Boot fit and liner sleeve

vtmecheng

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Got my first pair of boots this last year and have been struggling to get a good fit. Boots are Atomic Hawx 100 prime. Foot is a solid 295 length but instep is 280 or 285, boot is a size 290-295. I have Sidas insoles in them, have had the liner heat molded, and had them punched to stop pain on the outside of my 5th metatarsal. My problem is that my smaller instep results is a bit more movement than I want. My foot can slightly lift and I need to adjust the bottom buckle to the last tooth and instep to the second to last.

Here’s my thoughts on options: a thin spacer under my insole (which I already own), a heal lift, something like the patriot liner sleeve (not sure if anyone has tried that and would love opinions), a tongue spacer, or I’m in the wrong boot. I haven’t found my local shop to have much good knowledge, everyone doing boot “fitting” is in high school. Thanks for your help.
 

Near Nyquist

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Your boot unfortunately has too much volume for your anatomy
You need to go to a bootfitter that actually knows their stuff
And no a high school kid won’t cut it

you can jam all the stuff you want inside that shell to make it work

But the fact is the boot has way too much volume for your low volume foot
 

Teumie

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I found my liners to somehow get thinner (i guess it is normal by use) and got one of the 'space reducers' (basically a solid sole you put under your liner).
For me it works, although it only impacts the foot volume (i.e. the bottom 2 buckles), not the leg volume (i.e. top 2 buckles).

I do find that I need stiffer boots as my skill has been improving steadily as well, but that is another issue altogether :cool:

I realise people always say "go to a proper boot fitter" but depending where you are, that may not be feasible (I know for me it is a challenge)
 
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vtmecheng

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I am going to try another fitter here but we will see. Talking with him on the phone and explaining it all, his first thought was to try a boot board shim. Also, I’m 6’4” and thin. Almost all boots stop before the real meat of my calf. Because of this he is thinking a spoiler may actually be good so that it acts like my calf would, keeping my leg forward where it was designed. Again, just some thoughts before he does a full assessment in person.
 

AmyPJ

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Does the liner have a removable tongue? If so, Atomic makes tongues in different volumes that can be swapped out and might address your issue. Most fitters I believe will fit your instep vs. your foot length, and adapt the boot shell accordingly. If you like the boot otherwise, then the higher volume tongue could do the trick.
 
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vtmecheng

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My liner does not have the replaceable tongue option. Out of curiosity, how much can the toe length and forefoot width of a boot be punched out? My right big toe already just doesn’t touch the boot front once I get the heel back and tightened, it does before I do. I also had to have the boots punched out at the forefoot already. A size smaller would have required a lot of extra room. From forefoot on and I understand there is a limit.
 

AmyPJ

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My liner does not have the replaceable tongue option. Out of curiosity, how much can the toe length and forefoot width of a boot be punched out? My right big toe already just doesn’t touch the boot front once I get the heel back and tightened, it does before I do. I also had to have the boots punched out at the forefoot already. A size smaller would have required a lot of extra room. From forefoot on and I understand there is a limit.
Depends on the boot. One size down from what you measure is not much.

A competent fitter can also pad the tongue all the way down above your instep to help snug that down since the tongues are not removable, with the added benefit of holding your foot back even deeper into the heel pocket.
 
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vtmecheng

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Depends on the boot. One size down from what you measure is not much.

A competent fitter can also pad the tongue all the way down above your instep to help snug that down since the tongues are not removable, with the added benefit of holding your foot back even deeper into the heel pocket.
I was unable to meet with the ew boot fitter today due to health reasons but spoke with him again. He mentioned that we will likely add a thin instep pad and 1/16 board shim to tighten things down, assuming it isn’t just a lost cause.
 

Tony S

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My liner does not have the replaceable tongue option. Out of curiosity, how much can the toe length and forefoot width of a boot be punched out? My right big toe already just doesn’t touch the boot front once I get the heel back and tightened, it does before I do. I also had to have the boots punched out at the forefoot already. A size smaller would have required a lot of extra room. From forefoot on and I understand there is a limit.
A different boot model that has the same internal length can have much different volume characteristics, in different parts of the shell. In my case I'm always looking for one with very low volume around the lower cuff buckle. Some work, some don't. Part of the value of an expert fitter is that s/he can make recommendations for models whose idiosyncrasies align with your foot's idiosyncrasies.
 
