guy who won was a 40-45pt GS skier <10 years ago, so ...
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Masters GS skis: glossary request ('cheater', 'tweener', 'masters', etc)
- Thread starter slow-line-fast
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As a nascent neophyte Masters skier I have great interest in this topic. Long turn sport carving skis are OK for NASTAR and Beer League, but are not the best option for Masters, at least in the West. Likewise, my skills are not yet ready for a 30m FIS ski. I figured I would amplify my experiences with several GS skis with radii above 20m and less than 30m that I have tried in my quest to learn how to race again:
Note that all of these skis have a 0.5/3 tune by StartHaus
Nordica Doberman GSR RB FDT 185/20.5m (114-69-97): Much like the Rossi Hero Master skis, this Nordica lies in the grey zone between a NASTAR/beer league racer and a true Masters ski, being slightly too wide at the waist and a bit short on turn radius. I spent much of last year on them trying to get comfortable with a modern GS type ski. Although offering a shorter turn radius, they are nonetheless reasonably powerful with good stability at speed. They demand good technique to work well.
Atomic Redster G9 RS 183/24m (105-67.5/89): This year ScotsSkier recommended I go with the Atomic 183/24m; unsurprisingly he was entirely correct, as this has proven the perfect ski for my current skill set. For me this is the most versatile option of these 20+m Masters skis. Turn initiation is extremely easy and it is simple to vary the turn shape. They have a large sweet spot and are tolerant of my mistakes--allowing quick recovery instead of launching me off course. This ease of use comes with perhaps a bit less stability and strength than some of the other skis here. There is also a 190/27.5m version of this Atomic. It looks like the new Head Masters skis offer a similar approach with a slightly wide 68mm waist and turn radii in the 22-28m range.
Head Worldcup Rebels i.GS RD Pro 186/25m (104-65-87): While requiring a bit more effort to start the turn with my current limited skills, once on edge, they are solidly locked to the snow like a Bullet train riding rails. They offer a taught ride and are a bit less tolerant of any errors, but they are extremely powerful and stable, with no discernable speed limit.
Stockli Laser FIS GS 184/25.5m (approx 103/65/84): As with most Stockli Lasers I have used, these skis became more responsive with the bindings moved forward a cm or so. They offer a smooth supple ride, easily blasting through hard ruts and ripples with aplomb. They are not quite as inviting as the Atomics, energetic as the Dynastars, or as powerful as the Heads—instead they offer a classic, balanced, understated approach.
Dynastar Speed WC FIS GS 185/27m (102-65-84): Along with it’s identical Rossi twin, this is the most lively ski of the bunch--quick and easy turning with superb rebound energy that launches me into the next turn, but without being harsh or demanding. These put a big smile on my face as I arc turns and will likely be my next GS ski as I move towards 30m boards.
Note that all of these skis have a 0.5/3 tune by StartHaus
Nordica Doberman GSR RB FDT 185/20.5m (114-69-97): Much like the Rossi Hero Master skis, this Nordica lies in the grey zone between a NASTAR/beer league racer and a true Masters ski, being slightly too wide at the waist and a bit short on turn radius. I spent much of last year on them trying to get comfortable with a modern GS type ski. Although offering a shorter turn radius, they are nonetheless reasonably powerful with good stability at speed. They demand good technique to work well.
Atomic Redster G9 RS 183/24m (105-67.5/89): This year ScotsSkier recommended I go with the Atomic 183/24m; unsurprisingly he was entirely correct, as this has proven the perfect ski for my current skill set. For me this is the most versatile option of these 20+m Masters skis. Turn initiation is extremely easy and it is simple to vary the turn shape. They have a large sweet spot and are tolerant of my mistakes--allowing quick recovery instead of launching me off course. This ease of use comes with perhaps a bit less stability and strength than some of the other skis here. There is also a 190/27.5m version of this Atomic. It looks like the new Head Masters skis offer a similar approach with a slightly wide 68mm waist and turn radii in the 22-28m range.
Head Worldcup Rebels i.GS RD Pro 186/25m (104-65-87): While requiring a bit more effort to start the turn with my current limited skills, once on edge, they are solidly locked to the snow like a Bullet train riding rails. They offer a taught ride and are a bit less tolerant of any errors, but they are extremely powerful and stable, with no discernable speed limit.
Stockli Laser FIS GS 184/25.5m (approx 103/65/84): As with most Stockli Lasers I have used, these skis became more responsive with the bindings moved forward a cm or so. They offer a smooth supple ride, easily blasting through hard ruts and ripples with aplomb. They are not quite as inviting as the Atomics, energetic as the Dynastars, or as powerful as the Heads—instead they offer a classic, balanced, understated approach.
Dynastar Speed WC FIS GS 185/27m (102-65-84): Along with it’s identical Rossi twin, this is the most lively ski of the bunch--quick and easy turning with superb rebound energy that launches me into the next turn, but without being harsh or demanding. These put a big smile on my face as I arc turns and will likely be my next GS ski as I move towards 30m boards.
Damn...not sure if I am jealous of that collection or happy to have a far simpler decision process with my ski collection. 
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2015
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- 24,856
How are some of those skis labeled ‘FIS’ ?
184/25.5m and 185/27m
That means they’re compliant for U16?
