Still in the stock liners. My right foot is going to need more, too. I’ll probably explore options in the fall. I’m inclined to go with the Mimic Pro liner since it should interface with the boots the best and I can use the Atomic tongue I bought.@AmyPJ can't recall, did you end up staying with the stock liners or are you using aftermarket? I am asking because my DIY fix for my even lower volume right foot has packed out some and am wondering if I need something more.
@AmyPJ Based on your descriptions throughout this thread, I’m honestly surprised they want to put you in RS 110. If the ZJ+ were too much volume for you, the RS 110 would be even more volume. I guess are they thinking sized down they will fit better?Welp, I visited Brent Amsbury in PC yesterday and I need to be in a 21.5 My ankles measure 20, my instep and foot measure 21. Length measures 23. In the meantime, he heated the ZipFits I already have from my previous boots, built in a very thin volume reducer on the boot board, and added dense-ish foam padding to the tongue to help snug that area up for me. They did ski much better today as I've been struggling again lately--his first question was if my ankles get rolling around and I have trouble edging. Yup! Canting is damn near spot-on with 1 degree inward on both boots.
The Redsters are also too stiff. Easy to remedy thankfully. Not sure what shell I'll end up in next year. He wants me in a Lange RS 110 short cuff in 21.5. There are very few manufacturers making a true 21.5 anymore. He doesn't love putting recreational skiers in a race boot because the boot board is towards the inside edge, making them difficult to run flat and very aggressive. I've done fine with them but flats have been quite unsettling for sure. I'd join the two boot club if I could have both boots in the same BSL. But that won't happen.
I'm going to soften the Redsters to see how that feels. They felt pretty awesome today in an incredible amount of powder but the stiffness was making things a bit challenging especially on my weaker left side.
He commented more than once, "yep, your feet are tiny."
Wait wait wait wait wait. Noooooooo!Welp, I visited Brent Amsbury in PC yesterday and I need to be in a 21.5 My ankles measure 20, my instep and foot measure 21. Length measures 23. In the meantime, he heated the ZipFits I already have from my previous boots, built in a very thin volume reducer on the boot board, and added dense-ish foam padding to the tongue to help snug that area up for me. They did ski much better today as I've been struggling again lately--his first question was if my ankles get rolling around and I have trouble edging. Yup! Canting is damn near spot-on with 1 degree inward on both boots.
The Redsters are also too stiff. Easy to remedy thankfully. Not sure what shell I'll end up in next year. He wants me in a Lange RS 110 short cuff in 21.5. There are very few manufacturers making a true 21.5 anymore. He doesn't love putting recreational skiers in a race boot because the boot board is towards the inside edge, making them difficult to run flat and very aggressive. I've done fine with them but flats have been quite unsettling for sure. I'd join the two boot club if I could have both boots in the same BSL. But that won't happen.
I'm going to soften the Redsters to see how that feels. They felt pretty awesome today in an incredible amount of powder but the stiffness was making things a bit challenging especially on my weaker left side.
He commented more than once, "yep, your feet are tiny."
To add to my earlier post, even if you did want a rec boot and not a race boot, my understanding is that Lange low volume rec boots are more generous on volume than every (or almost every) other brand’s low volume boot.@AmyPJ Based on your descriptions throughout this thread, I’m honestly surprised they want to put you in RS 110. If the ZJ+ were too much volume for you, the RS 110 would be even more volume. I guess are they thinking sized down they will fit better?
I seem to have a narrowish ankle and skinny lower leg and I have too much room around my ankle and cuff in my RX 110 LV boots in size 24.5. Zipfits made it better, but I’m still exploring lower volume boot options. I actually tried on ZJ+ and it seemed to fit my ankle and lower leg better than my RX LV boots.
My solution for my low volume heel, ankle and lower leg - Intuition MV Dreamliner.I went to Brent Amsbury in Park City. He has been great to communicate with via email between appointments. First thing he did was measure every aspect of my foot. 23.5 length, 20 to 21 everywhere else. (He shook his head and said, "holy cow".) He then looked at where my ankle bones hit in relation to the cuff hinge. Too low. Looked at my short tibia--dragged a 21.5 RS short cuff and threw my foot into it. I asked him about the Lange being so similar to the ZJ, but he said the heel pocket in the RS is actually smaller than the ZJ+ (remember the "+" there) when going from a 22.5 down to a 21.5.
