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Comparing the 2024 Boa Boots Offerings from Atomic, Fischer, K2 and Salomon

Philpug

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The above video is an overview of what models are offered from all four brands for the coming season.

ATOMICMODELS.png

Atomic will be focusing on the Hawx Ultra XTD in mens and womens models. The Haux Ultra XTD's are only 98mm last of the four brands being offered for next year.

FISCHERMODELS.png

Fischer will be offereing BOA on their RC4 line with the most attention being focused on the Pro MV which is the only boot BOA or not that is being offered with a Zipfit liner. The Fischer will be a medium volume 100 mm last

BOAFISCHERMOD.png

K2 will have the most extensive collection in mens and womens and also not only in Recon/Anthem but Mindbender sidecountry boots. All of K2's boots will also be 100mm last, but as I have found in the past with K2's boots, they are shaped very well in the shell.

SALOMONMODELS.png

Salomon will also be offereing 100 mm lasts their S/Pro Supra. With Salomon's Custom Shell, these are designed to go up to 104mm when heated properly.
 

Dwight

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Good stuff. I already ski the Atomic Ultra Hawk. Looks like boa option might be my next boot. Local retailer was getting the Atomic in a 27.5 for himself and offered to let me try it. My current is 26.5 and getting packed out, so looks like pro deal for next year. :)
 

Yo Momma

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I'll need to wait a few yrs to try them out as 102+ lasts are few. My current boots set up initially by a MasterFit bootfitter are 100 - 106 mm Last. Hopefully an expert BOA "Coach level boot" will be on the scene in the future.
 

Wasatchman

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@Philpug how important do you think this BOA development is? It makes sense but at the time aren't the first two buckle adjustments pretty minor in terms of the overall fit of a boot` Are any race boots adopting the technology?
 

James

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I have a feeling we’re stuck with Boa for a long time. Not saying it’s good or bad.
 

onenerdykid

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It makes sense but at the time aren't the first two buckle adjustments pretty minor in terms of the overall fit of a boot
While not directed to me, I'd like to weigh in on this specific point (take my opinion as a manufacturer spec'ing BOA as you will). Yes- every boot fitter should instruct their customer to buckle their properly fit shell on a loose tension (just enough to close the water sealing). This will always be true. Why?, and why not go more? Because buckles create pressure points once a certain closing force is reached. Over tightening buckles leads to collapsed areas of the shell (especially the instep) and this causes pain, discomfort, restricted blood flow etc. This is because buckles wrap the shell but only to a certain extent- wrapping happens, then the shell collapses inward. This does not happen with BOA. The shell continues to wrap, not collapse. Of course, at some point it will become too tight but honestly it still feels more comfortable than a maxed-out buckle.

The ultimate reason why position 1 & 2 buckle adjustments are pretty minor is because doing anything more gets too uncomfortable too quickly. There is a far bigger "tension" sweet spot with the BOA system before it becomes too much.
 
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Philpug

Philpug

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Are any race boots adopting the technology?
Race boot ... race boot ... race boot... How can it be any good and know it it really works unless they use in on a race boot. :rolleyes: What does it matter if its used on a race boot? How do racers close their lower buckles? The clamp them down with a ton of pressure. Well that goes againt everything we say for a good/proper fit of a boot, the lower buckles just need to be finger tight. Does that mean racers are in ill fitting boots? No. Can the BOA be tightened for a racer, sure. Oh ... you will boot out with the snow hitting the BOA knob. Sorry, wrong again. Racers will hit a traditional buckle on a high edge angle well before the BOA.

The whole arguement that it isn't viable because its not used on race boots is laughable. What are the most popular bindings today, Look Pivot, Marker Squire/Griffon/Jester, Tyrolia Attack and Salomon Sth/warden/Strive, what do all of these have in common? Thats right, none are used in race applications (Yes, I know some were, but not in todays environment). Sorry to rant but that is the question that comes up here and other social media groups/sites by the luddites and it's completely irrelevant, there is a ton of great products out there that have zero race influence or are race derived.

