Individual Review Crosson Dissenter 78, 185, taking a chance that paid off

Tony S

I have a confusion to make ...
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"Peak?" Really? Isn't that kind of snoozy?
 
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ski otter 2

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So he's going from a company whose owner was appealing to him because of that guy's high precision (aircraft) design background and ongoing expertise, to now a company of his own, with him able to do what he wants, rather than influence what someone else wants (Cloud series?), in exchange for a line of his own designed skis (Dissenters).

Maybe a natural progression/improvement, from his point of view, if there were any conflicts in terms of time and effort, and expenses.
 
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ski otter 2

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Today it was a "one step at a time" thing to get on the ski slopes for me.

5-8 degrees F, and 30 to 50 mph winds, but I was on the 78 dissenters again, so problems melt away.

It was 1-3" of fresh on top of chaulky groomers, with wind drift, lots of it. (Not at all a spring day.)

Man, this became one of those "best ever" days, honest.

Somehow my old guy circulation was working well enough to not get cold, and somehow I got dialed in fast to these Dissenter skis, differently than last time. I got in a grove where these skis were doing off piste and winddrift powder/crud as well as they were doing pure groomers. My runs on some slopes were just best all time runs on those slopes, done better than ever before, for me. These do not need a plate to almost turn in circles. Great ski.

I still have not tested these in real all mountain off piste terrain and conditions, just frontside bias type conditions: on anything groomed one day per week or more, perfect ski - maybe good pushing these boundaries some.

At the same time, these skis are different, as an FIS GS 188/30 ski does distinctly its own great thing; same with a 165 FIS SL ski: something wonderful and distinctly different than other skis I have tried. There are skis that just stand out so much from other skis that they are in almost their own category, a different experience of their own. These 78 skis now are that kind of ski, for me. Heavens. Among my favorites.
 

Tom K.

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Day 3 Report: Just not for me. Got too excited and pulled the trigger on an impulse purchase. A very binary ski. Hooked up or drifting, with about 1 degree of angulation between the two.

Unflappable at speed, but always imparting a feeling of "I might kill you if you make an infinitesimal error!".

From Crosson's website, it seems I've bought a Duckbill Playtpus of a ski.

Live and learn, I guess......:(
 
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ski otter 2

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On Line Blades 95:
(I was just about to post this when Tom posted. Dang again.)

When I demoed the Blades, they were not a ski I wanted. Nice, different, but "meh", for me: they were too soft (and not so great in uneven crud) and the turn was a bit vague to me. But a great teaching tool for carving, it seemed like.

A distinctly unique ski, nonetheless; interesting, different, for some really exciting. It has some things in common with the wider and somewhat more tapered Line Sakana 105.

Both have large tips and lots of sidecut with shorter radius, both best on groomers, or smooth powder/off piste.

The Blade in particular has a distinct design, blunt tip and a narrow "V" shape or fan shape in the front half that seems to have distinctive performance characteristics in common with other skis like it. (Not sure which of these was seminal, and which learned from and copied a good thing, but my guess for now is the Line Blades came first, or are at least the prime example.) They carve well, while the fan shape means there is little or no "turn in" at the tips, as happens with rounded or tapered skis. This means little hookiness, and an immediacy of directional carve at the tips, and thus of tip and edge engagement at turn initiation, without any fussiness or nervousness in the process. (It's hard to "roll up" such a tip.) The result is a very smooth, safe and easy engagement - and thus carve - good for folks just learning to carve as well as others wanting the carve to be easier and more relaxed.

This Line design has seemed very popular the past few years: K2 Distractions, Head V series, LIberty VMT series, at least.
And now the Crosson Dissenter 78s.

Lots of people in the ski business are aware of this "V" shaped trend epitomized by the Blades.

For example, early this season I demoed some K2 Distraction skis, ones either side of 80 mm wide waist, as I recall.
Afterwards, the rep asked what I thought of them.

I said, "Kind of like the Line Blade in a narrower, maybe racier version."
"Exactly," the rep replied.

To me, the Distractions seemed not to be dialed in enough, kind of "off" for me. Awkward.

The Liberty VMTs felt easier and more dialed in, and very easy, nice carvers maybe also, but kind of vague and unexciting to me personally.

Same with the Head V8 and 10.

The LIberties and Heads seemed to me a great addition to our skiing options: fresh carvers, a bit vague and yet forgiving, great for learning to carve or being able to relax more while doing it. And good for carving folks with injuries or reasons to dial back.

The Crosson Dissenter 78s have a blunt tip and fan shape also; they have some of the "easier" advantages of the Blade, etc., but they are something different otherwise, as I've tried to describe.

Dang.
 
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cantunamunch

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Day 3 Report: Just not for me. Got too excited and pulled the trigger on an impulse purchase. A very binary ski. Hooked up or drifting, with about 1 degree of angulation between the two.

Unflappable at speed, but always imparting a feeling of "I might kill you if you make an infinitesimal error!".

From Crosson's website, it seems I've bought a Duckbill Playtpus of a ski.

Live and learn, I guess......:(

Eh. At least you can get a now-discontinued price?
 

ARL67

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^^^ Did you mean to say K2 Disruption instead of Distraction ?

