International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) Booking a trip for March 2022 to the Arlberg

[Sibhusky]

I just booked the plane tickets into Innsbruck, along with nights in Innsbruck after and before the flights to reduce the stress of travel (I get migraines.)

1. The plan is to take the train from Innsbruck to St. Anton. I looked at various shuttles and busses and just decided this would probably be the cheapest option. However, I have to research baggage issues - like skis. So, any enlightenment there would help.
2. I'm leaning towards Lech rather them St. Anton because I really want a lower key experience. I hate crowds, especially what I've seen of the end-of-day runs at St. Anton. But it's my daughter who is accompanying me and she likes terrain. I've suggested she go with a guide group a time or two, but don't know if that will satisfy her in Lech.
3. How hard is it to get from St. Anton to Lech? We'll have luggage, like I said. (As a fallback, I know we can rent skis, but I'm really picky about my tuning (and plan to bring my guides and stuff, not wax.). I can't imagine them tuning to my specs and actually being happy.) I get that there is a ski bus, but how compatible will that be with large luggage and a Skitube? Because of this issue, I start leaning back to just staying in St. Anton.
4. Any other comments welcome.

EDIT. Have now booked and paid for Lech. Have discovered I can take the train to Langer am Arlberg and it's a shorter trip to Lech.

 

[James]

@Nobody , @Jacob , @Cheizz ? And everyone else...

 

[Doug Briggs]

The times I was in Italy and used the train, we were on the cheap and it was in the late '90s. We had back packs, chest packs and carried our skis and gear. I was strong and prepared for roughing it to save lira. So we could pay guides.

Guides can really make a European trip special if you or your daughter want to go beyond the pistes. I've had guides with people from a single group getting the group rate and by having the guide put a group of smaller groups together.

 

[Sibhusky]

So you have to "put together" a group for a guide? I thought you just showed up and got put in a group. Additional thing to look into.

 

[James]

It can be that way- certainly in Chamonix. Verbier has one day per week of random groups. No idea about where you’re going.
Consider ski school also. Some places, the big distinction is guides can use ropes, instructors can’t. But these things are specific to country and area.

Ideally you would find a ski club or people going at the same time and maybe split a guide.

 

[Cheizz]

I have skied a few times in both St. Anton and Lech. However, all these times I had my own car to get around and didn't use any form of guide service. So on the topics of busses or guide groups I have no experience of my own. Nor have I ever tried to find out. I would suggest to start on the Lech website looking for information on the busses: https://www.lechzuers.com/en

For questions/suggestions about guided groups (if there are any), sign up for free on wepowder.com and ask on the forum. Lots of helpful people there with great experience in the Alps.

Edit:
I did some research (on the WePowder forum, amongst other places). There is at least one guiding company in St. Anton that has open freeride groups that you can join: http://pistetopowder.com/ski-guiding-stanton/#open-groups

 

[Sibhusky]

Now I know why I thought you just showed up - that's the website I'd been looking at.

 

[Jacob]

Innsbruck is a nice place for a couple of days of sightseeing. The old town is easily walkable, they’ve got venues like the ski jump arena, which is neat to see, and there’s a castle on the outskirts of town (not the best castle ever, but worth a look). So, I think you’ll like it there. They might even have their hockey or soccer team playing one of the days you’re there.

1. The train from Innsbruck to St Anton is a 1 hour straight shot with a couple of stops along the way. The wagons will have an area near the doors for larger items like bikes and skis. Some wagons will have them in the front and back, but some might only have them on one side. If the ticket office has reserved seats available, then I recommend paying the few extra euros for them just to save you the hassle of searching for available seats.

2. The crowds on the groomers in general tend to be a bit bigger in Lech, but they don’t really have the bottlenecks that St Anton has, so it’s probably better for you. Lech has a bit of fun terrain, but I think you’re daughter will enjoy Zurs and Warth-Schroecken more. The latter is surprisingly fun.

I don’t know about Lech, but St Anton has a couple of guide companies that form mixed groups. As @Cheizz already mentioned, there’s Piste to Powder, and the Arlberg Ski School has a Powder Club office on the main street. Lech will probably be the same.

3. The St Anton train station will have taxi vans right out front that can get you to Lech. If they’re too pricey, you just cross the river (more like a stream) and head to the left to get to the bus station. It’s about a 5-minute walk in dry conditions.

4. Buy your lift tickets the afternoon before your first ski day rather than the first morning. The lines at the ticket office are shorter in the afternoon. Both of you will probably enjoy Warth-Schroecken, so don’t forget to spend some time skiing that section.

Last, but most important, remember that Europeans bring down the safety bar almost as soon as their butts hit the chair. They’ll have their skis on the foot rest by the time the chair reaches the first tower immediately after the loading area. So when you sit down, don’t faff around. Get your back up against the back rest and your head up straight away. Also, don’t tuck your poles under your leg until you know for certain that the bubble isn’t coming down. And if you’re riding alone and you don’t pull the safety bar down fairly quickly, the lifties will give you a chance to test your German comprehension skills.