With all that said, I hear there are some brands playing with BOA on their race shells ;)
 

Wasatchman

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Race boot ... race boot ... race boot... How can it be any good and know it it really works unless they use in on a race boot. :rolleyes: What does it matter if its used on a race boot? How do racers close their lower buckles? The clamp them down with a ton of pressure. Well that goes againt everything we say for a good/proper fit of a boot, the lower buckles just need to be finger tight. Does that mean racers are in ill fitting boots? No. Can the BOA be tightened for a racer, sure. Oh ... you will boot out with the snow hitting the BOA knob. Sorry, wrong again. Racers will hit a traditional buckle on a high edge angle well before the BOA.

The whole arguement that it isn't viable because its not used on race boots is laughable. What are the most popular bindings today, Look Pivot, Marker Squire/Griffon/Jester, Tyrolia Attack and Salomon Sth/warden/Strive, what do all of these have in common? Thats right, none are used in race applications (Yes, I know some were, but not in todays environment). Sorry to rant but that is the question that comes up here and other social media groups/sites by the luddites and it's completely irrelevant, there is a ton of great products out there that have zero race influence or are race derived.

With all that said, I hear there are some brands playing with BOA on their race shells ;)
Sorry if I touched a nerve, Phil. The way I tell if something is rad enough for me to use is if 1) Candide Thovex endorses it, or 2) if it used by ski racers, preferably atop several podiums). If it labeled Ski Magazine gear of the year then I also *might* consider it.
 

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Sorry if I touched a nerve, Phil. The way I tell if something is rad enough for me to use is if 1) Candide Thovex endorses it, or 2) if it used by ski racers, preferably atop several podiums). If it labeled Ski Magazine gear of the year then I also *might* consider it.
This means you should own Peak Skis and Scarpa boots!
Faction is out because Candide is out.
You’ll have to settle for pants.
5198D529-E4D2-45CD-91A0-BA03710A3B82.jpeg
 
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Philpug

Philpug

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Sorry if I touched a nerve, Phil. The way I tell if something is rad enough for me to use is if 1) Candide Thovex endorses it, or 2) if it used by ski racers, preferably atop several podiums). 3) If it labeled Ski Magazine gear of the year then I also *might* consider it.
Its not you, it is just an accumulation of straw-man arguments from either miss or speculative information and I am getting tired of it. LOL.

1. The only one that skis like Candide is Candide. Its on par with someone walking into a shop looking for skis and the young sales person says" This is a great ski, it is what Candide skis..." Well I don't ski like Candide. IMHO, it is irrelevant what a pro endorses.
2. Why? What racers actually ski has very little to with consumer grade products.
3. Ad dollars at work.
 
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James

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Honestly, if someone came along in the liftline and said they could install the Boa system “while you wait”, I’d go for it. The micro adjustment would be nice, plus releasing it with just a push of the pole. I assume that’s possible?

First notch on my lower buckles is generally fine. Two is too much usually. Yeah I could sit there twirling four bales, but then you have to do it again going back. Just not going to happen.

Is it possible on that Boa knob to indicate how much tension you put on so you can quickly repeat it? That would save some fiddling and quickly repeating a setting would be nice. Maybe you just mark the cable going in?
 

coskigirl

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On the color, I'm seeing that it's available in a different colorway and that some stores appear to have both. Did they change it up for production? Are they both actually available?


 

otto

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BOA will not end up in race boots because it does not perform better for the needs of that aspect of the sport. You do not need to be a big thinker to understand that concept. I am 65 years old and come from a ski racing background. What that means in the context of BOA is that I look for boots with materials and fit that help me as a 65 year old ex ski racer to capture the working edge of a ski so that I can feel the power, grip and acceleration that I learned and knew as a younger man. The BOA is just another gidget that will match many of the dumbed down for the uninitiated of the market that cannot tell the difference between a ski that is meant to grind on a cement curb better than it holds an edge on boilerplate.

