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When i looked those up i got some ahem interesting results. I think you are correct.
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Do most skiers use the wrong skis
- Thread starter Pacobillie
- Start date
Ok…so, at the shop today….I had an install of an M5 Mantra (177) and Marker Griffons. The skis and bindings were purchased online from Evo. As I was preparing for the install….getting everything set/paperwork….I notice the customer is a 5’4 120 lb. 13yo Type II skier?….
So, I stand over this ridiculous install and wonder if I should call the customer/parents and tell him/them this is probably not the appropriate ski for him?? (He’ll have trouble carrying the thing in the parking lot, let alone actually trying to ski it/turn it)……I did install it, but did not feel good about it.
The stuff that comes in from online purchases is of course more common….sometimes it’s awesome/unique to NEPA…more often than not it’s a young kid just liking the top sheet/colors….
So, I stand over this ridiculous install and wonder if I should call the customer/parents and tell him/them this is probably not the appropriate ski for him?? (He’ll have trouble carrying the thing in the parking lot, let alone actually trying to ski it/turn it)……I did install it, but did not feel good about it.
The stuff that comes in from online purchases is of course more common….sometimes it’s awesome/unique to NEPA…more often than not it’s a young kid just liking the top sheet/colors….
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That reminds me of the time my dad took me shopping for a new winter jacket. I think I was 13 years old circa 1971. I'm pretty sure it was at Sears. Anyway, I found a jacket I liked and showed it to him. He said great and hung it back on the rack then grabbed one two sizes larger. I told him it was way too big and he responded that it wouldn't be in a couple of years. I wore that jacket for 4-5 years!
So many time with kids/junior gear when parented would to put kids in boots too big, to grow into, usually a size or two too big, I would ask them them what boot they were in and I would grab a pair three sizes too big and have them put it on. They would swim in the boot and I would aski them if they could ski in that? I would then explain thats what they are doing to their kids.
One of the best lines about oversizing kids gear was posted here "Kids should grow out of gear, not into it".
One of the best lines about oversizing kids gear was posted here "Kids should grow out of gear, not into it".
My 5'4" 120 lb 14 year old got his Kids Nordica Enforcer 95's 150cm with Attack 11's last year and will use them again this year. He skis everything including steep trees at Killington/Pico. I, a 46 year old 5'7" 175 lb muscular man would use a Mantra M5 177 with Marker Griffons. That would be a "Charger" ski for me; and I'm a very good skier. My 17 year old is 5'11" 135 lbs. and uses a JSkis Allplay 171 cm w/ Look 14's. He's also a very good skier. This type 2 little kid on the Mantra gonna die! I take no pleasure in this; but that kid is on the wrong s#!t. How will this little kid bend a Mantra M5 177? If my 17 year old wasn't a skinny bean pole, I would have bought a 178 for him at 5'11", and the Allplay is a soft, playful ski.
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My daughter, 34, is still wearing sox I bought her when she was eight or nine.
Think how much money on clothes I've saved her over the years. (She's only 5' 4" and the last inch came around grad school.)
And sometimes it is driven by the kids wanting a big fat ski. A good friend wanted to get his tiny 13 year old daughter new skis so she would be more excited and ski with him more often. He let her choose and she ended up with a pair of Mindbender 106C skis that were easily a foot taller than she was. He asked me what I thought of the skis for her and I told him the truth, way to long and way to fat for a little kid, his response was I think she can handle them and the extra length means they are good for a few years ... fast forward to when we finally skied with him in April and the skis were so big his poor daughter could barely turn on technical terrain and essentially side slipped anything steep.
I am all for getting a good deal on a pair of skis, and do buy a lot online, but I always know exactly what I am buying and why. Sometimes my kids can go two years on a pair of skis and sometimes they outgrow them after a year, either way they are always skiing in the right size ski with the right width for the conditions. Unfortunately I think many buyers don't actually know what they are buying and really should go to a shop where their kids can get properly sized for skis .... and you should always work with a boot fitter when buying pair of boots.
When my two daughter's were young, and growing every year, I took them to the same ski shop and got fitted for boots, skis, and poles by the same guy. Their trade in program was great. 50% credit after one year, 25% after two years. They were always skiing on equipment that was appropriately sized. Kids will enjoy the sport so much more when they are skiing on the right equipment. They are adults now and are avid skiers to this day.