I picked up a pair of the Lange RS SC 110 and took them and the Redsters to him for an assessment. In many ways, they are sixes EXCEPT the short cuff AND my malleoli line up better with the hinge of the RS. He had cut the sides of the cuffs on the Redsters on my prior visit, put a thin, permanent shim on the boot boards, and molded my ZipFits to them (he does really quality work.) I still cannot STAND the tongues in the ZipFits, so I went back to the stock liner. He spent an hour looking at both feet in both shells with insoles in, then noticed I have an indentation above my right lateral malleolus (ankle bone.) Took out a little stick thing to check nerve sensations, and wouldn't you know it, I have what appears to be nerve damage on that area of my ankle, likely atrophy from my tibial plateau fracture in 2015, which likely explains much of why my right foot and ankle just don't feel "right". And why I hate the ZipFit tongues especially on that side. I wanted to ski them again this week just to make sure I felt what I felt, but I've been sick
We then began discussing the differences between the two boots. I still freakin love the Redsters--on groomers, except on flats where I have to widen my stance greatly or always edge them. I have yet to get along with them in crud and powder. I had sent him video of me skiing and he feels that the aggressiveness of the cant and rail on that boot is too much for how UNaggressively I ski. And the cuff is too tall (although it is a good two cm shorter than the ZJ+ on the front and back where he didn't cut--interesting observation.)
For shits and grins, I skied about 1500 vertical in the Langes last weekend. (It's all my toes could tolerate.) No canting, right out of the box. I cannot explain why, but the turn radius of my skis felt way tighter, my stance was naturally wider, and for the first time EVER, I could feel my feet doing the skiing, not my shins. So the plan is to foam a Sidas Race Pro liner and tongue in the fall for the Lange shell. It seems that the short cuff is something I've needed all along and he is the first fitter to clue in on that, maybe because I'm not short overall but my tibia is. He explained to me that a short cuff boot is going to lock in down lower on my leg and ankle.
I'll go into next season with two workable pair of boots. I did throw an old Boot Doc foamed tongue I had in storage into the Redsters and am a lot happier with that. (Side note: Why can't all boots come with removable tongues??)
Yes, the Redsters come in a short cuff, but only up to a 90 flex. There are a few others that do also, but again, a 90 flex. It seems I am some kind of 1%er, and not in the way I wish I were!
I went to Brent Amsbury in Park City. He has been great to communicate with via email between appointments. First thing he did was measure every aspect of my foot. 23.5 length, 20 to 21 everywhere else. (He shook his head and said, "holy cow".) He then looked at where my ankle bones hit in relation to the cuff hinge. Too low. Looked at my short tibia--dragged a 21.5 RS short cuff and threw my foot into it. I asked him about the Lange being so similar to the ZJ, but he said the heel pocket in the RS is actually smaller than the ZJ+ (remember the "+" there) when going from a 22.5 down to a 21.5.
I picked up a pair of the Lange RS SC 110 and took them and the Redsters to him for an assessment. In many ways, they are sixes EXCEPT the short cuff AND my malleoli line up better with the hinge of the RS. He had cut the sides of the cuffs on the Redsters on my prior visit, put a thin, permanent shim on the boot boards, and molded my ZipFits to them (he does really quality work.) I still cannot STAND the tongues in the ZipFits, so I went back to the stock liner. He spent an hour looking at both feet in both shells with insoles in, then noticed I have an indentation above my right lateral malleolus (ankle bone.) Took out a little stick thing to check nerve sensations, and wouldn't you know it, I have what appears to be nerve damage on that area of my ankle, likely atrophy from my tibial plateau fracture in 2015, which likely explains much of why my right foot and ankle just don't feel "right". And why I hate the ZipFit tongues especially on that side. I wanted to ski them again this week just to make sure I felt what I felt, but I've been sick
We then began discussing the differences between the two boots. I still freakin love the Redsters--on groomers, except on flats where I have to widen my stance greatly or always edge them. I have yet to get along with them in crud and powder. I had sent him video of me skiing and he feels that the aggressiveness of the cant and rail on that boot is too much for how UNaggressively I ski. And the cuff is too tall (although it is a good two cm shorter than the ZJ+ on the front and back where he didn't cut--interesting observation.)
For shits and grins, I skied about 1500 vertical in the Langes last weekend. (It's all my toes could tolerate.) No canting, right out of the box. I cannot explain why, but the turn radius of my skis felt way tighter, my stance was naturally wider, and for the first time EVER, I could feel my feet doing the skiing, not my shins. So the plan is to foam a Sidas Race Pro liner and tongue in the fall for the Lange shell. It seems that the short cuff is something I've needed all along and he is the first fitter to clue in on that, maybe because I'm not short overall but my tibia is. He explained to me that a short cuff boot is going to lock in down lower on my leg and ankle.
I'll go into next season with two workable pair of boots. I did throw an old Boot Doc foamed tongue I had in storage into the Redsters and am a lot happier with that. (Side note: Why can't all boots come with removable tongues??)
Yes, the Redsters come in a short cuff, but only up to a 90 flex. There are a few others that do also, but again, a 90 flex. It seems I am some kind of 1%er, and not in the way I wish I were!
