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How's the edge tuning quality by Razor tune?

TheArchitect

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For most tools that I intended to keep, I generally go with the "Buy once, cry once" mantra.
For disposable tools, I buy Dewalt. :duck::ogbiggrin:

I'm partial to Milwaukee, Bosch and Makita but have some Dewalt. Festool would be nice if I had the need.
 

Rich_Ease_3051

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Hi all. Need your input before I finalise shopping cart.

I have 1 ski, Volkl Deacon Vwerks, and I don't see myself owning a quiver of skis in the forseeble. Except maybe for a rock ski that I will buy on the cheap like an ex-demo or 2nd hand. So 2 skis.

I only ski around 2-4 weeks a year.

So planned cart is the Corded 2 wheel kit that comes with
- medium wheel (for daily sharpening)
- coarse wheel (for resetting side edge as the ski gets old and used)
- 2 degree and 3 degree wedge

Will add a battery pack and battery charger.

My question is with the Deacon side bevel, which is 2.4 degrees. Should I buy an additional WC wedge kit, which includes a .5 shim, a 1 degree wedge, and 4 degree wedge, which all up is just an additional $30? Or get a dedicated 2.5 wedge for instead for $100?

 

Dave Marshak

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Skip the extra shims. 2 and 3 degrees is all you need. Maybe even just one of the two. No one uses 1 degrees and only racers need use 4. Half degrees is splitting hairs.

dm
 

Rich_Ease_3051

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Skip the extra shims. 2 and 3 degrees is all you need. Maybe even just one of the two. No one uses 1 degrees and only racers need use 4. Half degrees is splitting hairs.

dm
Makes sense. Will follow that. Thanks Dave.
 

anders_nor

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half degree makes 0 sense

I use 3 for race skis and the racy recreational skis

2 for everything else


some like 3 for everything, imho lighter skiers
 

Rich_Ease_3051

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Anything else I need to go with Razer Tune besides a sidewall planer?

So far been only tinkering with edges with soft gummy stone to spot rub rust.

I bought a swix red stone in case of stone hits, which fortunately I haven't had used yet.

Planning on buying a white ceramic stone to smooth out the base once in a while, which I heard from youtube is the only regular maintenance that needs to be done on base edge. Can I just run the fine ceramic stone on the base edge by hand? Without a bevel guide?
 
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Dave Marshak

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I don't think the coarse wheel is very useful. You will still need to use a stone to work down rock hit damage because the grinder is not powerful enough for that. It's easy enough to reset the side edge angle with a file. I only use the fine wheel with my EVO, and my friends who have RTs do the same. YMMV

dm
 

Rich_Ease_3051

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You will still need to use a stone to work down rock hit damage because the grinder is not powerful enough for that.
How about with extra coarse wheel? The marketing blurb in their page says
Abrasive Wheel
The abrasive wheel uses a synthetic super-abrasive that provides better dry-grinding than diamond. It grinds through work-hardened rock hits with ease.

 
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KingGrump

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Prior to filing and/or grinding the side edge. It's always good practice to pull back the sidewall a bit. Not too much. One of the function of the sidewall is to provide support the steel edges. The primary purpose of pulling back the sidewall is to prevent the sidewall material from fouling/clogging the file or grinding wheel. A side wall cutter will remove the side wall material in a expedient manner when there is enough side wall height to accommodate the cutter. Will probably need a panzer file in a 6° or 7° guide for the tip and tail area where the top and bottom titanal/composite layers converge.

It's always good practice to deburr the edges with a 100 or 200 grit diamond stone to remove the case hardened burrs prior to filing and/or grinding. Otherwise the work hardened burrs will make a mess of the file and/or grinding wheel. Even though the grinding wheel abrasive is generally harder than the work hardened burrs, the speed of the grinding wheel impacting the burrs will probably cause premature wear on the grinding wheels.

