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Non Region Specific epicliftlines.com

Slasher

Getting on the lift
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Dec 16, 2018
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121
Seems the chickens have come home to roost for Vail Resorts.

Check out http://epicliftlines.com/, which redirects to https://www.instagram.com/epicliftlines/

The meat of the content is not in the "posts", but in the "stories" -- click on the "Storytime!" icon.

This post is an apt summary of everything:

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But the devil is in the details and worth going through with a fine toothed comb.

E.g.

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Roundturns

Getting off the lift
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Nov 29, 2017
Posts
397
Something is going to “hit the fan”. When the skiing product gets compromised it will become harder and harder for skiers to justify paying top dollar to stay at the Arabel , Solaris, where ever and stand in an hour lift line.

Can‘t have it both ways VR. The resorts and staff can’t handle the number of skiers showing up. There’s got to be a lot of Vail property owners who shelled out a bunch of money to enjoy the Vail product that have to be really miffed to have to share the mountain with more of the great unwashed masses this season.
 

ThomasD

Getting off the lift
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Dec 24, 2021
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281
Location
Johnson City, TN
Cannot help but suspect this is being done intentionally to prime people for preferential add on charges/quick passes.

Amusement parks like Disney, Busch Gardens, and Universal have been doing it for years, don't tell me VR and others in the ski industry have not taken note.
 

Lauren

AKA elemmac
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I really want to know which resort this is.... I want to make sure I do not end up at that mountain. :(
 

SSSdave

life is short precious ...don't waste it
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Silicon Valley
As someone that had a 4+ decade career as a peon in a list of Silicon Valley hi tech corp engineering departments, I learned to strongly dislike corporate bean counters that usually lived in Wall Street financial offices thousands of miles away. First thing they would do is hire some top Ivy League graduate with a Human Resource Management degree to lead their companies, all of which are taught the prime directive was to follow their corporate bean counter playbook wishes. Wall Street took years for their financial people to infiltrate the new West Coast world and generally hated paying salaries accomplished engineers deserved and demanded.

The first thing they did was to have their HR puppets increasingly hire H1B foreigners and newly degreed engineers as much as possible for lower wages despite any lack of experience, much of which cannot be taught in any school. Some engineers fled into sales and sales support engineering areas where given their superior English speaking skills, they thrived. They created job requests with little details they could use as excuses to not otherwise hire experienced Americans. Often degree terms only recent graduates could qualify for while ignoring experience in same. Increasingly ignored resumes of most except those gurus they could not replace and demanded they train any less talented. Company wide layoffs that were once only emergency measures became regular that caused much negativity, paranoia, and lack of trust in team environments. Thankfully the rise of linkedin and networking considerably crimped their powers.

After squeezing out as much as they could from breaking into whatever lucrative product realm while employees expected a long term ride, bean counters would offshore USA production and sell American developed technology to eager Asian government corporations. So yeah skiing world, welcome to the game you can expect financial bean counters to play so they and their other wealthy leeches can retire to Palm Beach and Palm Springs playing golf.
 
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Roundturns

Getting off the lift
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Posts
397
Cynical but probably “spot on”. Took me forever to acknowledge and understand that companies are run for the shareholders and not the employees.
Good on you surviving the corporation and being able to enjoy skiing.

I was slow to acknowledge how bad VR‘s consolidation of the ski industry would be for the long term skier that supported the mountain VR acquired.

But I think where this might backfire for VR is delivering a subpar product- experience for their “well heeled” clientele. You can argue, where else are they going to go when we own practically everyplace else.

Not a spot on analogy, but kind of makes my point, golfers that belong to expensive country clubs become very unhappy real quick when they endure crowded courses and conditions that aren’t perfect. They have higher expectations and just as important believe they are entitled.

I think by over crowding the ski areas by selling cheap passes, the skiers that spend big money at these resorts are going to revolt.

But VR is smart and holding the “trump card” knowing their isn’t anywhere else these same disgruntled skiers are likely to be able to go. So learn to love it or stay home.
 

KevinF

Gathermeister-New England
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Nov 12, 2015
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New England
Stowe (Vermont) used to run their quad starting at 7:30 on weekends and holidays; it gave the local speedsters a half hour of mostly empty slopes and another run or two before having to head off to their day jobs or whatever.

I always considered the 7:30 start to be a very "Stowe specific" feature; I didn't always take advantage, but it was cool to know that you could.

But now it's gone; lodges are locked until 7:30 and lifts won't spin until 8:00. I'm sure some Colorado-based bean counter looked at lift ride stats vs. cost for that half hour and axed it, but they didn't consider what they're losing.

It's the same story across every industry though; the short term gain makes up for the long term loss.
 

Cameron

Out on the slopes
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Stowe (Vermont) used to run their quad starting at 7:30 on weekends and holidays; it gave the local speedsters a half hour of mostly empty slopes and another run or two before having to head off to their day jobs or whatever.

I always considered the 7:30 start to be a very "Stowe specific" feature; I didn't always take advantage, but it was cool to know that you could.

But now it's gone; lodges are locked until 7:30 and lifts won't spin until 8:00. I'm sure some Colorado-based bean counter looked at lift ride stats vs. cost for that half hour and axed it, but they didn't consider what they're losing.

