International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) Chile/Argentina 2017

[jimtransition]

As there's a thread for Aus/NZ, I thought I would start the South America stoke here! There was a good snowfall in the central andes last week, and it's 5 weeks until Portillo opens, can't wait. Anyone else headed down there this season?

 

[coskigirl]

I'm headed to Valle Nevado in August. Can't wait!

 

[dave-o]

Yes! got my flights to SCL in August, but not decided where to go yet.

On the old Epic thread Tony Crocker used to give some analysis on SA snowfall in comparison to NA, is he still around?

 

[dbostedo]

Yes! got my flights to SCL in August, but not decided where to go yet.

On the old Epic thread Tony Crocker used to give some analysis on SA snowfall in comparison to NA, is he still around?

Yep.. paging @TonyC

 

[TonyC]

We now have the first example of my needing to find something in Epic downloads rather than reinventing the wheel answering a question. Fortunately I found this, posted 4 months ago:

Do NOT advance book skiing in South America for July:
1) Holiday pricing and crowds like Christmas here. Possibly worse because the lift infrastructure is not as modern.
2) Snowfall is a more extreme version of the Sierra: extremely erratic with huge dumps preceded or followed by weeks of clear skies and zero precipitation. You can be looking at bare ground in early July. Waiting until farther into the winter increases the odds of one of those dumps happening before you get there.

So the time to take a chance on advance booking is August to early September. But I would increase the odds a little by waiting until June/early July before committing $$$ to see that adequate snow is on the ground, especially since the last above average season was 2009. That drought is as severe (some seasons less than half normal snow) and now nearly twice as long as the Sierra drought of 2012-2015.

My take on the major S American ski areas:

• Bariloche: Never been. Clearly best resort town and scenery. Least reliable snow by far, leeward of the Andes Crest with partial sunny exposure, low altitude so frequently gets rain on the lower slopes. Good terrain reputation when everything is open, which is not often.
• Las Lenas (skied 2005, 2015): Best lift served expert skiing in the western Hemisphere when Marte lift is running and terrain is adequately covered. Marte serves 80% of the terrain but runs about 40% of the time due to extreme exposure to wind and weather. Are you feeling lucky? Snow is often abundant up high but intermediate slopes are low for its 35 degree latitude and east facing. The hotels and lifts date to the mid-1980's with minimal updates since then.
• Portillo (skied 2007): well known and run like a cruise ship with everything included in one hotel (no town). Operated by 3 generations of the American Purcell family, which means more competently than anywhere else in South America. Medium size and advanced weighted (think Taos or Alyeska), not a large area to spend an entire week especially for intermediates and beginners.
• Valle Nevado, La Parva, El Colorado (skied 2007): 3 ski areas tenuously interconnected. Best by far for beginners and intermediates, very little advanced terrain unless you go sidecountry out of bounds. The 3 areas are not that cooperative so you have to buy an upgrade ticket if you want to ski more than one of them. Nearly all of the international hotel lodging is at Valle Nevado, which by the way is at 9,900 feet if you are altitude sensitive. High altitude climate is similar to Portillo and Las Lenas but Valle Nevado gets about 3/4 as much snow as either of those.
• Chillan: Never been. Definitely gets the most snow but last year was a bad one there. Lower than Portillo/Valle Nevado so can get some rain. Bigger than Portillo and better terrain mix than Valle Nevado. Put that together with the snow and some people like MadPatSki say it's their favorite South American area. Clearly subject to erratic South American management: in-season information is very hard to come by. There's a nice hotel at the base but most visitors seem to stay down valley in Las Trancas and commute.

The good news is that there was a 2 foot storm in the high central Andes (Portillo, Valle Nevado, Las Lenas) earlier this week and more snow is predicted next week. There is already hype to book now, and I'm sure some people are doing that. Nonetheless I would wait another month for some more snow before deciding to commit any advance $$$.

If you're flying to SCL, I would really hold off on reserving lodging. Maintain your flexibility among Portillo, Valle Nevado group and Chillan as long as possible. Chillan is 6 hours drive or train ride south of Santiago, so its weather is somewhat independent from Portillo/Valle Nevado.

