mostly wine stuff

Scruffy

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Okay you vinophiles and oenophiles, time for a pairing request. If you don't mind.

Pizza was mentioned up thread and big juicy low tannic but somewhat acidic wines were suggested. I assume that suggestion was what pairs well red sauce pizza :huh:. What pairs well with a white pizza?

Particularly a pizza based with a 70/30 mix of ricotta and goat cheese.

The pizza has a really good EVOO brushed on the stretched dough, and then a sprinkling of chopped fresh rosemary. Then the ricotta/goat mixture is spread as the white base. Then honey nut squash rounds (previously brushed with EVOO and a little middle east za'atar spice and roasted till soft on a baking sheet), and sautéed red onion with a splash of lemon juice for brightness. Add to that I quick fried some sage (5 seconds per side) in some hot grape seed oil--just until crisp. After the pizza baked, I added some pecorino romano. Pizza was delicious and savory, but not overly rich. I wound up pairing it with some homemade wine a friend of mine had made (it's a light red. I think he used pinot grapes).

I was thinking it needed a white with some heft and some minerality, but what do I know?

Last two slices. I didn't think of asking for a pairing and taking a pic until well into dinner.
1668292647955.jpeg
Any ideas? Thanks in advance.
 

pete

not peace but 2 Beers!
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Okay you vinophiles and oenophiles, time for a pairing request. If you don't mind.

Pizza was mentioned up thread and big juicy low tannic but somewhat acidic wines were suggested. I assume that suggestion was what pairs well red sauce pizza :huh:. What pairs well with a white pizza?

Particularly a pizza based with a 70/30 mix of ricotta and goat cheese.

The pizza has a really good EVOO brushed on the stretched dough, and then a sprinkling of chopped fresh rosemary. Then the ricotta/goat mixture is spread as the white base. Then honey nut squash rounds (previously brushed with EVOO and a little middle east za'atar spice and roasted till soft on a baking sheet), and sautéed red onion with a splash of lemon juice for brightness. Add to that I quick fried some sage (5 seconds per side) in some hot grape seed oil--just until crisp. After the pizza baked, I added some pecorino romano. Pizza was delicious and savory, but not overly rich. I wound up pairing it with some homemade wine a friend of mine had made (it's a light red. I think he used pinot grapes).

I was thinking it needed a white with some heft and some minerality, but what do I know?

Last two slices. I didn't think of asking for a pairing and taking a pic until well into dinner.

Any ideas? Thanks in advance.
Now I'm hungry for Pizza ....
 

pete

not peace but 2 Beers!
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Okay you vinophiles and oenophiles, time for a pairing request. If you don't mind.

Pizza was mentioned up thread and big juicy low tannic but somewhat acidic wines were suggested. I assume that suggestion was what pairs well red sauce pizza :huh:. What pairs well with a white pizza?

Particularly a pizza based with a 70/30 mix of ricotta and goat cheese.

The pizza has a really good EVOO brushed on the stretched dough, and then a sprinkling of chopped fresh rosemary. Then the ricotta/goat mixture is spread as the white base. Then honey nut squash rounds (previously brushed with EVOO and a little middle east za'atar spice and roasted till soft on a baking sheet), and sautéed red onion with a splash of lemon juice for brightness. Add to that I quick fried some sage (5 seconds per side) in some hot grape seed oil--just until crisp. After the pizza baked, I added some pecorino romano. Pizza was delicious and savory, but not overly rich. I wound up pairing it with some homemade wine a friend of mine had made (it's a light red. I think he used pinot grapes).

I was thinking it needed a white with some heft and some minerality, but what do I know?

Last two slices. I didn't think of asking for a pairing and taking a pic until well into dinner.

Any ideas? Thanks in advance.
I guess the chard onnays and Pinots go well with more cream based meals with less strong flavors, the Rosemary may like a Riesling ...

heck, I tend to go simply by how strong the flavors are with which the wine needs to battle ..

I've opened a couple of different wines to try the flavor pairing and then drink the "loser" later.

"oh no .. i've opened extra bottles .. what will I do??"
 

skibob

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Okay you vinophiles and oenophiles, time for a pairing request. If you don't mind.

Pizza was mentioned up thread and big juicy low tannic but somewhat acidic wines were suggested. I assume that suggestion was what pairs well red sauce pizza :huh:. What pairs well with a white pizza?