It's the same story across every industry though; the short term gain makes up for the long term loss.
I know one of the former managers at a Vail owned ski area about 90 minutes away. They weren't allowed to make snow before December. This year it has bit them in the behind as they are yet to open.

I also think that while it has driven down the cost of season passes down it has driven the overall cost of skiing up. I am almost to the point of saying traveling to ski just isn't worth the costs. We'd have to spend 2 weeks at a VR owned resort to make the pass costs worth it which translates to probably $10K or more when you factor in travel costs, food, etc. for an average family.
 

newboots

Learning to carve!
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Dec 9, 2016
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Catskills
I think by over crowding the ski areas by selling cheap passes, the skiers that spend big money at these resorts are going to revolt.

But VR is smart and holding the “trump card” knowing their isn’t anywhere else these same disgruntled skiers are likely to be able to go. So learn to love it or stay home.

There are one or two mountains left. ;)
 

AmyPJ

Skiing the powder
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I know one of the former managers at a Vail owned ski area about 90 minutes away. They weren't allowed to make snow before December. This year it has bit them in the behind as they are yet to open.

I also think that while it has driven down the cost of season passes down it has driven the overall cost of skiing up. I am almost to the point of saying traveling to ski just isn't worth the costs. We'd have to spend 2 weeks at a VR owned resort to make the pass costs worth it which translates to probably $10K or more when you factor in travel costs, food, etc. for an average family.
You know, I had never really thought of this but you're right. If more people are traveling to ski because passes are cheap, then rooms are going to be more in demand, driving up the prices. Hopefully we'll see a rebalancing of things soon.
 

Cameron

Out on the slopes
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Southwest Ohio
You know, I had never really thought of this but you're right. If more people are traveling to ski because passes are cheap, then rooms are going to be more in demand, driving up the prices. Hopefully we'll see a rebalancing of things soon.
Other than airfare I think I have booked the cheapest possible ski trip for our family. We're skiing Grand Targhee and I plan to take my son to Jackson Hole for a day or maybe 2. We are staying in Driggs and before food we will be out about$4500. Airfare to Denver is much cheaper but rental cars cost more, lodging cost a lot more, and since we don't have Epic or Ikon passes skiing would be a lot more. I'm guessing with modest lodging at Copper Mountain we would be closer to $6000-7000 for the week and a vail resort would be even more. I'm looking forward to our son getting to experience the mountains at some point its just not going to make sense economically anymore.
 

Tricia

The Velvet Hammer
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Stowe (Vermont) used to run their quad starting at 7:30 on weekends and holidays; it gave the local speedsters a half hour of mostly empty slopes and another run or two before having to head off to their day jobs or whatever.

I always considered the 7:30 start to be a very "Stowe specific" feature; I didn't always take advantage, but it was cool to know that you could.

But now it's gone; lodges are locked until 7:30 and lifts won't spin until 8:00. I'm sure some Colorado-based bean counter looked at lift ride stats vs. cost for that half hour and axed it, but they didn't consider what they're losing.

It's the same story across every industry though; the short term gain makes up for the long term loss.
Mt Rose spins the lifts at 8:30 on the Slide Side where a lot of passholders tend to park. 9 AM on the Main lodge side where more tourists park. We do take advantage of that.
 

Slide of Hans

Getting on the Red Chair
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Nov 1, 2017
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385
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West Peak
But VR is smart and holding the “trump card” knowing their isn’t anywhere else these same disgruntled skiers are likely to be able to go. So learn to love it or stay home.

True, reminds me of the quote from potus yesterday..."capitalism without competition is not capitalism,,, it's exploitation".
 

AmyPJ

Skiing the powder
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Other than airfare I think I have booked the cheapest possible ski trip for our family. We're skiing Grand Targhee and I plan to take my son to Jackson Hole for a day or maybe 2. We are staying in Driggs and before food we will be out about$4500. Airfare to Denver is much cheaper but rental cars cost more, lodging cost a lot more, and since we don't have Epic or Ikon passes skiing would be a lot more. I'm guessing with modest lodging at Copper Mountain we would be closer to $6000-7000 for the week and a vail resort would be even more. I'm looking forward to our son getting to experience the mountains at some point its just not going to make sense economically anymore.
Targhee is one of my favorite places, both winter and summer. Enjoy!
 

jclee

Booting up
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Joined
Dec 22, 2017
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37
I should have taken a video last Thursday at Heavenly when they suddenly closed all the Nevada and Gondola side lifts for wind, and herded everyone to the Gondola, resulting in a 45 minute line at the Gondola. Some people got in the a fight in fact when one person tried to cut in line.
 

Roundturns

Getting off the lift
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Joined
Nov 29, 2017
Posts
397
They had an interview with a VA Exec. On the Pittsburgh news yesterday regarding the 7 Springs acquisition, oddly this guy ( didn’t recognize the name briefly played for the Steelers) indicated to the reporter that there is no guarantee regarding capital improvements for the Seven Springs properties , but noted they had appropriated about $345 million in improvements for all the Vail properties for this past year.
Time will tell what gets appropriated for the Seven Springs properties.
 

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