Question about seasoning a performance ski

[scott43]

I'm really surprised/disappointed(there must be a German word for this) that this is the first food seasoning reference. I was tempted to post a couple myself but resisted as not to clutter he thread.

James is only saying that because he knows I have a salt-shaker on a chain attached to my belt..because you can never have enough salt!!

 

[Delicious]

I'm definitely willing to play along with the "seasoning" concept as it relates to "the breaking in" of a ski's flex profile, and/or camber shrink. My MB 90ti's are the most recent example. Those things have become soft and twisty outside of the binding mat area. Like, A LOT. I had a Bataleon "Jam" snowboard that reached perfection at some point and just stayed there forever!
Bases definitely season, but I think that's more of a fact than it is an opinion.

 

[KingGrump]

Slalom skis usually end up torsionally weaker and not holding an edge as well. Most consider this worser. If you’re not racing it, you really don’t know the extent until replaced.

Don't know much about seasoning skis. I do know when a pair of skis are toasted.
Both @A Grump and I are very sensitive to edge hold of a ski. Usually due to lost of torsional rigidity. We usually just take off the binding, retire the ski and rotate a new pair in its place. To us, skis are consumables.
Even for free skiing the performance degradation is very evident. We have a habit to run multiple pairs of the same skis so it's easy for us to discern the degradation. The life span of a pair of skis is much shorter than most skier think.

 

[Tony S]

Not quite. Although he is 86 he was skiing Head GS skis, but I am not sure what level ie: World Cup. There is tremendous respect for his knowledge and experience at the mountain - and his humility. I have always felt that a ski does "season" and that is a good thing in certain cases.

I hope my post didn't come across as dismissive or condescending. I was just thinking about how habits of perception form.

 

[Tony S]

The life span of a pair of skis is much shorter than most skier think.

You put a LOT of days on your skis, though. Most non-pros don't come close to you in that regard.

 

[François Pugh]

I have found most new skis seem to work better for me after a while (I can't put an exact number down for the number of days though), and then they start losing their rigidity, except for my Old Kastle SGs. Those SGs never skied as well as they did their first day, with the factory tune, but they haven't worn out too much either considering their age.

I tend to be on stiffer and longer skis than most would recommend for my weight though.

 

[James]

We have a habit to run multiple pairs of the same skis so it's easy for us to discern the degradation. The life span of a pair of skis is much shorter than most skier think.

Wait you have data for non Kendo skis?

A/B would definitely be the way to notice it. Otherwise it’s a frog in a warming pot syndrome and you talk yourself into it’s ok while changing the way you used to ski it.

What are your days estimates for various types of skis?

Kendo-
Slalom-
Stockli-

 

[Tony S]

I tend to be on stiffer and longer skis than most would recommend for my weight though.

You tend to be on stiffer and longer (and especially older) skis than most would recommend for ANYONE'S weight.

my Old Kästle SGs

You should just put that phrase into your signature so you don't have to keep typing it every time you post.

 

[Tony S]

Otherwise it’s a frog in a warming pot syndrome and you talk yourself into it’s ok while changing the way you used to ski it.

I handle everything else in life like that, notably including my body. Why not skis?

 

[Brad J]

I have two pairs of ski's that are somewhat similar, one 7 years old 100 plus fairly hard days on them, and a pair that had three days on them. My first turn on tho older ones after skiing the fresh one was OMG what happened to these. Yah the older ones are toasted but still have a purpose skiing at Wildcat and MRG where new ski's become rock ski's very quickly.

 

[François Pugh]

You tend to be on stiffer and longer (and especially older) skis than most would recommend for ANYONE'S weight.


You should just put that phrase into your signature so you don't have to keep typing it every time you post.

In this case I had to mention it, because it IS the exception. My Volkls, Volants, Fischers and Dynastars all fit the pattern.

BTW I did by a brand new pair of 4FRNT skis this year - and the current model! And I didn't even get the longest (of 3) length!

 

[James]

BTW I did by a brand new pair of 4FRNT skis this year - and the current model! And I didn't even get the longest (of 3) length!

Which one?
The pre seasoned ones?

 

[no edge]

Great post. I buy into the idea that people like this know what they're talking about.

"I was riding the lift and skiing with an older fellow, from Norway, has lived here since 1960. He is 86 and is one of the finest skiers I have ever met. His skills are amazing. Still racing Masters at the very highest level. He was friends with Stein E. Said Stein carved turns before it was invented. Taught him!"
__________________
He definitely knows a lot about skiing. That doesn't mean he knows all. Looking back to when he was on the Norwegian National Team in the 50s, things have changed. But he has continued to race and train with great coaches. He seems to be at the hill every time I am there - always drilling and skiing with purpose. He still has that "beginner mind" and a willingness to learn. He went to France last year for the masters championships. Not certain but he won his division. He has races coming up in Aspen soon.

My conversations with him are not statements of facts, just his thoughts on equipment and technique.

 

[James]

James is only saying that because he knows I have a salt-shaker on a chain attached to my belt..because you can never have enough salt!!

Yes, my phrasing was poor.
I should’ve said-
So Phil is going vegan, and now you’re anti-salt?

 

[Bad Bob]

The life span of a pair of skis is much shorter than most skier think.

Could the answer be "C"; I want new skis."

 

[KingGrump]

You put a LOT of days on your skis, though. Most non-pros don't come close to you in that regard.

I have lots of skis and I do rotate through them so the actual days on each ski per season is very similar to average skier. I have skier tell me they have 10+ years old skis with 200+ days on them and tell me they are just like new. WTF.

Wait you have data for non Kendo skis?

A/B would definitely be the way to notice it. Otherwise it’s a frog in a warming pot syndrome and you talk yourself into it’s ok while changing the way you used to ski it.

What are your days estimates for various types of skis?

Kendo-
Slalom-
Stöckli-

The change in longitudinal flex is not much a concerning factor for me. I am very sensitive to the lost of torsional rigidity. A quality more evident on firm snow than soft.

We have about 10 pairs of Atomic FIS SL in the family. They usually lose that loving feeling on hard snow after about 50 days. Still great for spring skiing.

I get about 75 days off a pair of Kendo before they start to crap out. Pretty much trash after 85 days. I have had better luck on my Mantra. They all get to about 100 days before retirement.

My Kastle MX 88 went out at about day 70. Still great feel on softer snow but no edge hold on firm.
Haven't had enough days on my Stockli(s) to draw any conclusion.

Could the answer be "C"; I want new skis."

Definitely.

 

[Andy Mink]

I have skier tell me they have 10+ years old skis with 200+ days on them and tell me they are just like new.

The shock absorber mindset. You don't know how bad they are until you get new ones!

 

[Andy Mink]

@AKMINK has a pair of Z90s with several years on them. She got on a fresh pair and didn't care for them. Got on the old ones and loved them again. Like a comfy pair of jeans. Broken in? Broken down? Different vintage of wood in the core? Does it matter as long as the skier is enjoying themself?

 

[graham418]

Skis only go downhill from the day they were new. After 3 or 4 days of skiing, they feel better because you get used to the way they behave. I never believed the seasoning of bicycle tires either.
Skis definitely last longer than they did in the 70's & 80's. Epoxies and laminate technology have come a long way since then, but everything breaks down over time.
Except for wine & whisky

 

[Andy Mink]

Except for wine & whisky

*usually