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Gym exercises for mogul absorption (frontside & backside)

slow-line-fast

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Jonny Moseley


Thanks for that, the first video I saw ages ago and had forgotten about. I remember thinking whaaat? when I first saw it, so awesome.

Hadn’t seen the second video before, appreciate that ‘40 year old version’ is still hopping along those holes, at least when an el niño is on the way :thumb:
 

cantunamunch

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clipless pedals on my singlespeed and take the saddle completely off.

Not joking - do any of you in this thread have a single speed or a fixie, and do you run it without the saddle, most particularly including standing spins at 80, 90, 100+ rpm?

That right there will activate hamstrings and hips at an unbelievable level.
 

Dave Marshak

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I rode a fixed gear for a long time. IT was good for building strenth and training up to a higher cadence. As I got older I needed ridiculously low gears, so I gave it up.

In general, I don't think cycling is very useful cross trainng for skiing. Cyclists tend to develop stiff backs, and more quadriceps strength than hamstring. Both of those are injury hazards for skiers. OTOH cycling develops aerobic power and the opposite muscles as running, without much injury risk, so it's good cross training for runners. Recreational skiers don't need anything except a healthy back.

dm
 

cantunamunch

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In general, I don't think cycling is very useful cross trainng for skiing. Cyclists tend to develop stiff backs, and more quadriceps strength than hamstring.

Exactly why I asked the question. Actually *using* more quadriceps than hamstring is an instant liability if you're standing at 90-100rpm.
 

Marathoner

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> It's like you are trying to learn skills in the gym. That never works. Build core strength, flexibilty and balance in the gym. Then the strength to perform ski movements will come quickly on the snow as skill developes.


Aside from the trampoline gymnastics, all the workouts in the video are taught in Crossfit training classes. These are highly varied functional movements performed at high intensity - these movements are designed to make you much stronger while increasing your aerobic capacity. I did Crossfit for a couple years starting in my mid-40s but had to stop because of injuries. These strength training movements are no joke - they are incredibly exhausting and you have to be committed, young (healing power!), and genetically gifted to be able to endure this level of training intensity. No wonder the national team in Canada trains this way.
 

Seldomski

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Aside from the trampoline gymnastics, all the workouts in the video are taught in Crossfit training classes. These are highly varied functional movements performed at high intensity - these movements are designed to make you much stronger while increasing your aerobic capacity. I did Crossfit for a couple years starting in my mid-40s but had to stop because of injuries. These strength training movements are no joke - they are incredibly exhausting and you have to be committed, young (healing power!), and genetically gifted to be able to endure this level of training intensity. No wonder the national team in Canada trains this way.

Yes, and exercise (2) in the OP is a wall ball shot. I've done over 100 of them in some crossfit workouts. There's actually a 'named workout' where you do 150 as quickly as you can and nothing else (I think it's called Karen). That one is terrible.

I have done (1) in the OP as well at Crossfit gyms, but not as mentioned. It was called a Russian hamstring curl and required a partner to do it.


Due to covid, I have not done crossfit in 16 months. I started crossfit in 2010. I have done some other workouts to stay in shape this past year-ish, but my fitness has definitely decreased. I did notice this decrease when skiing and intend to get back to it in the next few months - waiting for my broken hand to heal enough to do pushups first.
 

tball

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Not joking - do any of you in this thread have a single speed or a fixie, and do you run it without the saddle, most particularly including standing spins at 80, 90, 100+ rpm?

That right there will activate hamstrings and hips at an unbelievable level.
Anybody else have PowerCranks? I owe all my bump skiing prowess to them. ;)

It's been a while since I've ridden my PowerCranks bike. I need to get back on it this summer. Back in my fit days, I rode the Moab Century on PowerCranks. That hurt!
 

cantunamunch

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Anybody else have PowerCranks? I owe all my bump skiing prowess to them. ;)

I looked at them back when they came out, but that was a serious chunk of change for a bottom bracket. (And the SO back then was already sick of the Alenax, so).

It's been a while since I've ridden my PowerCranks bike. I need to get back on it this summer. Back in my fit days, I rode the Moab Century on PowerCranks. That hurt!

You seriously have one? RESPECT! First question - did you change your saddle height? Second question - did you rock back or forward on the saddle and need to reset the tilt? Did you get more than 1K miles on it in any season and thereby get a stronger adaptation? How was it out of the saddle and what cadence could you support? Did the supported cadence change with body mass (heavier legs get harder to reverse and snap up?)
 
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Wendy

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Anybody else have PowerCranks? I owe all my bump skiing prowess to them. ;)

It's been a while since I've ridden my PowerCranks bike. I need to get back on it this summer. Back in my fit days, I rode the Moab Century on PowerCranks. That hurt!
Oy! I only rode them on a trainer. That was hard enough, though it got more fun as I adapted. Perhaps I did like one ride on the road, I have a vague recollection of doing so.

@cantunamunch ….I would never torture myself by riding a fixie without a saddle. Not worth it to me! Back when I rode one regularly, I had good enough discipline to stay out the saddle for long periods of time until I fatigued….that was enough for me.

However, I’d think there’s a difference between hamstring/hip activation when pedaling, and bump skiing, when the hips are moving simultaneously.