OTOH, the wheels are extremely durable when use with care. My RazorTune unit was purchased in Nov, 2017. Haven't remotely come close to wearing out any of the wheels yet. I do deburr with a 100 or 200 grit diamond stone prior to using the Razortune. The coarse wheel is used only to reset side edge angles. Usually when the skis are new (to me). The medium wheel is used for majority of the time. The fine wheel is there just in case. Used it couple times. The skis do not appear to skied any better (or worse).
To put things in context. I usually do about 30 to 40 pairs of skis for myself, friends and family at at the start of every season. For skiing in the NE early season, I usually edge tune our skis every 3 to 5 days. Out west, every 6 to 10 days. Depending on snow conditions. Our season is usually 120+ days. The exception was 2020 when everything was shut down on March 15. That was a 90 days season.

You'll probably need a fixed guide matching your desired side edge angle and file to blend in at the tip and tail where the machine does not reach. The start and stop points on the side edges can be ragged,

Both the machine and wheels are very durable when used with a little care and periodic maintenance. It is not fool proof. Since we all know fools are so ingenious. The unit does take a little getting use to., Work on a pair of old skis to get the motion right before committing your new Deacon.
 

Dave Marshak

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The abrasive wheel ... grinds through work-hardened rock hits with ease.[/I]
I've never used a RT but my EVO is definitely not powerful enough to grind through rock hits. In any event, you'll need to work rock hits out of the base edge with a stone, and I think it's easier to work the side edge the same way, without spooling up the grinder. YMMV.

FWIW my friends who have RTs use the fine disc almost exclusively. The same with my EVO.

dm
 

sparty

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I've never used a RT but my EVO is definitely not powerful enough to grind through rock hits. In any event, you'll need to work rock hits out of the base edge with a stone, and I think it's easier to work the side edge the same way, without spooling up the grinder. YMMV.

FWIW my friends who have RTs use the fine disc almost exclusively. The same with my EVO.

dm
My experience has been that the coarse stone with an Evo is enough for mild-to-moderate rock damage and for setting a new bevel (at least when increasing it). I generally use the medium stone to get my all-mountain skis "good enough" if they don't have any significant damage, while my firm-snow skis just get the fine stone unless they have either minor rock damage or I've been lazy and it's been longer than it should've since the last tune.

YMMV, of course.
 

Dave Marshak

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My experience has been that the coarse stone with an Evo is enough for mild-to-moderate rock damage and for setting a new bevel...
That's good to know but it's not enough to get me to buy another disc. You still need to work rock damage on the base by hand, and I can easily to do the side edge the same way. YMMV

dm
 

TheArchitect

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Let’s say I was to buy a Razor Tune just for sharpening and not to reset the side edges. How often would I need to cut back the sidewall? Each time you use the RT seems like a lot so I’m guessing it’s less often?
 

Wade

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Let’s say I was to buy a Razor Tune just for sharpening and not to reset the side edges. How often would I need to cut back the sidewall? Each time you use the RT seems like a lot so I’m guessing it’s less often?

The sidewalls need to be cut back with exactly the same frequency as if hand tuning. The thing you’re trying to avoid is having the tool contact the sidewall in addition to the edge. It doesn’t matter whether that tool is a file, a diamond stone or a razor tune.
 

KingGrump

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Let’s say I was to buy a Razor Tune just for sharpening and not to reset the side edges. How often would I need to cut back the sidewall? Each time you use the RT seems like a lot so I’m guessing it’s less often?

Usually I will pull back the sidewall at the start of the season. That will be good for 3 or 4 tunes. After that I will do a pass or two with a panzer on a 6/7° side edge guide just to make sure the sidewall does not gum up the grinding and/or file.
 

mdf

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@KingGrump is more precise than I am. I usually take off a little more sidewall than I intended, and can go more tunes than that before I have to do it again.
When hand tuning it is pretty obvious when the sidewalls are interfering, because they leave different-colored debris on the stone. Rather than trying to tell with a power edger, I do an occaisional pass (not every tune) with a stone to check.
 

Dave Marshak

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When I used a panzer, I could sharpen 2 or 3 times before I needed to cut back the sidewall again. Now I use a medium file on a 7 degree guide every time. (The panzer doesn't fit.) It's easier for me to use the file guide every time than the panzer once every 3 days. YMMV.

dm
 

TheArchitect

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Thanks, all! That gives me an idea. Off to read up on sidewall cutter options.
 

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