Getting on race skis - benefits? Recommended? Recommendations?

[Raymond Slarver]

Here in the foothills of the northeast it's not quite time to break out the gear and put the rack back up on the car, but I can feel it. It's coming. After a few years of hanging with my L2 certification, consolidating my knowledge, getting better as an instructor - I think - and attending to a lot of Real Life Stuff that took up my time, I'm aiming for L3 certification this season. So I'm thinking about what I need to work on and making some plans.
I've skied since I was a kid but never raced, and so haven't ever been on a set of SL or GS skis. Maybe inspired by some of the Tom Gellie/BPS stuff I've been listening to lately, I've been thinking about how my skiing might grow if I picked up a set of race skis and got on them once in a while. As I've always understood it, you're gonna get higher performance from good race skis provided your technical skills are on point - which is where I want them to be. Some additional factors supporting this thought: the conditions I ski (again, east coast) are hard-packed, on-piste more often than not, so I'm likely to have ample opportunities to use them. And one of the primary trainers on our school's staff has a racing background which he brings to his clinics, so I might even pick his brain, if not get the chance to run some gates. Lastly, ski shop sale season is kicking off in earnest now and I might catch a deal on something.
I'm not exactly flush with cash these days, so I'm not looking to buy skis for the hell of it, but if it were to help me up my game towards the greater goal, I'd probably do it. Thoughts?

 

[slow-line-fast]

What skis are you on now, and what do you like and not like about them?

 

[Shawn]

[I am] an instructor...

...I'm not exactly flush with cash

That's for sure.

 

[Raymond Slarver]

That's for sure.

My "real world" work includes academia and social work, so yes, I really do know how to pick 'em.

 

[Raymond Slarver]

What skis are you on now, and what do you like and not like about them?

I've got a well-used set of Volkl Blaze 94s, ex-demo, beat-up but still good Kastle MX88s which I really like (and which are probably the closest to "demanding performance skis" of the bunch), and I actually was one of the few, the proud who got a set of the Crosson Dissenter 78s last year - which I wrote a little about here.

 

[Brian Finch]

Fellow Northeaster here. I've worked w/ a lot of 2's to 3's and my advise is to get a softer SL ski. It will allow you to progress at slower speeds and lesser space whilst teaching you to transition from fallline/2 footed/ squared / cross unders to sweeping/outside ski dominant/ countered / cross overs.

 

[slow-line-fast]

Fellow Northeaster here. I've worked w/ a lot of 2's to 3's and my advise is to get a softer SL ski. It will allow you to progress at slower speeds and lesser space whilst teaching you to transition from fallline/2 footed/ squared / cross unders to sweeping/outside ski dominant/ countered / cross overs.

Agree with this. A SL will make a small hill ski bigger.

 

[Jilly]

FYI - most of the CSIA IV's (we go higher) are on tuned down race skis, or citizen race skis. Rossi Hero's, Head Super Shapes for example. These are the popular ones at Tremblant. Depends on their sponsorship. I don't think I've seen an instructor on true race skis, except Eric Guay.

So same as most are suggesting above.

 

[François Pugh]

Any narrow short radius ski will be an improvement if you are looking for something that will draw you into spending more time carving clean, high performance, high g, high edge angle turns. Which one to get will depend on how much you weigh, as well as how much you can spend. How much do you weigh? How many vertical feet do you typically have to play with? Do you like to ski fast?

 

[Raymond Slarver]

Any narrow short radius ski will be an improvement if you are looking for something that will draw you into spending more time carving clean, high performance, high g, high edge angle turns. Which one to get will depend on how much you weigh, as well as how much you can spend. How much do you weigh? How many vertical feet do you typically have to play with? Do you like to ski fast?

I'm 5'10"ish, 175 lbs, and most of my skiing is at places with around 1400-1700' vertical. I like to open it up a bit when I feel safe - no crowds or mad straight-liners around, non-flat-light conditions - but I'm not one to take it up to mach looney much, if ever.

 

[slowrider]

Agree with this. A SL will make a small hill ski bigger.

And your legs feel puny

 

[slow-line-fast]

And your legs feel puny

I resemble that comment

But yes, a 'consumer SL' (it doesn't say FIS on it), or a shorter radius sport carver will be a great tool for a small Northeast hill to step up the technique. Within that grouping you can let price guide you.

