Intermediate vs Advanced vs Expert skiers: labels

[Guy in Shorts]

Call myself a daily skier. Go out every day to get my exercise and move to the best ability. In the advancing age category the more important label is are you moving effectively enough to prevent becoming a target?

 

[Cheizz]

What manufacturers label their gear is one thing. What the design brief is/was is another. What the actual properties of a specific product actually ARE is yet another thing, IMO. The latter is what matters. Not the label someone has put on it.

Here's what I mean: https://gigiski.com/ski-philosophy/

 

[James]

What manufacturers label their gear is one thing. What the design brief is/was is another. What the actual properties of a specific product actually ARE is yet another thing, IMO. The latter is what matters. Not the label someone has put on it.

Here's what I mean: https://gigiski.com/ski-philosophy/

Did you ever try the Stance 90 this season? I was quite pleased with it after 5 days in 4Vallées. Lots of subtlety to that ski for advanced users, can’t see it punishing intermediates.

 

[Cheizz]

The 90 was ok, IMO. Could be a bit strong for a cruising intermediate though. With my 90 kg no problem, I'll bust them through anything. But it wouldn't be my first choice to recommend.

 

[dovski]

You're an expert? I'm so much more experter than you.

To be clear anything you can do I can do better, all of my skiing is better than yours …. This could be our new theme song lol

 

[BLiP]

To be clear anything you can do I can do better, all of my skiing is better than yours

If someone makes this statement and doesn't include pics of their FIS/Olympic medals, I'm going to assume that they ski with jeans tucked into their boots

 

[dovski]

If someone makes this statement and doesn't include pics of their FIS/Olympic medals, I'm going to assume that they ski with jeans tucked into their boots

@BLiP I hope you picked up in the sarcasm of my post as well as the ones that preceded it. For the record I am quite sure that @markojp is a better skier than me, but that was not the real point of my post. Also Candide Thovex does not have any FIS/Olympic medals so do not agree with your statement about what it takes to be considered an expert skier. Just saying the world of skiing is much more than just FIS and Olympics these days

 

[BLiP]

@dovski I hope you picked up in the sarcasm of my post

 

[dovski]

@dovski I hope you picked up in the sarcasm of my post

I did, but then you had to bring jeans into the mix ... and I think this pair has gators lol

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[Pajarito-bred]

I did, but then you had to bring jeans into the mix ... and I think this pair has gators lol


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The entire market for this appalling apparel appears to appeal to "sarcastic experts who don't mind intense ridicule of their apparent lack of skiwear fashion expertise". Non-experts would just ski in jeans since they might not appreciate the benefits of gaiters and waterproof fabric. I need to see if I can find my 80's corduroy ski pants for the end-of-season ski party.

One benefit of acquiring my far-advanced chronological condition is the ability to be completely unconcerned with the prospect of whether I'm being judged by casual observers from the lift or in the lodge, on my skiing ability, skiwear, beverage choice, or anything else. It sure is fun though, to judge others' technique or apparel while riding the lift, calling out "Yellow Onesie!" (2 points, Evel Kneivel Onesies are 3 points).

think the why some resorts will only label up to single black diamond (e.g. Palisades Tahoe); is one of the attributes of being beyond "advanced"; is you have learned the skills to be able to evaluate a run by yourself, including from below or from a scoping run including factoring in conditions; and you do not need it "labelled" and categorized for you by the resort.

So it is a self identifying. If you have to ask is this "advanced" or "expert" or "double black"; you aren't an expert, and probably not even "advanced".

This is a key point. If you can ski thru a 2x black diamond access gate knowing it will be an enjoyable challenge, can confidently link turns in steep glades, among rocky obstacles, in manky snow (and have enough experience to know the importance of considering the skills of others in your group, changes snow and weather conditions before making the decision to enter the gate), you just might be an expert (omg is that a Jeff Foxworthy paraphrase)?

Alta also does not have any double-black terrain... Of course they do, but it's not labeled as 2x, and there are plenty of areas that seem really nice to intermediates, mellow meadows that funnel into narrow, rocky steep moguled challenges for those unwary-- may or may not be through a gate or beyond an obvious sign that indicates the trail designation.

But those who shouldn't be on that terrain do not know what they don't know (gratuitous Don Rumsfeld paraphrase). It's not so easy for ski resorts and patrol to ensure skiers don't aimlessly wander into terrain they can't safely navigate, hence the "experts only" gates and ominous warning signs. Is that the responsibility of the resort, or of each skier, or both, to ensure that "non-experts" don't get "over-terrained"?