 

[Sibhusky]

Different topic, I came across a couple YouTube videos about the Langer Zug, supposedly the steepest run in Austria. I have to assume that means it's the steepest GROOMER. Has anyone skied it? It didn't look all that steep in the videos I saw. But GoPro's badly distort things like slope angles.

 

[Jacob]

I thought Harakiri in Mayrhofen was the steepest. But yeah, they’re talking groomers.

I might have skied it without knowing. I don’t pay too much attention to the groomers I’m on.

 

[Nobody]

No (recent) experience travelling in Italy by rail or by bus with skis equipment, alone. When I did it, I had no problems, bus store all luggages and skis in their store compartments, although mountain busses can have an extra external rack for skis intheir back (mostly for daily services). Trains can have extra compartments for large items liek skis, just ask atthe ticket office when you buy the ticket (they might charge you some extra...)
When I was in my teens, and up to my mid 20s, we used to take a weeklong vacation in the Dolomites and hire a bus for the group (in the golden age we reached two full busses of ppl). It was organized by the village sport club - "Tourism and freetime branch". Whole families used to come. The Bus(es) was taking us "up" ona Saturday, then leave us there and come up next Sat to take us home.
For the wholeweek we used to ski around Sellaronda and if need be, take public transportation or minivans to reach further away places...
Now that I mention this, alternatively there are smaller companies taxi or minivan offering to shuttle ppl from to places (airports and train stations, to/form Hotels). Check if your chosen hotel isn't offering this as a service (either included or extra to the room price)
I see that @James, @Cheizz and @Jacob have said it all already, anyway. And that you have booked for Lech
With regards to guiding...
As @James says either Guide offices or Ski Schools do offer guiding. The difference beign that a ski school instructor, as long as they do ont hold a Mountain Guide Licence, will most probably hold a Freeride Guide Licence.
Difference being, a Freeride Guide cannot take ppl up on a Glacier, will stick to lift systems and short hikes to reach a starting point, and usually won't skin up around unless for short and necessary parts of a tour. But, in any case in any station in the Alps ought to be enough routes where one can go off-pistes without the need to skin uphill for long times (and days...)

So you have to "put together" a group for a guide? I thought you just showed up and got put in a group. Additional thing to look into.

Depends, some people are not comfortable going out to ski with strangers, particularly off-piste. So, they team up with friends so to book a guide for themselves. If you don't mind, and actually take the opportunity to get to know otherpeople, you can just call in advance , even the evening before should be "in advance" enough ,any Guide Office (or ski school , for that matter) - I wouldn't definitely not "just show up there" unless previously agreed and ask what slots are free and what "tours" are on offer for which day, specifying how many of you are in your party.

 

[Jacob]

I forgot to mention one thing about Innsbruck airport: I recommend taking a taxi into town if you’re bringing skis.

The bus that runs between the airport and central train station is a standard city bus, so it can be a hassle when you’ve got a ski bag. But, I found the taxis at the airport and train station to be surprisingly reasonable the last time I flew there.

If you change your mind about taking your skis, then the bus is fine.

 

[Doug Briggs]

So you have to "put together" a group for a guide? I thought you just showed up and got put in a group. Additional thing to look into.

We were a group. There were about 30 of us. Enough people were interested in a guide to hire one for a reasonable per-person rate.

Other times the guide would have multiple clients (groups) in one tour.

 

[Lauren]

1. The plan is to take the train from Innsbruck to St. Anton. I looked at various shuttles and busses and just decided this would probably be the cheapest option. However, I have to research baggage issues - like skis. So, any enlightenment there would help.
2. I'm leaning towards Lech rather them St. Anton because I really want a lower key experience. I hate crowds, especially what I've seen of the end-of-day runs at St. Anton. But it's my daughter who is accompanying me and she likes terrain. I've suggested she go with a guide group a time or two, but don't know if that will satisfy her in Lech.
3. How hard is it to get from St. Anton to Lech? We'll have luggage, like I said. (As a fallback, I know we can rent skis, but I'm really picky about my tuning (and plan to bring my guides and stuff, not wax.). I can't imagine them tuning to my specs and actually being happy.) I get that there is a ski bus, but how compatible will that be with large luggage and a Skitube? Because of this issue, I start leaning back to just staying in St. Anton.
4. Any other comments welcome.

1. I have done trains from the Munich airport, change trains at the Munich Station, change again in Innsbruck, end up in St. Anton. We then took a taxi to our hotel (easy to grab one outside of the station). Though your airport/train transfer will be easier, I would recommend packing in a large backpack and a wheelie ski bag...avoid a rolling suitcase and a wheeling ski bag if you can (it becomes cumbersome to need to wheel multiple pieces of luggage). The lighter you pack, the easier train travel is.