I have the K2 Disruption STi 170 as does @graham418. We are of different H/W but both of us enjoy the STi in a variety of conditions, even though it is 72 underfoot ( 125-72-107 ). FYI the 82ti is 125-82-111 so not overly wide shovel IMO for an 82 , maybe our STi is a bit wide up front compared to other "racey" 72's. But then a Head e-Magnum is 129-72-111. Myself and Graham mainly ski groomers at our home hill north of Toronto, unless of course there is more snow, where we may ski the STi anyway. My next widest ski is a 92 ( Faction CT 1.0 ). I believe I have enough versatility between my the K2 and Faction that I have no realistic need for a mid-80s. Though I have a mid-80s on order, it is merely for entertainment and experimentations sake ( as is most of my ongoing buying & trying & re-selling ) , not out of a performance hole in the quiver.
 

Tom K.

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Sorry for my role in that, Tom. Dang.

No sweat. I'm just always looking for a great carving ski. It was worth the gamble, even though it didn't pay off.

I think what I'd love -- and maybe nobody else -- is my old non-FIS Head slaloms, 15% softer and 15% wider.

The softer because I want to carve a tight arc on a steepish slope without having to go mach looney speeds, or contort my body into shapes it no longer wishes to visit.

The wider because I don't want to trench stupidly deep during spring corn time, which was definitely a thing with my old SLs.

Maybe it has an issue with the base/edges?

Dead flat bases, beautiful structure, more than 2 and less than 3 side bevel. All good.

However, the base bevel was a very racy 0.5. I put that at 1.0 and the skis were a lot better, but still not "me".

To me, the Distractions seemed not to be dialed in enough, kind of "off" for me. Awkward.

That is a superb and concise explanation of how I feel about the Dissenter!

Could just be me. I love to carve, but have no history with modern GS race skis.
 

Tony S

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I still want to try them. But not your 185s.
 
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ski otter 2

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^^^ Did you mean to say K2 Disruption instead of Distraction ?

I have the K2 Disruption STi 170 as does @graham418. We are of different H/W but both of us enjoy the STi in a variety of conditions, even though it is 72 underfoot ( 125-72-107 ). FYI the 82ti is 125-82-111 so not overly wide shovel IMO for an 82 , maybe our STi is a bit wide up front compared to other "racey" 72's. But then a Head e-Magnum is 129-72-111. Myself and Graham mainly ski groomers at our home hill north of Toronto, unless of course there is more snow, where we may ski the STi anyway. My next widest ski is a 92 ( Faction CT 1.0 ). I believe I have enough versatility between my the K2 and Faction that I have no realistic need for a mid-80s. Though I have a mid-80s on order, it is merely for entertainment and experimentations sake ( as is most of my ongoing buying & trying & re-selling ) , not out of a performance hole in the quiver.
Yeah, disruptions. Was distracted by both the Bode switcharo and Tom''s disappointment with the 78 skis.
 
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ski otter 2

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Dead flat bases, beautiful structure, more than 2 and less than 3 side bevel. All good.

However, the base bevel was a very racy 0.5. I put that at 1.0 and the skis were a lot better, but still not "me".



That is a superb and concise explanation of how I feel about the Dissenter!

Could just be me. I love to carve, but have no history with modern GS race skis.

Geez. Well, diversity of experience and preference is a good thing, right?

I was struck by both your sentence about the racy .5 base bevel and the one at the end, of "no history with modern GS race skis."
Maybe these skis prefer someone with at least a modest gs race background, again not sure.

On groomers, but maybe also elsewhere, I would usually prefer a 0.5 base bevel on a strong front side or race ski, when I can get that: more immediacy of response.
I had more than fifty years of skiing GS skis with a 0 base bevel - flat with a right angle. Like riding a bike, that sort of ski feels like coming home to me, even if I'm a bit clumsy athletically at times, dunno. And the skis/bindings are so much better now than they were back when.

I ski and own a half dozen GS race skis (and four FIS SL skis I love also): 2 old spec 183/23, three current U18 and women's 188/30 (favorite skis I take out a lot of days), and a pair of non-FIS Master's GS skis 185/23, I believe (another favorite that gets a lot of use). At this point, those all just feel almost perfect and dialed in to me, skied recreationally, safe like a bicycle, almost; so it's different for me with the Dissenter 78s. They are on a par or if anything with a somewhat higher safety and versatility margin, for me. Once I use even some race technique on them, they feel for me just dialed in comfortable; not dangerous. Just the best of a usual sort of ski day.

At one point skiing today, for example, I was going down a steep slope usually reserved for steep GS or SG race training. It had swirls of hardened drift at various stages of compaction, large, skied off boiler plate ice patches, fairly poor visibility, swirled areas of drifted pure powder, and I was on those 78s, dialed in. At one point at least I threw them totally sideways at speed, then returned to the fall line back and forth when I saw a good line. Those skis made all that just about like perfect corduroy, with some extra great ride from the powder here and there.

Man, such a wonder that I can still function like that, so I just felt something like being in a peak experience, or on a pure GS race ski plus some of the ease and forgiveness of something like those Line Blades, just such easy back and forth turns at speed, like a child's fun playground game. At that point, very safe, given my odd gs ski background, I guess. Pig heaven.

So, dang, not great that you were having an almost opposite experience so recently.
 
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Thread Starter
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ski otter 2

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:) I just meant the 185s might be too long for some skiers, and might be more so that way for East Coast boilerplate or ice bumps, where many skiers have a shorter turn strategy to handle such stuff, often.

But yeah, in many places on many days, back East, including for me, at my profile, the 185s would rock, be right up there.
 
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