This article has lots of information, but is from 2015.
skiracing.com
What’s the Right Ski for Masters Racing?
A peek at what top athletes across the age groups are using for lengths and sidecuts.
skiracing.com
@Deadslow thanks for this, might you also be able to post the page for the e GS RD (non-Pro), https://www.head.com/en_CA/worldcup-rebels-e-gs-rd-race-plate-wcr-14-32.html
Would this one be a 'tweener'? 186 / 25m / 104-65-87
That looks like a fun ski, a little more sidecut for those not beholden to FIS regs, but looking for a quick transition and edgehold.
If I could have found that ski for the deal i bought my Rossis for, I think I'd have a pair of Head skis for GS races.
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U16 ski.
I think this may be the one:
@ScotsSkier , do you refer to this ski? 1cm off, maybe a different model year
Redster Fis - Giant Slalom | REDSTER G9 FIS | Atomic.com USA
Atomic Redster G9 FIS is a precise and powerful ski for junior GS racers heading to the top of their game.
shop.atomic.com
Website says it is for 'junior GS racers getting to the top of their game'. Also suitable for older heavier racers?
Thanks, great to know.
Reporting back, having been on-snow freeskiing on the G9 'FIS' 187/26m, 103-65-82.4, the one I linked a few posts above.
My comments won't be particularly helpful as I lack a reasonable point of reference - I was last on a GS ski in the Deflex Era (for those not familiar: dinosaurs roamed the Earth during this time).
Anyway I was out on spring-ey snow in the morning, firm at first then softening on sunny aspects. For me they skied great - neither impossible to turn nor showing any lack of grip or rebound on the firm spring stuff in the shadow. Reliable as edge angle increased, inviting more of the same. They did what I hoped they would do.
My comments won't be particularly helpful as I lack a reasonable point of reference - I was last on a GS ski in the Deflex Era (for those not familiar: dinosaurs roamed the Earth during this time).
Anyway I was out on spring-ey snow in the morning, firm at first then softening on sunny aspects. For me they skied great - neither impossible to turn nor showing any lack of grip or rebound on the firm spring stuff in the shadow. Reliable as edge angle increased, inviting more of the same. They did what I hoped they would do.
Big U16 skis are great fun for a lot of skiers "in their best years". What we lack in speed and technique compared to youngsters in speed suits, we make up for in ... weight
I’ve got that one coveredBig U16 skis are great fun for a lot of skiers "in their best years". What we lack in speed and technique compared to youngsters in speed suits, we make up for in ... weight
Came upon an article re: pluses and minuses of longer vs. shorter radius GS skis.
What is the Rossi equivalent of these?
Sounds very interesting but cant find the Dynastars in any of my go to web shops.
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- May 6, 2017
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- 847
I have to say, while you guys are obsessing about sidecut, overall flex and flex pattern is far more important. I have seen Masters racer on Masters skis that they can not bend at all. If you can't bend the ski....... you know the rest! Torsional rigidity is ultimately important for great edge hold, but as far as I know, manufacturer's don't quote torsion numbers.
I trained last on a 30M/188 Atomic FIS ski. I weigh 175. Because they changed the flex and flex pattern of the 30 M skis, made them softer, they were far easier to ski than the older 21, 24 or 27 Meter GS skis. which were brick stiff! Ask Scotskier if I am correct (Hint: I already know the answer)
Flex is written on the tail of at least Atomic FIS skis. XX/XX tip vs. tail. I believe the higher the number the softer the skis is. My 188/30M is 45/35. For reference, my Atomic Redster FIS 165 SL is 37/27. SL is about 18% stiffer in the tip and about 22% stiffer in the tail then the GS ski. The GS tip is about 22% softer in the tip then it's own tail. The SL is 27% softer tip than it's own tail. (Approx numbers of course)
I believe these may both be the mid flex versions. I believe there was a stiffer and a softer version of each available.
I would also not ignore taper angle, the actual shape of the sidecut, the relationship of waist dimension to tail dimension. The bigger the taper angle (narrower tail) the more versatile the turn shape, the smaller the taper angle (wider tail) the more a ski is locked into a specific turn shape.
I trained last on a 30M/188 Atomic FIS ski. I weigh 175. Because they changed the flex and flex pattern of the 30 M skis, made them softer, they were far easier to ski than the older 21, 24 or 27 Meter GS skis. which were brick stiff! Ask Scotskier if I am correct (Hint: I already know the answer)
Flex is written on the tail of at least Atomic FIS skis. XX/XX tip vs. tail. I believe the higher the number the softer the skis is. My 188/30M is 45/35. For reference, my Atomic Redster FIS 165 SL is 37/27. SL is about 18% stiffer in the tip and about 22% stiffer in the tail then the GS ski. The GS tip is about 22% softer in the tip then it's own tail. The SL is 27% softer tip than it's own tail. (Approx numbers of course)
I believe these may both be the mid flex versions. I believe there was a stiffer and a softer version of each available.
I would also not ignore taper angle, the actual shape of the sidecut, the relationship of waist dimension to tail dimension. The bigger the taper angle (narrower tail) the more versatile the turn shape, the smaller the taper angle (wider tail) the more a ski is locked into a specific turn shape.
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