is always likely to be some that escape that fall below the normal high standard.

And note also with the Augment race product what you are getting is the same quality and build ski as they are supplying to their supported athletes, including EC level. Not something most of us amateur tracers normally can access . (and there is a huge difference between skis built to this standard and what is sold as "race stock" by the big name brands.) Of course as has also been pointed out by @Muleski the smaller volume can potentially create other issues with getting replacements quickly if required. That is a decision for the buyer, no different than making the decision to buy a Porsche or Ferrari rather than a Corvette.

Now all the Augments I have had or skied have come with what is basically a race tune. including the all mountains. I like that. Perhaps not everyone does and some may want to detune or change the tune for their style. i much prefer that to a ski coming with a sloppy 2 degree base so i have to grind it first. And of course other than grinds i will do the tune myself so i know exactly what has been done.

I will say that, regardless of how he felt about the situation and the customer service, it would have been informative for all of us if Mike had at least tested the skis again after they were returned. i can understand why he hasn't but I know the quality of time that Podium produce and, if they had reset the ski to factory standards, it would have given a very simple comparison as to whether there was an issue with the ski or with the original tune. JMHO

 

[HardDaysNight]

Podium Ski Service in Park City is an excellent tuning resource used by racers and other very good skiers. The owner, Jeff Butz, with whom I have dealt for years, is top rate. If he evaluated the skis you can take what he said about them as fact!

 

[Mike Thomas]

If he evaluated the skis you can take what he said about them as fact!

The thing is, we have no idea what he said about the skis. We have what Augment USA said he said about them. Actually, we don't have that either. We have what Mike King says they said he said. See how ridiculous us speculating about something we don't have full information about is?

I also do not understand why the original ski, that was returned with a tune, wasn't skied. That bit of information about how they skied would really inform a lot.

 

[HardDaysNight]

Agree. I’m not speculating at all. Making the point that there actually are knowledgeable and trustworthy people in the industry. Jeff is one. Beyond that I really have no interest in this matter.

 

[Mike King]

I had the skis mounted. As we did so, we put a true bar on the base. The skis had no base bevel at all. They also may have had a slight dish in the center of the ski. I had them ground and base beveled.

I skied them in a fresh 3 inches on top of 6 inches from the previous day. Not the best conditions to determine if the grabby issues are gone. Perhaps I'll ski a couple of runs tomorrow on firmer conditions to see. They will most likely be put up for sale in the near future.

 

[Philpug]

Not the best conditions to determine if the grabby issues are gone. Perhaps I'll ski a couple of runs tomorrow on firmer conditions to see.

..then a few more runs the next day...then the following day again..then come to realize while there were some unfortunate hiccups along the way and you will come to appreciate what all the hype was about and all of this will be able to be put behind us all.

 

[Dakine]

..then a few more runs the next day...then the following day again..then come to realize while there were some unfortunate hiccups along the way and you will come to appreciate what all the hype was about and all of this will be able to be put behind us all.

Not quite.
Unless there is a decent stock at the US distributor, you would be a fool to order.
The first time the dog bites you it is the dog's fault.

 

[fatbob]

I had the skis mounted. As we did so, we put a true bar on the base. The skis had no base bevel at all. They also may have had a slight dish in the center of the ski. I had them ground and base beveled.

I skied them in a fresh 3 inches on top of 6 inches from the previous day. Not the best conditions to determine if the grabby issues are gone. Perhaps I'll ski a couple of runs tomorrow on firmer conditions to see. They will most likely be put up for sale in the near future.

To be honest you sound like a saint. Has the Augment dealer/ Augment USA not sent you the new pair you were promised? Just to be clear is this new dish/ lack of base bevel after the tune by Podium?

 

[fatbob]

..then a few more runs the next day...then the following day again..then come to realize while there were some unfortunate hiccups along the way and you will come to appreciate what all the hype was about and all of this will be able to be put behind us all.

Mmm...not really...not least because there seems to an awful keenness to play the nothing to see here card....

 

[Ken_R]

Fair warning but to me if ANY business starts down that kind of bullying (deeper pockets) path with individual consumers who have left actual honest reviews of their experience then they've opted out of my business for ever.

look what happened to Backcountry... it all went bad really quickly for them...

 

[Augment Skis]

What I find amazing is @Augment Skis Skis doesn't have a damn thing to say about all of this.

Whassup @Philpug?

@Dakine we haven't contributed to this conversation until now because we didn't know about this thread. We heard about it last week and asked for the link but never received it and our search turned up nothing.