^^ Brent said essentially the same thing. What's been so frustrating for the past 7 years is that I could have skied in almost any of the boots I was in...on my left foot. I have voiced that more than once. I even had my right knee checked by an ortho two 2 years after my initial injury and he declared a torn LCL. How badly torn? Don't know. It doesn't bother me anymore (it was sore when I skied for quite awhile) and any instability I felt there has all but disappeared BUT it does seem the TPF injury, while seeming pretty minor at the time, has caused more issues than I was aware. I essentially have some wonky nerve sensations in my right ankle/foot. Sometimes just having an answer like this is helpful to push the mind past the issue.
Another observation from Brent is that I should have an easier time tipping wider skis on edge on a short cuff boot. Note that the only side I have trouble doing this is on my right side...
I won't mind having two legit pair of boots to ski. They are 5mm difference in BSL so I won't have to remount bindings.
Thanks for the detailed post and the info on the heel pocket of the 21.5 RS110 vs 22.5 ZJ+. I wouldn’t have expected that.I went to Brent Amsbury in Park City. He has been great to communicate with via email between appointments. First thing he did was measure every aspect of my foot. 23.5 length, 20 to 21 everywhere else. (He shook his head and said, "holy cow".) He then looked at where my ankle bones hit in relation to the cuff hinge. Too low. Looked at my short tibia--dragged a 21.5 RS short cuff and threw my foot into it. I asked him about the Lange being so similar to the ZJ, but he said the heel pocket in the RS is actually smaller than the ZJ+ (remember the "+" there) when going from a 22.5 down to a 21.5.
I picked up a pair of the Lange RS SC 110 and took them and the Redsters to him for an assessment. In many ways, they are sixes EXCEPT the short cuff AND my malleoli line up better with the hinge of the RS. He had cut the sides of the cuffs on the Redsters on my prior visit, put a thin, permanent shim on the boot boards, and molded my ZipFits to them (he does really quality work.) I still cannot STAND the tongues in the ZipFits, so I went back to the stock liner. He spent an hour looking at both feet in both shells with insoles in, then noticed I have an indentation above my right lateral malleolus (ankle bone.) Took out a little stick thing to check nerve sensations, and wouldn't you know it, I have what appears to be nerve damage on that area of my ankle, likely atrophy from my tibial plateau fracture in 2015, which likely explains much of why my right foot and ankle just don't feel "right". And why I hate the ZipFit tongues especially on that side. I wanted to ski them again this week just to make sure I felt what I felt, but I've been sick
We then began discussing the differences between the two boots. I still freakin love the Redsters--on groomers, except on flats where I have to widen my stance greatly or always edge them. I have yet to get along with them in crud and powder. I had sent him video of me skiing and he feels that the aggressiveness of the cant and rail on that boot is too much for how UNaggressively I ski. And the cuff is too tall (although it is a good two cm shorter than the ZJ+ on the front and back where he didn't cut--interesting observation.)
For shits and grins, I skied about 1500 vertical in the Langes last weekend. (It's all my toes could tolerate.) No canting, right out of the box. I cannot explain why, but the turn radius of my skis felt way tighter, my stance was naturally wider, and for the first time EVER, I could feel my feet doing the skiing, not my shins. So the plan is to foam a Sidas Race Pro liner and tongue in the fall for the Lange shell. It seems that the short cuff is something I've needed all along and he is the first fitter to clue in on that, maybe because I'm not short overall but my tibia is. He explained to me that a short cuff boot is going to lock in down lower on my leg and ankle.
I'll go into next season with two workable pair of boots. I did throw an old Boot Doc foamed tongue I had in storage into the Redsters and am a lot happier with that. (Side note: Why can't all boots come with removable tongues??)
Yes, the Redsters come in a short cuff, but only up to a 90 flex. There are a few others that do also, but again, a 90 flex. It seems I am some kind of 1%er, and not in the way I wish I were!
I have NO idea how valid it is--I still have the ZJ+ and the biggest difference I see is how tall the cuffs are, even compared to the Redster.Thanks for the detailed post and the info on the heel pocket of the 21.5 RS110 vs 22.5 ZJ+. I wouldn’t have expected that.
So is the heel pocket of the regular ZJ different than the ZJ+? Lange publishes almost no info on the difference of the 92mm vs 92mm+ lasts.
No worries @AmyPJ. Like I said, the difference of Lange 92mm vs 92mm+ lasts was a bit of a black box for me, but huge thanks to @otto for clarifying!!I have NO idea how valid it is--I still have the ZJ+ and the biggest difference I see is how tall the cuffs are, even compared to the Redster.
I'd be needing an aftermarket custom-foamed liner in either boot--RS or Redster.
He then looked at where my ankle bones hit in relation to the cuff hinge. Too low.
Cuff can be cut, no? The Head B series even had a line to cut at inside.Yes, the Redsters come in a short cuff, but only up to a 90 flex. There are a few others that do also, but again, a 90 flex. It seems I am some kind of 1%er, and not in the way I wish I were!