 

[Nobody]

I am from a different part of the world, I have nearly your identical background, good sound skier, longtime skier but not a racer. The program I am following is not the PSIA one, but I second those who before me are trying to talk you out of that, at least for the time being.
You will need those kind of skis, but only if in your certification program is included a timed GS race (a relaxed parameters Eurotest/CTT like race). Then you will need those, along with whole lot of specific GS gates training.
In the Fall of 2016 I went through an L1 program with a pair of 186 r21 Blizzard WRC (not really a true race ski but close enough) with a pair of 10ish years old Tecnica xt17. Because that was what I had available at the time which I thought could get me through the program. As it turned out that equipment choice was more of a drag than of help. And I would have provavly fared better with my Hot Rods...
It made the whole thing, in retrospect, a hog of a thing. That, in conjunction with a very low skiing days tally in the previous season (due to a car accidents in the summer of 2015 that nearly could have costed me my life, a very long convalescence and doctors forbidding me to ski the followimg season) caused me to barely pass the exam. The program manager had told us to get on an R17 R18 GS-like consumer graded ski (like the Hero of above, or Voelkl racetiger) indeed, that is the best choice for the whole progression. In Italy the candidates call those skis "arcing skis"... Performing but not real race skis. As it is, for my L2 I choose exactly that, Voelkl 175 racetiger gs (again, in retrospect , I would have preferred a 178-180 cm version, but the 178 would have been more of a race skis - talking about Voelkl, for example, that lenght is not available for the "consumer" racetigers, but is specific of the Pro or Master series, which mounts the marker piston plate), all went much, much better. The program coaches, btw, use those kind of skis, Racetiger Pro or Masters or equivalent from other brands (but they are on a whole different, higher, much higher technical level)...

 

[slowrider]

12-14m tr will keep you busy and tired. Ski friends tell me I turn too much....poppycock I say.

 

[cantunamunch]

I'm 5'10"ish, 175 lbs, and most of my skiing is at places with around 1400-1700' vertical. I like to open it up a bit when I feel safe - no crowds or mad straight-liners around, non-flat-light conditions - but I'm not one to take it up to mach looney much, if ever.

Never mind opening it up. Make 170 turns per run.

Within that grouping you can let price guide you.

Or just talk to @ScotsSkier about something used to start with.

 

[slow-line-fast]

Thanks @Nobody for your post.

I might be able to help clarify, instructor certifications in Europe (those I know, not a blanket statement) include a time trial in GS gates, where you have to be within some time of a trained racer who ran that course. It causes great stress, racks up private training costs, and sadly can result in injuries for the instructors going through it.

So to @Nobody, the post of @Raymond Slarver has nothing to do with this, because in the US there is no such race timing requirement for any instructor certification (the last I knew - and given this L100 chaos I hear about, I presume that is still the case).

@Nobody , if there was no such time trial requirement, and you were skiing on a slope of about 100 vertical meters with mostly ice, and wanted to choose a ski that would challenge you to improve your technique, what ski would you choose?

 

[David Orr]

Just 2 cents: I ski southeast groomed, hardpack, ice, boilerplate.

Head World Cup Rebel E-Speed Pro 17m at 175cm
Head World Cup Rebel E-Race Pro 15m at 175cm
Voelkl Racetiger GS Cheater Ski 18m at 178cm
Head World Cup Rebel E-Sl 12m at 165cm
Voelkl RaceTiger SL Cheater 12.6m at 165cm

Just depends on how many times you want to smile!

 

[slow-line-fast]

Just 2 cents: I ski southeast groomed, hardpack, ice, boilerplate.

Head World Cup Rebel E-Speed Pro 17m at 175cm
Head World Cup Rebel E-Race Pro 15m at 175cm
Voelkl Racetiger GS Cheater Ski 18m at 178cm
Head World Cup Rebel E-Sl 12m at 165cm
Voelkl RaceTiger SL Cheater 12.6m at 165cm

Just depends on how many times you want to smile!

Great list. Also other brands with similar specs.

 

[David Orr]

Great list. Also other brands with similar specs.

Absolutely ...Stockli, Atomic, etc...they all make great skis...

 

[Tony S]

Fellow Northeaster here. I've worked w/ a lot of 2's to 3's and my advise is to get a softer SL ski. It will allow you to progress at slower speeds and lesser space whilst teaching you to transition from fallline/2 footed/ squared / cross unders to sweeping/outside ski dominant/ countered / cross overs.

/thread