I gave my road fixie to my nephew, and he rides it around Seoul, where he lives. ogsmile
 

Fuller

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I was just reading this thread this morning and then this pops up. A new video from Deb Armstrong / Bobby Aldighieri.

Bobby is in fantastic shape btw.

 

Wilhelmson

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Sometimes on the way downhill on a long hike I do something similar to the Armstrong video. I usually focus on my feet but will keep my hands up next time. That's cool about keeping the head up. Interesting that even pros have to continuously keep those movements engrained.
 

Fuller

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I spend way to much time looking at my skis - especially in the bumps.
 

Ron

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HOT OFF THE PRESS. New from Deb Armstrong. From the Rodeo grounds in Steamboat Springs.

 

Fuller

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Looking back on last season's attempt to not suck in the moguls, I don't think I had the absorption movement right - I think I was doing it just like the "don't do it that way" illustration. Towards the end of the season it may have been little better but not because I thought about it or anything. Honestly I have a tough time even imagining the correct movements and feelings of good bump skiing but I'm starting to get a grip on it and how it's going to feel next winter.
 

Ron

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too many people overlook the importance of dry land training and becoming aware of your body and how you move. Also, its important to start at the foundation; these things are boring and painful and they dont associate them with skiing so a lot of people just skip over them and look to what ski will make them better skiers.....

1- is your body in the correct position. many skiers do not know how to get into the "ready" position. Many have muscular or skeletal issues that prevent this from occurring. You can fix a lot of this through basic exercises and most importantly, adopting a regular stretching regime. But, having awareness is the first step. A full length mirror is very helpful to use while doing exercises. My favorite ski drill is one-legged squats. it will show misalignment issues right away. I learned to do these during my many rehabs from various surgeries, they are the #1 prescribed exercise by my PT. you dont need to go more than 45* or even less to get good results. You might need to use ski poles to help your balance when beginning and its more important to use correct form than to be wobbling and using poor form. Focus on the form and also muscle recruitment and firing. According to my PT, a large % of people's muscles dont fire correctly or at all when doing squats. remember: heels, arch, toe (just like skiing too) try doing a couple sets of 15 on each leg and then on both legs. Dont be surprised that you are quite sore the next day.

2- Strengthening your core and cardio work, (always consult your medical pro 1st). its amazing how quickly you will break from correct form and movement if your core is weak (core includes back) and your cardio efficiency is poor. Once you exceed your VO2Max,(functioning above your ability to bring in O2) things will fall apart. It doesnt matter how strong your legs are. Your core strength works with your Cardio in that your diaphragm needs to be able to function while breathing hard. A solid core helps to facilitate that. Also, your core is your frame. if the frame is weak, everything else suffers. Another great reason for cycling.

3- Looking ahead. looking at the bump directly in front of you is skiing in the past. Your brain can assess the terrain, angles and all that it needs in ~.10th of a second (thank evolution for that for saving you from angry predators) so looking at the bump in front of you is literally holding you back, you are denying your brains ability to prepare for the next turn and the turns after. I put this in the dry land training section because you can develop this in your every day living and if you bike, its a great way to improve your bike handling as well. Start off by becoming aware of where you currently look and then start by carefully lengthening where you are looking. this also effectively gets your core to begin to turn towards the new turn (or direction) earlier making it easier to turn your skis. even subtle movements with a tipped ski can make dramatic differences and use much less energy.

4 Boot set up. Yep, you have heard it many times before but if your boots aren't set up correctly (meaning static as well as active movements) when you flex, the boots wont' direct the skis in the intended direction. For bumps this is critical. All movements afterwards are correctional to adjust the skis or direction you intend to ski. this is very inefficient.

Finally. watch that video I embed above. that movement pattern is not typical for most but is highly efficient and effective. I am still working on it but it is more fluent for sure.
 
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Fuller

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@Ron do you have a video example of your preferred one legged squat? Apparently there's more than one way do do them...
 

Ron

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@Ron do you have a video example of your preferred one legged squat? Apparently there's more than one way do do them...

Let me do some searching but its pretty straightforward. At PT we stand in sock feet but if you know you pronate or supinate, its better to do them in a shoe with an orthotic. you can use a ski pole (or any pole but ski pole is more fun) to start if you balance isn't good or you cant do at least 10 without falling over. The idea is build strength and proprioception by getting those large and small muscles firing correctly in your feet to your hips and Glutes. standing on one foot, go into a squat, using the same form as a two footed squat. (unweighted leg stays along side the weighted leg, not out in front) You only need to go down 60* if that's all you can do and stayed balanced and stacked, knees only to your toes and stay aligned. Go slow to get the most of the exercise. (4 count) . the key is to extend fully at the top to engage your glutes and hip flexors. It also makes it more challenging. As your balance and strength permits, go a little lower and maybe try it without a ski pole but DO NOT break form. its the most critical part of the exercise. Try doing 2 sets of 15 on each leg and then a couple of 2 legged. if you want, carry a couple dumbbells for the 2 legged.
 
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no edge

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They are called pistols at Crossfit. We use a jump box which allows you to let your leg drop to an easier angle to do the drill. I find them hard to do. Everyone seems to have some little enhancement that helps with technique. Some of the new people use a stretch band to assist the push back up.

They are tough just standing on a flat surface. Some of the guys and women could knock em out as if they were squats. Pistols were normally blended into a WOD - with 2, 3, or 4 other exercises - and timed
 

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