Mike is a PSIA instructor and his grievances have been answered by us directly over the three weeks since he received his skis initially on March 24th. He has sent his skis back, we reviewed them, we took them to a reputable ski shop in Park City for a second opinion and determined that there was no manufacturer error given that the skis had the original edge thickness and the original grind. There was use on the base of the skis including a small dig and a fair bunch of scuff marks but our original grind was quite visible.

Since the March 24th delivery we were told that the skis were railed by 1/16th of an inch which is why we initially requested the return of the skis. Once received, the reality didn't seem to match given what I wrote above about original edge thickness and grind. Somewhere in their time in Colorado the edges had been tuned to a reverse bevel, according to the second opinion from the ski shop. We paid them to return the skis to the factory tune at 3 and 0.7 and to clean up the bases. We did not feel that this warranted a new pair of skis. Having many years of experience in the industry at one of the largest ski manufacturers and having a ski come back to "Warranty and Repair", get repaired and sent back to the customer, is standard operating procedure unless the skis have a known manufacturer defect. Since we could not see a known manufacturer defect, we had the skis serviced by a trusted ski shop, and returned them.

Coming from a PSIA instructor, this matter should have been kept private. Posting emails that were sent privately to him we believe is a gross violation of the trust between PSIA instructors and manufacturers. We are committed to excellent customer service. We have worked hard over the prior three weeks to make Mike happy as we strive to build this brand in North America. We are sensitive to good customer service and it was never our intention to upset Mike but we felt that we were doing the correct thing by servicing and returning the skis. As Augment Skis continues to grow through retail stores and direct to consumer it will always be our goal to match the best skis with the best customer service.

 

[Dakine]

@Dakine we haven't contributed to this conversation until now because we didn't know about this thread. We heard about it last week and asked for the link but never received it and our search turned up nothing.

Mike is a PSIA instructor and his grievances have been answered by us directly over the three weeks since he received his skis initially on March 24th. He has sent his skis back, we reviewed them, we took them to a reputable ski shop in Park City for a second opinion and determined that there was no manufacturer error given that the skis had the original edge thickness and the original grind. There was use on the base of the skis including a small dig and a fair bunch of scuff marks but our original grind was quite visible.

Since the March 24th delivery we were told that the skis were railed by 1/16th of an inch which is why we initially requested the return of the skis. Once received, the reality didn't seem to match given what I wrote above about original edge thickness and grind. Somewhere in their time in Colorado the edges had been tuned to a reverse bevel, according to the second opinion from the ski shop. We paid them to return the skis to the factory tune at 3 and 0.7 and to clean up the bases. We did not feel that this warranted a new pair of skis. Having many years of experience in the industry at one of the largest ski manufacturers and having a ski come back to "Warranty and Repair", get repaired and sent back to the customer, is standard operating procedure unless the skis have a known manufacturer defect. Since we could not see a known manufacturer defect, we had the skis serviced by a trusted ski shop, and returned them.

Coming from a PSIA instructor, this matter should have been kept private. Posting emails that were sent privately to him we believe is a gross violation of the trust between PSIA instructors and manufacturers. We are committed to excellent customer service. We have worked hard over the prior three weeks to make Mike happy as we strive to build this brand in North America. We are sensitive to good customer service and it was never our intention to upset Mike but we felt that we were doing the correct thing by servicing and returning the skis. As Augment Skis continues to grow through retail stores and direct to consumer it will always be our goal to match the best skis with the best customer service.

I can't imagine Jukka and company sending out a product as described by Mike.
My Austrian friends find the skis to be as good as can be.
Too bad I couldn't get a pair, but that's a whole other story.
Good luck next season!

 

[DocGKR]

In over 50 years of skiing, every ski I have received from various manufacturers has required some degree of work, be it minor to major, in order to be slope ready--except for Augment, which so far have exhibited the best tunes out of the box I have ever seen from a factory, bar none.

 

[fatbob]

@ Augment Skis

So did you or one of your staff agree to send Mike a new pair of skis or is he lying?

 

[Jwrags]

I have no dog in this fight and don’t know any of the parties but whether Mike is a PSIA instructor is irrelevant in my eyes other than for me to understand he is a knowledgeable skier. His publication of the email exchange was relevant to show what was said.

 

[Alexzn]

Sounds like there is no way now to evaluate whether the repaired skis were brought to a proper tune, so Mike is evaluating his local shop tuning at this point.