WARNING... My opinion on BOA is brutal, and it runs contrary to all the smoke that is being blown up your collective butts on the internet about BOA!!!! And then for those that know me well understand that one of my favorite things to do in my spare time is poke the bear . . .

I have had the opportunity to ski on and test all of the 130 flex offerings as well as a few 110 flex models of the brands that Phil laid out at the start of this thread. For those of you that know my background in the ski business, there will be a level of understanding as to my thoughts on BOA.

I can say without fear of contradiction BOA brings nothing to the ski boot business. I know that this is one of the forums that will bring the newest, freshest products into view, however just because you read about it here first does not mean that there is value for our sport. Is it more convenient? Is it able to individualize the tension between the toe buckle and instep buckle? Can you easily release the knob at the bottom of the lift or on the lift with your gloves on? Is it a benefit if you are a boot fitting specialist that can no longer open up the lower boot with a boot spreader to be able to mark, punch, or grind the boot to solve fit problems? Does your foot appreciate both sides of the shell pulled in evenly to the foot? Since the answer to the last 5 questions is no, then why would there be equipment experts out here singing the praises of an add-on piece of marketing whizbangery, that raises the price of the product, cuts into the profitability of the boot manufacturers, and does not bring game improvement to our sport. So far all I have seen from the naysayers is that durability has not been proven yet. To that question, my response is who cares whether it is durable or not. My argument would be that I hope that it is not durable so we won't have to be infected by its uselessness. If it is durable, you as the end user will get to suffer through it's uselessness for a long time!

BOA is a cancer that will eat the boot business from the inside out. BOA is not any of the brands that Phil has written about. The better article will be the one that lays out the best new boots for 2023/2024 without BOA. Those are the boots from the companies that got the full court press from BOA and politely said, "No, we will not allow you to have control over our product development by:" 1. Buying BOA mechanisms and BOA designed and integrated guides and attachment methods at BOA's asking price. 2. Adapting our already developed successful models that fit well and ski well, and modify the wall thicknesses and materials of those models to accommodate your research on what it takes to get BOA to functionally work the way BOA designed it to work. BOA will have their teeth into the design process that has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the fit as well as the quality of the products to perform better. So who wins when the suppliers roll over and sell their souls to BOA? Simply put BOA wins. Just like in politics the key to sussing out conspiracy is to follow the trail of the money. BOA will be the big winner as ski boots suppliers use marketing tactics to convince the market that they have built a better mouse trap. When in fact all they have done is take boots that may fit and ski well and simply attach a gimmick that brings no essential benefit to the sport of skiing. Like heat moldable shells give the false promise of a boot that has multiple volume possibilities and will still ski the same as it did out of the box, BOA is being falsely promoted as a mechanism that can make improperly fit ski boots fit better. Simply not true!

As a side note the boot test I was attending was heavily attended by the boot brands marketers, test teams, and product managers. Two of the most powerful brands that are pushers of the BOA concept did not have any representation to be able to compare BOA boots to non BOA boots. I suppose that it is easier to tell a fib when you have not done your work, then if you had carnal knowledge of how your own BOA products fit and skied against the non BOA products of the other brands or of your own non BOA boots.

Advice to the industry... just keep guessing, nevermind actually doing any actual research and development!!!
 
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Philpug

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@otto it is hard to disagree with much of you wrote, I have to agree and I don't think I have written anything contrary to this is, BOA will not makle a boot that doesn't fit, fit. It is not going to make or break a boot fit and I would not hold off on a purchase based on BOA. I think the same could be said about GripWalk, the energy put into both of these "advancements" to use the word loosely, could have been used better elsewhere.

I DO think that brands are doubling down on it and we will see it on boots, these four brands and some others, for the foreseeable (5-7 years) future.
 