Particularly a pizza based with a 70/30 mix of ricotta and goat cheese.

The pizza has a really good EVOO brushed on the stretched dough, and then a sprinkling of chopped fresh rosemary. Then the ricotta/goat mixture is spread as the white base. Then honey nut squash rounds (previously brushed with EVOO and a little middle east za'atar spice and roasted till soft on a baking sheet), and sautéed red onion with a splash of lemon juice for brightness. Add to that I quick fried some sage (5 seconds per side) in some hot grape seed oil--just until crisp. After the pizza baked, I added some pecorino romano. Pizza was delicious and savory, but not overly rich. I wound up pairing it with some homemade wine a friend of mine had made (it's a light red. I think he used pinot grapes).

I was thinking it needed a white with some heft and some minerality, but what do I know?

Last two slices. I didn't think of asking for a pairing and taking a pic until well into dinner.
View attachment 182873
Any ideas? Thanks in advance.
White Rhone. Grenache blanc FTW
 

Scruffy

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1668640364266.jpeg

This was a nice drinkable nebbiolo. Dried cherry forward, light acidic, almost citric finish that cleansed the palate. The tannins were manageable but rewarding. I like tannic wines generally, but this wine's tannins were pleasantly mild considering the reputation nebbiolos can have.
 

doc

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Anyone here have any thoughts and recommendations around wine coolers/wine storage units? Am building a house which has a 4 X 8 room in basement which seems ideal for wine storage, but I'm not sure I want to spend the money to have a fully built in unit. There are, for example, a number of standalone "wine cellars" advertised in the Wine Enthusiast catalogue, and other sites, manufactured by companies like Wine Enthusiast, EuroCave, Vinotheque and others. I'd be looking for something with 200-400 bottle capacity. TIA.
 

skibob

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Anyone here have any thoughts and recommendations around wine coolers/wine storage units? Am building a house which has a 4 X 8 room in basement which seems ideal for wine storage, but I'm not sure I want to spend the money to have a fully built in unit. There are, for example, a number of standalone "wine cellars" advertised in the Wine Enthusiast catalogue, and other sites, manufactured by companies like Wine Enthusiast, EuroCave, Vinotheque and others. I'd be looking for something with 200-400 bottle capacity. TIA.
It is the basement? So no exterior walls thta are above ground?

What is your climate? DOes the room have a/c heat (hopefully not)

Chances are your conditions in that room are plenty good enough for storing wine. If you are in a dry climate, i might consider a humidifier for the dry months. Otherwise, I'd line it with Ikea wine shelving and call it good.
 

skibob

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i suspect it's the heat part of HVAC you dislike but not sure now
Yes, it is. But a/c usually will dehumidify too. But a room in a true basement will stay well within the desired range w/o ac or heat.

OTOH, if you are someplace like the deep south, perhaps the dehumidification is desirable? Not sure. But unless I was storing more than $10,000 worth of wine at any time, I'd trust a true basement.
 

doc

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It is the basement? So no exterior walls thta are above ground?

What is your climate? DOes the room have a/c heat (hopefully not)

Chances are your conditions in that room are plenty good enough for storing wine. If you are in a dry climate, i might consider a humidifier for the dry months. Otherwise, I'd line it with Ikea wine shelving and call it good.

Yes basement. No above ground exterior walls. Basement heated the same as balance of house, but probably runs a few degrees cooler. Dry climate (Denver). Will look into wine shelving.
Not often you get a response to a random internet inquiry that calls for spending less, rather than more, than you had in mind!
 

skibob

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Yes basement. No above ground exterior walls. Basement heated the same as balance of house, but probably runs a few degrees cooler. Dry climate (Denver). Will look into wine shelving.
Not often you get a response to a random internet inquiry that calls for spending less, rather than more, than you had in mind!
If you run dry a humidifier could be beneficial if you plan to hold wine more than a few years or very very expensive wine. Ideal is around 65%. If there are any vents in that room, I would cover or close them, at least in the winter.
 

surfacehoar

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I'm confused by this. I've gone to wineries that have made a big deal about leaving wine in a hot car. Generally my wine tour involves a half day of driving around to different wineries picking up bottles/cases. Sure if it's 90+ it's going to get hot in the car.