 

[Bigtinnie]

^^^^^^
TonyC is such a wealth of information, facts, figures , stats and research you'd swear he was an actuary or something in a former life.

 

[dave-o]

TonyC, thank you kindly Sir!
I regularly read the SA updates on Epic.

This is what I'm planning, I knew I'd seen it somewhere!

If you're flying to SCL, I would really hold off on reserving lodging. Maintain your flexibility among Portillo, Valle Nevado group and Chillan as long as possible. Chillan is 6 hours drive or train ride south of Santiago, so its weather is somewhat independent from Portillo/Valle Nevado.

 

[TonyC]

I regularly read the SA updates on Epic.

Let's hope that Casey, who actually lives in Chile, figures out to post here.

 

[coskigirl]

La Parva is opening this Friday!

 

[coskigirl]

Valle Nevado and El Colorado are also opening tomorrow. Looks like Valle Nevado will have a powder day. They are reporting 119cm so far this season with a 60cm base. They are opening a month early to day skiers, the hotel will not be open yet. Crossing my fingers that this continues...

 

[Started at 53]

I want to ski Valle Nevado, maybe next year.

 

[jimtransition]

We now have the first example of my needing to find something in Epic downloads rather than reinventing the wheel answering a question. Fortunately I found this, posted 4 months ago:

Do NOT advance book skiing in South America for July:
1) Holiday pricing and crowds like Christmas here. Possibly worse because the lift infrastructure is not as modern.
2) Snowfall is a more extreme version of the Sierra: extremely erratic with huge dumps preceded or followed by weeks of clear skies and zero precipitation. You can be looking at bare ground in early July. Waiting until farther into the winter increases the odds of one of those dumps happening before you get there.

So the time to take a chance on advance booking is August to early September. But I would increase the odds a little by waiting until June/early July before committing $$$ to see that adequate snow is on the ground, especially since the last above average season was 2009. That drought is as severe (some seasons less than half normal snow) and now nearly twice as long as the Sierra drought of 2012-2015.

My take on the major S American ski areas:

• Bariloche: Never been. Clearly best resort town and scenery. Least reliable snow by far, leeward of the Andes Crest with partial sunny exposure, low altitude so frequently gets rain on the lower slopes. Good terrain reputation when everything is open, which is not often.
• Las Lenas (skied 2005, 2015): Best lift served expert skiing in the western Hemisphere when Marte lift is running and terrain is adequately covered. Marte serves 80% of the terrain but runs about 40% of the time due to extreme exposure to wind and weather. Are you feeling lucky? Snow is often abundant up high but intermediate slopes are low for its 35 degree latitude and east facing. The hotels and lifts date to the mid-1980's with minimal updates since then.
• Portillo (skied 2007): well known and run like a cruise ship with everything included in one hotel (no town). Operated by 3 generations of the American Purcell family, which means more competently than anywhere else in South America. Medium size and advanced weighted (think Taos or Alyeska), not a large area to spend an entire week especially for intermediates and beginners.
• Valle Nevado, La Parva, El Colorado (skied 2007): 3 ski areas tenuously interconnected. Best by far for beginners and intermediates, very little advanced terrain unless you go sidecountry out of bounds. The 3 areas are not that cooperative so you have to buy an upgrade ticket if you want to ski more than one of them. Nearly all of the international hotel lodging is at Valle Nevado, which by the way is at 9,900 feet if you are altitude sensitive. High altitude climate is similar to Portillo and Las Lenas but Valle Nevado gets about 3/4 as much snow as either of those.
• Chillan: Never been. Definitely gets the most snow but last year was a bad one there. Lower than Portillo/Valle Nevado so can get some rain. Bigger than Portillo and better terrain mix than Valle Nevado. Put that together with the snow and some people like MadPatSki say it's their favorite South American area. Clearly subject to erratic South American management: in-season information is very hard to come by. There's a nice hotel at the base but most visitors seem to stay down valley in Las Trancas and commute.

The good news is that there was a 2 foot storm in the high central Andes (Portillo, Valle Nevado, Las Lenas) earlier this week and more snow is predicted next week. There is already hype to book now, and I'm sure some people are doing that. Nonetheless I would wait another month for some more snow before deciding to commit any advance $$$.