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Philpug

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On the color, I'm seeing that it's available in a different colorway and that some stores appear to have both. Did they change it up for production? Are they both actually available?


Both will be available
 

charlier

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With narrow feet, I will have to stay with Atomic Hawx Ultra buckle 4 buckle boots. With a 96mm boot last, a Boa might work. Regardless, the Boa will help a subset of people for a snug fitting boot.
 
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onenerdykid

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The better article will be the one that lays out the best new boots for 2023/2024 without BOA. Those are the boots from the companies that got the full court press from BOA and politely said, "No, we will not allow you to have control over our product development by:" 1. Buying BOA mechanisms and BOA designed and integrated guides and attachment methods at BOA's asking price. 2. Adapting our already developed successful models that fit well and ski well, and modify the wall thicknesses and materials of those models to accommodate your research on what it takes to get BOA to functionally work the way BOA designed it to work. BOA will have their teeth into the design process that has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the fit as well as the quality of the products to perform better. So who wins when the suppliers roll over and sell their souls to BOA? Simply put BOA wins. Just like in politics the key to sussing out conspiracy is to follow the trail of the money. BOA will be the big winner as ski boots suppliers use marketing tactics to convince the market that they have built a better mouse trap. When in fact all they have done is take boots that may fit and ski well and simply attach a gimmick that brings no essential benefit to the sport of skiing. Like heat moldable shells give the false promise of a boot that has multiple volume possibilities and will still ski the same as it did out of the box, BOA is being falsely promoted as a mechanism that can make improperly fit ski boots fit better. Simply not true!
You're fully entitled to your own opinion and no one doubts your experience. And while you definitely bring up some valid points/concerns, I will absolutely call BS on the claim that other brands turned BOA down for 23/24. That is 100% false. BOA only offered the new system to brands that were existing BOA partners- Atomic, Salomon, Fischer, K2. That means Nordica, Tecnica, Lange, Head, Dalbello, etc. weren't even invited to the party, let alone given the opportunity to refuse a dance. So if any of them are saying they stood up to evil BOA and nobly rejected it to preserve their independence in year one, they are lying to you. They're just bitter and I know for a fact that a certain Italian is, who I am sure spoke with you at the boot test.

There are indeed gimmicks within our industry, but I do think you're off the mark here calling this system a gimmick, especially one that brings "no essential benefit" to the sport of skiing. I don't think the product is perfect or beyond improvement. I think their message (or K2's at least) of getting two lasts out of one is incredibly disappointing and ultimately detrimental to people's understanding of how a ski boot should fit. But the system works, fits better, and is far from being a gimmick or a flash in the pan.
 

Rich_Ease_3051

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Is it able to individualize the tension between the toe buckle and instep buckle?
Sounds to me like we need four Boas per pair of boots. One Boa for the instep and one for the toe buckle.

Make the dials a bit smaller, between the size of the current one and the helmet Boas.

Coming new for the 2026 season: You asked for it, and we listened. The new Boa Quatro.

1681854133085.png
 
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Tricia

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On the color, I'm seeing that it's available in a different colorway and that some stores appear to have both. Did they change it up for production? Are they both actually available?


Yes, it is offered in both color ways. I was asked which I wanted and chose the strawberry milkshake color. :)

I skied in the Salomon several days, and have passed them on to @Winks since he usually skis in a 24.5 (I ski 23.5) and is a bootfitter who will give it some more coverage.
The Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD is a better fit for my foot shape, even though I'm skiing it in a 24.5 its a snugger 24.5.
 

James

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Is it a benefit if you are a boot fitting specialist that can no longer open up the lower boot with a boot spreader to be able to mark, punch, or grind the boot to solve fit problems?
Woah, this has not been mentioned at all!
It has been billed as just a different method of closing.
So how does one punch or grind the Boa clog? Or are they all just heat moldable?
 
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