That said, when I go to pick up my wine, I'll often grab it from the back of the building instead of the wine shop where they have large garage doors open to the elements with cases of wine on pallets exposed to the warm summer air. No idea how long they are stored like that but I can't think it's good thing, especially since they were just trying to sell me a cooler bag.

These are good wines too. 95 point, $80 bottles. Mostly Bordeaux blends.
 

mdf

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I'm confused by this. I've gone to wineries that have made a big deal about leaving wine in a hot car. Generally my wine tour involves a half day of driving around to different wineries picking up bottles/cases. Sure if it's 90+ it's going to get hot in the car.

That said, when I go to pick up my wine, I'll often grab it from the back of the building instead of the wine shop where they have large garage doors open to the elements with cases of wine on pallets exposed to the warm summer air. No idea how long they are stored like that but I can't think it's good thing, especially since they were just trying to sell me a cooler bag.

These are good wines too. 95 point, $80 bottles. Mostly Bordeaux blends.
I think there is a difference between accelerated aging and cooking the wine. A closed-up car on a 90 degree day can get over 130 degrees. There is also a difference between a few days at 90 and long-term storage.

My basement is not ideal ... only partially below grade. Most of the year it is fine, but it gets too warm (upper 70's probably) after several hot summer days in a row. I find wine stays good there for about 8 years.
 

skibob

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All good points.

The biggest enemy of wine is extreme high temps (and of course freezing and breaking). This will cook the wine. It will also oxidize it rapidly because it pushes the cork out.

The second biggest is temperature fluctuation. It slowly pushes the cork in and out which pumps oxygen into the bottle. When you see a bottle that has obviously leaked, but the cork looks fine, this is the cause.

Next is extreme dry. It will dry the cork out quickly and allow oxygen in.

The IDEAL conditions are about 58-62F and about 70% humidity. That is perfection. But generally cool conditions without extreme low humidy and w/o significant DAILY fluctuations is just fine for the vast majority of wine. Including those $80 cabs.

This is the reason for my qualifier "if it isn't extremely valuable and/or going to be stored for more than a few years".

As a winemaker, I've never owned one of those wine cooler things. And I live in a relatively dry environment. My master sommelier friend (same town) has an above grade closet but w/ no exterior walls and on a slab. The space around it is conditioned/heated, but no vent in the closet. He runs a humidifier in the summer (or dry season). But he has first growth burg/bord/champ and other jewels going back at least to the 1960s that I have seen. And occasionally been fortunate to drink :)

EDIT: I do have to warn you though, said master sommelier is a snowboarder. So you may reasonably question his judgment, despite his impressive credentials.
 
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Tony S

Tony S

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The second biggest is temperature fluctuation. It slowly pushes the cork in and out which pumps oxygen into the bottle. When you see a bottle that has obviously leaked, but the cork looks fine, this is the cause.
+1
 
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Tony S

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Then honey nut squash rounds
Somehow missed a lot of recent activity here, including your pizza post. Basically what you've got going there is what you might call "Mediterranean Thanksgiving" flavors. (Zaatar & pecorino + winter squash & sage)

I think you have a lot of flexibility with that, so my personal take is more about "what not to wear." What not to wear is high acid or high tannin. High acid wines will tend to make sweet flavors like the squash taste extra sweet and make the wine taste sour. I don't have a rational explanation at hand about WHY the high tannin thing, but to me it always just feels like a bull in a china shop with these kinds of dishes, which doesn't make you particularly fond of the bull or the china.

The wines I tend to like in this context are round, fruit-forward, and kind of gentle - dry but not too tart. Skibob's suggestion for white Rhone is totally in that circle. I have had pinots blanc and gris that have worked really nicely too. Not the vapid mass produced ones, of course, but carefully grown stuff from Alsace, Oregon, or Friuli, for example. (High altitude pinot grigio, as from Alto Adige, tends to be a little too ephemeral for this purpose IME.) Back in the day, before it was a "thing," I remember buying a case of Jermann PG for a big Thanksgiving dinner and having it be a hit. Ditto the St. Innocent Oregon bottling, more recently. Stuff like dolcetto, schiava - also yummy. Beautifully made but unambitious cab franc like this one, delicious.
 
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