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Do the apparel industry and stockists produce and stock a higher quantity of the median jacket and pants size?

Rich_Ease_3051

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First of all, what in your opinion is the peak of the bell curve in terms of sizing? If I had to guess it would be medium size jacket and medium size pants with short inseam.

Second, do you think clothing manufacturers and stockists produce and stock more of these sizes? Or is it the same quantity for all sizes?

Every new season the struggle is real. I'm about as average size as they come and I'm always left with small, extra small, large and extra large clothing selection in the racks. Never a medium.
 
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Rich_Ease_3051

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:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:

As someone with an actual short inseam, I can assure you that this is NOT their forte. Most "regular" ski pants make me look like I'm a six year old wearing my dad's pajamas.
It is not uncommon for jackets and or pants come pre packed in sizing to make it easier 1-2-2-1, thats 1 small, 2 mediums, 2 larges and 1 XL.
So are these companies allergic to making money? You'd think if the general population had more short-legged manlets such as myself, and maybe Tony, that they would make that production run 1 5 5 1 so they can sell more crap to us who occupy the tip of the bell curve.

The way they sell and market clothing makes it look like the ski resorts are just teeming with 6 foot male models with freakin 32 inch waists.
 
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Rich_Ease_3051

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See even custom ski clothing companies don't have an option for short inseam. If custom makers don't give an option for short inseam, what hope is there when buying off the rack?

Made Canada

NWT3K USA
 

scott43

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Are long pants that bad for technical clothing? I just pull up my pant cuffs when stepping into my bindings. And I have lots of movement for my highly dynamic skiing style.... Ok that last bit is BS, but I do have room to move in them.. :ogbiggrin:
 
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Rich_Ease_3051

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Are long pants that bad for technical clothing? I just pull up my pant cuffs when stepping into my bindings. And I have lots of movement for my highly dynamic skiing style.... Ok that last bit is BS, but I do have room to move in them.. :ogbiggrin:

It's not just the cuff. If the inseam is too long, the articulation of the knees would sit below the knee instead of on the knee. That defeats the purpose of clothing articulation for the bent-knee stance, ie the knee would be rubbing up against the pants.
 

scott43

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It's not just the cuff. If the inseam is too long, the articulation of the knees would sit below the knee instead of on the knee. That defeats the purpose of clothing articulation for the bent-knee stance, ie the knee would be rubbing up against the pants.
I dunno..I've never worried too much about it..I'm like @Tony S ..2" too short in the legs. I just hike them up a bit and deal. I would never pay for custom or hemming, not for tech gear.
 
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Rich_Ease_3051

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I dunno..I've never worried too much about it..I'm like @Tony S ..2" too short in the legs. I just hike them up a bit and deal. I would never pay for custom or hemming, not for tech gear.

I mean that's the kind of general consumer sentiment that reinforces the laziness of apparel makers. They'll just keep making the same production run because consumers will just put up with it by buying a size larger.

I don't mind going the custom route and pay top dollar if they offer more customisations. The Made Canada company is not even producing due to supply chain issues. They can really steal market share if they offer real customisation.
 

fatbob

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There's another issue for those interested in getting value - sample sizes. I know a store that gets a huge throughput of sample outerwear at great prices - Marmot, OR, Patagucci, Columbia, Rab etc but it's always in M or Women's (UK)12
 

KingGrump

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I am a border line midget. (Sorry if it is no longer a PC term. Not really.) I get my pants right off the rack like most skiers. All on discount (I'm cheap). They all fit me well without the dreaded fold over. Besides fit, I try not look like a boarder out there. So hang and style figure into the purchases also.
I have seen many shorter friends in Arc, Patagonia and North Face pants that fit well.
They are there, you just gotta look.

The brands I currently own and wear are Kjus, Vist, Bogner, Mammut and Spyder.
 

Tony S

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Trew offers short inseams- https://trewgear.com/products/capow-bib-short
Arc'teryx makes short inseam pants.
Obermeyer makes short inseam pants.
Columbia makes short inseam pants.
Those were the first four companies product offerings I looked at, they all offer 'short'.

Did you look at all?
What's on paper and what you can actually get as a retail customer are often very different. Not just in the pandemic. I haven't done this in the last three years or so, but I went back and forth with Arc and some other companies on exactly this issue. They basically shrugged and said "We sold all twelve pairs we made at the beginning of the season. You can wait to see if we make more next year." I'm not exaggerating about the "twelve" either; that's literally what they told me. Twelve pairs. For the world.
 