If you have a budget that allows you to consider ski shop wall gear instead of used/swap meet gear but are concerned about kids growing out of the gear here's what you do.. Go with seasonal rentals instead of purchasing new gear. If they grow out of something you can then trade up in size under the terms of most of those agreements.
As for the other typical "wrong gear" gripes. Your skis are too fat/skinny/soft/hard/long/short for conditions. Unless you're competing who cares.. If you like your skis and can ski them well enough for your level of stoke then who cares what anyone else says..
As for the other typical "wrong gear" gripes. Your skis are too fat/skinny/soft/hard/long/short for conditions. Unless you're competing who cares.. If you like your skis and can ski them well enough for your level of stoke then who cares what anyone else says..
As I’m drilling through all that metal...I’m saying to myself, how the hell is this 6th grade kid gonna carry these missiles/ let alone turn them......and with big ol’ heavy Griffons.....I’m hoping the family sees on the first day these are too much.....this package will sell very easily to an adult skier.
While I do appreciate the convenience of seasonal rentals, this is a point on which we have to agree to disagree. I have a lot of issues with seasonal rentals and it breaks down like this:
- They have become quite expensive locally and you can often by used gear or tent sale gear that is much better quality for less.
- Typically I have not seen them do a good job fitting the rental boots as they really do not want to do a custom boot fit or any modifications to a rental boot. This ultimately means the rental boot does not have a great fit.
- The tuning on these rental skis is hit or miss especially after a couple seasons. I have a friend who used to work in a local shop with a large seasonal rental business an pretty much all they did was belt sand an belt wax their rental fleet, the edges were terrible.
Blame the shop and it's employees... I've found that most consumers ignore the advice of the shop/employees and just buy the latest hype machine that is being promoted on the interweb. Our local hills are in a relatively low snow area, with few powder days, and most skiers would be best served with a low 80's waist, firm snow oriented model. However, they won't even consider that category. It has to be over 100mm and rockered like crazy. Can you ski predominately firm and/or groomed conditions with that category of skis? Yes, but it's a lot of work and not that fun (imho). They won't be caught dead skiing on a "carving" ski. We give them the "talk" and try to make a case for "narrowish", firmer-snow oriented, ski models. For the most part, we are summarily ignored. So, to stay in business, we sell them what they want. You want to look for someone to blame, then focus on TGR, Matchstick, Warren Miller and the marketing departments who capitalize on that image.
I always chuckle when I see people who are skiing on skis that are wider than the snow is deep.
As some have noted, novices and many intermediates don't understand so are at the mercy of those that advise them.
But with advanced-intermediates plus,
This:
7) lack of opportunity to do an on the snow demo.
Pricy performance skis are always going to be limited in ski shops to certain models and lengths. The availability of performance rental skis is far better in most areas now than decades ago. Obviously large resorts have offered more for years. Shops wisely limit lengths available to average size persons. Those out of those ranges are usually out of luck. Of all the skis owned, I've only bought one ski from a demo, Volant Powderkarves, that I skied for years.
But with advanced-intermediates plus,
This:
7) lack of opportunity to do an on the snow demo.
Pricy performance skis are always going to be limited in ski shops to certain models and lengths. The availability of performance rental skis is far better in most areas now than decades ago. Obviously large resorts have offered more for years. Shops wisely limit lengths available to average size persons. Those out of those ranges are usually out of luck. Of all the skis owned, I've only bought one ski from a demo, Volant Powderkarves, that I skied for years.
On that note: is ski brand advertisement different in the US than in Europe? Here (Europe), I see ads like the ones below. Is that different in the US?
we have very very VERY good access to demos in my country, almost all resorts will have some deal with different brands or stores. Trouble is they have the 2nd longest length always....
stockli is $50 for a full day here, volkl and others are free, but only 4 hours or so.
I have had full weekends I've only skied free demoskis all day both days, usually swap after 2-3-4 hours or when they suck.
stockli is $50 for a full day here, volkl and others are free, but only 4 hours or so.
I have had full weekends I've only skied free demoskis all day both days, usually swap after 2-3-4 hours or when they suck.
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Andy Mink
Everyone loves spring skiing but not in January
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Same in US. Top skiers on high performance skis selling the stoke. Very rarely do I see a beginner or intermediate skier pictured just cruising down a green beginner hill or making slow, very deliberate turns across a wide blue.
Also the narrow skis on groomed slopes in the US ads? Or mostly powder and fat skis?