2. Looks like you've already made the decision on Lech...but I came here to say if I did this trip again I would 100% stay in Lech. First off...the town itself is low key and absolutely adorable. Secondly, it's more centralized than St. Anton within the Arlberg Ski Area. Staying in St. Anton limited our possibilities of getting out to Warth or Zug (Lech was the farthest we skied to). I'll add that St. Anton is worth a visit though. You can spend the day skiing there, explore the town a bit, then take a bus back to Lech at the end of the day.

3. Looks like you've got this one covered already. I'll add that the busses are great to get from town to town during the ski day, but I'd take a taxi with luggage.

4. Couple Tips:
- Depending on when you're going, there might be some crowded runs and lifts. I got the tip before going that Stuben and Rendl are a couple areas that stay fairly low key (but with slower lifts). Both were amazing little areas with minimal crowds....Rendl was so good that we named our dog after it.
- The bus system is really easy and convenient to get from town to town. It allows you spend more of your day "travelling" by skis to other towns then taking the bus back at the end of the day.
- ETA: If you have the option of full board or half board...I would recommend 1/2. This will give you breakfast and dinner, but you can get lunch anywhere that you're skiing for that day. Tons of fantastic restaurants in all of the towns, we were never without a good meal at lunchtime.

 

[fatbob]

Looks like you've already got it covered. Taxi (actually minibus) from Langen probably easiest way to go to Lech but Postbus and ski buses are used to people with luggage anyway.

Skischools in St Anton definitely run pickup off piste/freeride groups. Assume it also happens in Lech but your hotelier would probably be your best source on that. Lech has a pretty tight network that way and a good hotelier can probably squeeze you into a group. There's lots of stuff scopable from lifts and the piste in any event but also places particularly on Rendl and in south facing aspects that you really need local knowledge because of micro nav consequences and/or glide cracks. The latter are not trivial as it warms up in March if there has been a decent snowpack.

My fave skiing there is probably the Stuben area - some great runs all the way to Langen off Albona and even the Verwallsee and bus back to St Anton. Plus of course the Star Wars run

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Snowheads is a reliable source for intel and in normal times has a decent throughput of people that you could generally find some folks to ski with.

 

[James]

Good to know about the pickup ski school groups. When I asked about that at the Adrenaline ski school in Verbier, right across from the gondola, they looked at me as if I was crazy. Really?? English wasn’t the issue. I want to join a group to ski off piste, what’s complicated? All they could offer me was going heli skiing. Bizarre.
Then I happened to ride the chair with one of their instructors so I asked him about off piste. There were very few places they couldn’t go. So now it made even less sense.

 

[Cheizz]

It's just not that common to have set group departures. You hire a guide, you don't book a place in a group. THat's how the guide thing works for 90% of the time in Europe.
In some freeride-heavy places there are organizations that offer group spots, but as I said: it's not common.

 

[Jacob]

Staying in St. Anton limited our possibilities of getting out to Warth or Zug (Lech was the farthest we skied to).

Now that the Flexenbahn lift is up and running, it’s easier to go between St. Anton and Zurs. Getting to Zug from Zurs is a bit difficult, because there’s only one route and it’s easy to miss your turn at one particular fork in the road. And getting to Warth-Schroecken from Zurs is unintuitive, because the fastest way is to go through Zug.

But because of the distance to Warth, you really have to be focused on getting there as fast as you can if you want to be able to spend some time over there before making your way back. So, you can’t really stop to take a break or a detour along the way.

 

[Lauren]

Now that the Flexenbahn lift is up and running, it’s easier to go between St. Anton and Zurs. Getting to Zug from Zurs is a bit difficult, because there’s only one route and it’s easy to miss your turn at one particular fork in the road. And getting to Warth-Schroecken from Zurs is unintuitive, because the fastest way is to go through Zug.

But because of the distance to Warth, you really have to be focused on getting there as fast as you can if you want to be able to spend some time over there before making your way back. So, you can’t really stop to take a break or a detour along the way.

I was there in 2017, so the Flexenbahn was running. It was either the first or second year after the opening. Getting to Zurs was definitely pretty easy…but still took 5 runs (ish) to get there. The day we went to Lech, the one run between Zurs and Lech was closed for avy danger, which complicated things (ended up taking the bus).

 

[Jacob]

I was there in 2017, so the Flexenbahn was running. It was either the first or second year after the opening. Getting to Zurs was definitely pretty easy…but still took 5 runs (ish) to get there. The day we went to Lech, the one run between Zurs and Lech was closed for avy danger, which complicated things (ended up taking the bus).

I was there in 2017 as well. Small world.

Looking at my trail map, it’s 6 lifts to get from the base in St Anton to the bottom of Zug and 3 more lifts to get from there to the closest part of Schroecken. Plus, a lot of miles on piste and plenty of chances for a wrong turn.