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vtmecheng

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A different boot model that has the same internal length can have much different volume characteristics, in different parts of the shell. In my case I'm always looking for one with very low volume around the lower cuff buckle. Some work, some don't. Part of the value of an expert fitter is that s/he can make recommendations for models whose idiosyncrasies align with your foot's idiosyncrasies.
I hear you and wish that had been the case with the person helping me when I purchased. I’d really like to keep from dropping even more money for a few years so hopefully we can make what I have work for the short term. The season isn’t long here in PA and this year has been horrible so it’s not worth spending tons on skiing.
 

KingGrump

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The Atomic Hawx prime is a fairly wide boot. Going by the your instep sizing, I would say you are in the wrong boot. Gong to be an uphill battle.

One of the best boot fitter in NA is Greg Hoffman. He is currently at Ski Boot Fitting located in SnowCreek Mountain Sports (Snowshoe, WV). Well worth a visit.
 

cantunamunch

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. The season isn’t long here in PA and this year has been horrible so it’s not worth spending tons on skiing.

Yeh, I'm not really buying your argument.

A VT Mech Engineer who actually believed that would have put duct tape shims on his feet by now :D
 
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vtmecheng

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The Atomic Hawx prime is a fairly wide boot. Going by the your instep sizing, I would say you are in the wrong boot. Gong to be an uphill battle.

One of the best boot fitter in NA is Greg Hoffman. He is currently at Ski Boot Fitting located in SnowCreek Mountain Sports (Snowshoe, WV). Well worth a visit.
Snowshoe is about 4 hours away. That would be a challenging one to justify to my wife.
Yeh, I'm not really buying your argument.

A VT Mech Engineer who actually believed that would have put duct tape shims on his feet by now :D
I actually cut some board shims out of the flat sides of a cat litter box today. They are 1/16” thick and fit perfectly. Seems like that does help. Maybe a thin instep pad and a spoiler to take up cuff room since my calf is mostly above the boot and I could have something. I tried shims where spoilers would be and that made a massive difference in the cuff fit.

In the end, these probably aren’t the best boot for my foot but the store “boot fit guarantee” probably doesn’t include swapping out even lightly used boots.
 

AmyPJ

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@cantunamunch, he took your duct tape challenge and one upped with a litter box!
And I thought I was the ultimate boot MacGuyver! @vtmecheng you'll fit right in around here. :ogbiggrin:
 

cantunamunch

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KingGrump

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Snowshoe is about 4 hours away. That would be a challenging one to justify to my wife.

My boot fitter for the last 40+ years had always been 4 hours away. I have had friends nd family traveled from much farther away to get their boots fitted.
One of my ski buddy had just ordered a boot for next season and will fly in from California early season to get it fitted. A good fitter can not be underestimated.
 

cantunamunch

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One of my ski buddy had just ordered a boot for next season and will fly in from California early season to get it fitted. A good fitter can not be underestimated.

His wife will reach this understanding, but probably not this season.
 

Rod9301

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Depends on the boot. One size down from what you measure is not much.

A competent fitter can also pad the tongue all the way down above your instep to help snug that down since the tongues are not removable, with the added benefit of holding your foot back even deeper into the heel pocket.
And you can pad the tongue yourself, really easy.
 

Rod9301

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Snowshoe is about 4 hours away. That would be a challenging one to justify to my wife.

I actually cut some board shims out of the flat sides of a cat litter box today. They are 1/16” thick and fit perfectly. Seems like that does help. Maybe a thin instep pad and a spoiler to take up cuff room since my calf is mostly above the boot and I could have something. I tried shims where spoilers would be and that made a massive difference in the cuff fit.

In the end, these probably aren’t the best boot for my foot but the store “boot fit guarantee” probably doesn’t include swapping out even lightly used boots.
A cuff spoiler will increase the forward lean of the boot, better to pad the tongue
 
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