Plenty of folks are happy to just make stylish turns on mellow groomers, and could still be "expert-level" skiers without learning skills needed in ski steep, narrow chutes. The "having the most fun skiing" label is a pretty good goal, I have no need for one that's skill-based-- it's enough challenge to hold onto some of the abilities my younger self once might have claimed to have had. I've heard that I ski like I learned to ski in the 1960's, that's correct but I don't really know if that's an insult or a compliment.

 

[mister moose]

Vewy scahwey skiing ahead. Medal holders only.

 

[dbostedo]

View attachment 164885

Vewy scahwey skiing ahead. Medal holders only.

Ah... suspect "Experts" signs... I've got one. I took this one at Massanutten, VA, heading toward a shortish bump run (just past the drop off) with a typical western blue run steepness... It's a black run at Massanutten because it has bumps.

 

[Varmintmist]

This thread went into the weeds

I'm a "Terminal Intermediate" Clydesdale.

At 6' 243lb that has been rode hard and put up wet more than once, it works for me.

My observations are that Intermediate covers a LOT of ground and the number level comes closer. Intermediate covers "I can get down a blue taking my snow plow to parallel halfway through each turn" to "I hit some steep black groomers with speed and nice linked turns", and as far as I can tell that is the same across the US at least.
As far as "expert" that is also subjective.
Its a whole lot different than other sports. I know I am an expert because master is a avg of 95/100 across the course with a service rifle for 240 shots and my avg hovers between 94.53 and 94.96 because I havent yet put enough good scores together at the same time to up the avg. Until every skier skis on the exact same runs and each is independently evaluated in each part with a hard standard, the whole thing is subjective at best.
Now, all of this only matters if you are trying to figure out what you need to work on, or are going to take a lesson and dont need to waste other peoples time. As to what others want to rate you, it doesnt matter. Opinions are ....

 

[Wilhelmson]

They had the High Consequence terrain sign up earlier this year. I guess because it was icy. Pretty grippy imo

 

[David Chaus]

This thread went into the weeds

As far as "expert" that is also subjective.
Its a whole lot different than other sports. I know I am an expert because master is a avg of 95/100 across the course with a service rifle for 240 shots and my avg hovers between 94.53 and 94.96 because I havent yet put enough good scores together at the same time to up the avg. Until every skier skis on the exact same runs and each is independently evaluated in each part with a hard standard, the whole thing is subjective at best.
Now, all of this only matters if you are trying to figure out what you need to work on, or are going to take a lesson and dont need to waste other peoples time. As to what others want to rate you, it doesnt matter. Opinions are ....

You, my friend, are a strong candidate for biathlon.

 

[Varmintmist]

You, my friend, are a strong candidate for biathlon.

Yeah, ummmm nope. Way to old and fat.

Those guys and gals are just amazing. They are pumping hard then shooting just to not get a penalty. Biathalon 50M offhand is under a 5in target. 50M prone is 1.77inches, open sights, timed, after racing x country. I got some points and a hard leg, so if the ammo crunch allows, I am trying to get a distinguished badge. My heart beat can take me out of the black at 600yd on a not good day after relaxing for 20 min and my offhand last year was 88-91 mostly with a couple glimmers of adequacy. No way I could hold with those folks. Nothing but respect.

Now if its downhill with flintlocks for bragging rights and whisky, I'm in.
All in proper attire. Wool blanket or loin cloth and Murse. Its a Man Purse unless you have a dead animal on your head, then its a possibles bag.

 

[David Chaus]

Now if its downhill with flintlocks for bragging rights and whisky, I'm in.
All in proper attire. Wool blanket or loin cloth and Murse. Its a Man Purse unless you have a dead animal on your head, then its a possibles bag.

Should be an Olympic event.

 

[Alba Adventures]

I'm way better than all you guys...

Completely forgot about this film. Look how young Cody was here and this isn't that long ago. We like to say, we suck though suck less than many. Does that qualify?

 

[Marker]

Yeah, ummmm nope. Way to old and fat.

Now if its downhill with flintlocks for bragging rights and whisky, I'm in.
All in proper attire. Wool blanket or loin cloth and Murse. Its a Man Purse unless you have a dead animal on your head, then its a possibles bag.

Should be an Olympic event.

We have a winner! As seen at Killington during the Bear Mountain Mogul Challenge last weekend.

 

[Alba Adventures]

We have a winner! As seen at Killington during the Bear Mountain Mogul Challenge last weekend.
View attachment 165782

Birdman aka Roger- he is a great guy too. We have filmed him a couple of times and in-fact he was part of our finale edit last season. OSTARA is the name of the film...

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