If you're flying to SCL, I would really hold off on reserving lodging. Maintain your flexibility among Portillo, Valle Nevado group and Chillan as long as possible. Chillan is 6 hours drive or train ride south of Santiago, so its weather is somewhat independent from Portillo/Valle Nevado.

Definitely agree with most of this (I have worked at Portillo the last 6 seasons), I will say that some seasons July is epic, last season it had the best skiing by far. The July holiday crowds are also really not that bad, there are almost never any lift lines in Portillo.

 

[Cryptica]

Hi, new here after migrating over from Epic Ski. Have been going every August for many years to either Valle Nevado, Portillo, Chillan, Bariloche or Ushuaia and past several years, conditions have been hit or miss.
But ever hopeful, heading back to Valle Nevado in August.
If anybody is considering a Valle Nevado trip this season, go to their website: they have a really good promotion for August. You need to book your trip by June 22: BUY 5 NIGHTS & GET 2 NIGHTS FREE.
http://www.vallenevado.com/en/buy-5-night-and-get-2-free-promo/

 

[TonyC]

Portillo does not get much business beyond the relatively low capacity of the hotel. Therefore it makes sense that even during the July holidays lift lines are not an issue. The flip side of course is that the low capacity of the hotel makes Portillo by far the most expensive South America ski destination.

It is also true that Valle Nevado is where you can score lodging deals and have flexibility on length of stay. But Valle Nevado is severely lacking in lift accessible steep terrain, so advanced/expert skiers may not want to spend a whole week there.

 

[Jully]

Portillo does not get much business beyond the relatively low capacity of the hotel. Therefore it makes sense that even during the July holidays lift lines are not an issue. The flip side of course is that the low capacity of the hotel makes Portillo by far the most expensive South America ski destination.

It is also true that Valle Nevado is where you can score lodging deals and have flexibility on length of stay. But Valle Nevado is severely lacking in lift accessible steep terrain, so advanced/expert skiers may not want to spend a whole week there.

Do you have a north american resort that you can use as a comparison to Valle Nevado's terrain level? How not steep are we talking?

 

[neonorchid]

Valle Nevado and El Colorado are also opening tomorrow. Looks like Valle Nevado will have a powder day. They are reporting 119cm so far this season with a 60cm base. They are opening a month early to day skiers, the hotel will not be open yet. Crossing my fingers that this continues...

Are you going? Can you and @jimtransition make it a PugSki gathering, organize it and be our guide? I for one would be interested.

 

[coskigirl]

Are you going? Can you and @jimtransition make it a PugSki gathering, organize it and be our guide? I for one would be interested.

Funny you should ask today, I just paid my deposit and confirmed this afternoon. I am going in mid-August with a friend and meeting up with a local friend that I've known since I was 14. While I certainly would happy to meet and ski with fellow pugski members I certainly wouldn't be qualified as a guide.

 

[jimtransition]

Funny you should ask today, I just paid my deposit and confirmed this afternoon. I am going in mid-August with a friend and meeting up with a local friend that I've known since I was 14. While I certainly would happy to meet and ski with fellow pugski members I certainly wouldn't be qualified as a guide.

Did you end up booking Valle? Happy to show people a bit of Portillo if I am free!

 

[coskigirl]

Did you end up booking Valle? Happy to show people a bit of Portillo if I am free!

Yes, there wasn't a debate there for me. I'm not doing a full week and Portillo didn't have a mini week the dates I'll be there. In addition, my friend has a condo at El Colorado so I want to be close enough to see her. Portillo is still on my bucket list but it will have to wait until after law school.

 

[jimtransition]

Yes, there wasn't a debate there for me. I'm not doing a full week and Portillo didn't have a mini week the dates I'll be there. In addition, my friend has a condo at El Colorado so I want to be close enough to see her. Portillo is still on my bucket list but it will have to wait until after law school.

Cool! Definitely check out the Santa Teresa area in between El Colorado and Valle if you like backcountry. And Chimenea in La Parva is a classic!