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Rich_Ease_3051

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Trew offers short inseams- https://trewgear.com/products/capow-bib-short
Arc'teryx makes short inseam pants.
Obermeyer makes short inseam pants.
Columbia makes short inseam pants.
Those were the first four companies product offerings I looked at, they all offer 'short'.

Did you look at all?
What's on paper and what you can actually get as a retail customer are often very different. Not just in the pandemic. I haven't done this in the last three years or so, but I went back and forth with Arc and some other companies on exactly this issue. They basically shrugged and said "We sold all twelve pairs we made at the beginning of the season. You can wait to see if we make more next year." I'm not exaggerating about the "twelve" either; that's literally what they told me. Twelve pairs. For the world.
It could be a US specific thing, which is arguably the biggest market in the world.

I can tell you that smaller markets such us Australia are not given the option for short or even long inseam. This is for Patagonia, Arcteryx, Helly Hansen, North Face, Salomon, and other major brands.

If the biggies cannot offer inseam selection other than regular, there's no chance in hell the niche brands can.

There's also geofencing issue where you cannot order from a US site because typing arcteryx.com automatically redirects it to arcteryx.com.au, where the prices are higher and selection more limited.

Trew does offer short inseam sizes and deliver to Australia. Sadly, I'm not into bibs.
 

EricG

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There's also geofencing issue where you cannot order from a US site because typing arcteryx.com automatically redirects it to arcteryx.com.au, where the prices are higher and selection more limited.

Trew does offer short inseam sizes and deliver to Australia. Sadly, I'm not into bibs.

- spyder, Kjus should be easily available globally in short.

- use a VPN.

- get someone on US to buy and send to you.

I’ve got Obermyer, Patagonia, Kjus, Spyder & Salomon in short sitting here in short lengths So I know they are out there..
 

Analisa

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Yes, the middle of the bell curve will always be a medium. It makes things easier from a forecasting standpoint. But it’s also sizing. A medium is the “sample size” - meaning for pre-production, we fit on a medium mannequin and our fit model who wears the early protos is a medium. Sizes scale up and down to complete the run. The further you grade, the weirder proportions can get (if you’ve ever heard plus size women complain about extended sizing like XXXL vs “true plus” at a 3X, they’re totally warranted. A XXXL is a graded out version of a medium body. The 3X measures and builds on a 1X fit model.) As much as we complain about inconsistent sizing across brands, it tends to make a more tailored product for the target demographic.

The reason you see a lot of fringe sizes left on the rack mid to late season is due to forecast standard deviations and maybe case pack rounding. In stats, population size and standard deviation have an inverse relationship. There are a lot of mediums, so we tend to have better and more consistent forecast inputs for that size. Very small, very large, or short / long inseam pants are smaller numbers, less consistent, and they’re either gone by January or sold for 60% off the next summer. It’s the same reason you see boring colors in extended sizes and variated inseams - sizing is less consistent, so we go with consistent, dependable selling colors so we don’t end up with 2 eons of supply on hand. (And that gets even more important if it’s a “true” short built on a short model vs just a shortened inseam. Factories and brands see that as a separate style that needs to hit factory mins and meet brand profitability thresholds all on its own).

The US is big for skiing, but Europe overall tends to be stronger, so global brands tend to split the difference on fit (we in the US tend to be a bit shorter, and on the women's side, more hourglass shaped). I’d expect to see more short inseam sizes as the Asian ski market grows and supply chains get more creative on how to reduce minimums.
 

Pat AKA mustski

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:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:

As someone with an actual short inseam, I can assure you that this is NOT their forte. Most "regular" ski pants make me look like I'm a six year old wearing my dad's pajamas.
Same but the female version ... still looks like wearing dad's pajamas!
I dunno..I've never worried too much about it..I'm like @Tony S ..2" too short in the legs. I just hike them up a bit and deal. I would never pay for custom or hemming, not for tech gear.
That 2" isn't always distributed equally. People are proportioned differently. For me the knees, in "regular" sizing, hang considerably below my actual knees. I am consistently told to buy "petite" sizing, but the problem is that I am not petite in stature; just short. It's not that I'm terribly fat; it's that I don't have a petite bone structure. Petite sizing requires me to go up 3 sizes and, once again, the pants are too long.
 

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