Reinforcement or kick panels on the inner ankle of ski pants - is it necessary?

[LuliTheYounger]

I'm not at all in the market for new pants, but this came up elsewhere & I got curious! Mostly just asking as I dip my toes into gear design & it's a user experience issue I've never really thought about.

I've skied in Burton pants for years, and was under the impression that snowboard and ski pants are mostly interchangeable with some minor style differences. Yesterday I saw someone recommend a similar pair of Burtons to a skier, and someone else shot back that there's no way a skier could use them because they don't have reinforcement on the inner ankle and would obviously be cut to shreds by the opposite ski. I've never had an issue, but I was curious if other people have managed to cut their pants this way? Are some skiers (racers, park skiers, etc.) more prone to it? Is it a factor you think about when you're buying pants? Is it forgivable as long as the main fabric is durable enough?

 

[S.H.]

Every pair of pants I've owned without reinforcement there has ended up pretty torn (i.e. multiple tears > 1" long) within half a season (so ~40-50 days), which leads to a ton of snow getting into the cuff. Then I needed to shake/empty it out at the end of the day, which wasn't really fun.

On the other hand, most of the pants I've had that do have reinforcement in that area have lasted multiple seasons. I won't buy a pair without it again.

 

[Marker]

Due to my size, 6'6", 230 lb, I've skied in Burton cargo pants for years. My
older pair are a little cut up on the inside leg, but nothing worth throwing them out for. I use the cargo pockets to hold my yaxtraxs for my smooth soled ski boots. Very convenient.

 

[coskigirl]

I've had both types and while the ones without reinforcements do get a few cuts mine are generally small and don't cause an issue. My bigger issue is that I have short legs and if I don't remember to lift up the back of my pant leg while clicking in I will tear up the back hem in the bindings.

 

[Novaloafah]

Got a approx. 1.5" straight cut on my inside right leg of my Helly's. Owned them for 3 years at that point. They are black, so out came the thin black gorilla tape. Perfect. With only 20-25 ski days a season I don't seem to do too much damage.

 

[Andy Mink]

I prefer the guards. Not so much because I'm a great skier but because I'm not! Edges sometimes go where they shouldn't.

 

[cantunamunch]

New climbers and skimo guys will tear that area to bits with crampons, especially when walking (low angle, not frontpointing) in narrow ruts between high walls on either side. One weekend on Mt. Washington = 4 seasons on skis.

For myself, I have not had a single ski cut in that area since I shifted to this-century ski boots, say 2003ish. My boot cuffs are set for a default 6 inches apart. In the 90s, with narrow stance, I averaged 2-3 cuts per season.

I've had both types and while the ones without reinforcements do get a few cuts mine are generally small and don't cause an issue. My bigger issue is that I have short legs and if I don't remember to lift up the back of my pant leg while clicking in I will tear up the back hem in the bindings.

Yup, don't forget to watch out for snowboarder pants with ski boots - some of these cuffs fall so low they actually enter the heelpiece of the binding. I really think baggy skier designs should have slant-cut cuffs - in the opposite direction from dress slacks. / instead of \

It sounds funny until you actually see a beginner heel slamming their pant into their rental binding - and have their pant pull the binding heel back up when they lean forward. No, there's no point going to the rental desk, your bindings are fine. Here is why you're pulling out of your heel every 2 turns.

 

[Eleeski]

Buy the cheap snowboard pants. Get some Plasti-dip and paint that on the cuff. Or you could use Alex caulking and trowel it on. Both are available in a few colors, waterproof and reasonably tough. You could get creative and make cool designs.

Disclaimer: I've only used plasti-dip on tools. I've used the caulking impregnated cloth a lot with both fiberglass cloth and regular fabric and had good results. It is still possible to cut the fabric. Snow pants might not accept or bond well to the caulking. Try it and let us know.

Eric

 

[cantunamunch]

. You could get creative and make cool designs.

Eh, I'd sort of rather pop out to see the SCA and Rennfaire leather guys. Nothing quite like full-thickness boiled leather, complete with rivets, for a nice mediaeval look

 

[LuliTheYounger]

Thanks everyone for the responses so far! I was losing my mind with curiosity about about this niche topic, haha.

Due to my size, 6'6", 230 lb, I've skied in Burton cargo pants for years. My
older pair are a little cut up on the inside leg, but nothing worth throwing them out for. I use the cargo pockets to hold my yaxtraxs for my smooth soled ski boots. Very convenient.

Oh, that's genius! Somehow my Cargos are always full of piles of clif bars, in case of the impending national clif bar shortage that 7AM me is always worried about. (?????)

For myself, I have not had a single ski cut in that area since I shifted to this-century ski boots, say 2003ish. My boot cuffs are set for a default 6 inches apart. In the 90s I averaged 2-3 cuts per season.

That's interesting! Is it partially a technique change that's putting your feet farther apart? I'm just trying to picture this, considering it sounds like the boot change really made a quick difference!

Buy the cheap snowboard pants. Get some Plasti-dip and paint that on the cuff. Or you could use Alex caulking and trowel it on. Both are available in a few colors, waterproof and reasonably tough. You could get creative and make cool designs.

Disclaimer: I've only used plasti-dip on tools. I've used the caulking impregnated cloth a lot with both fiberglass cloth and regular fabric and had good results. It is still possible to cut the fabric. Snow pants might not accept or bond well to the caulking. Try it and let us know.

Eric

Oh, I've already got the pants! In multiple colors, no less, oops. (Sorry mom!) I have some 1000D cordura that I could patch on there, but it seems like a lot of work considering my original Burtons are 5+ years old and so far slice free. Mostly just curious to know what other people think! I'm going to school for product design, so these weird details fascinate me.

Eh, I'd sort of rather pop out to see the SCA and Rennfaire leather guys. Nothing quite like full-thickness boiled leather, complete with rivets, for a nice mediaeval look

"Medieval ski pants" sure sounds like a genre of objects that should exist in the world.

 

[Crank]

I never thought about it, but, I wear snowboard pants and they do get little tears on the inside of the ankles and whenever I ski powder the bottoms of my pants fill up with snow. They always dry out before the next morning so no big deal.

I have been using these Orage pants for 5 season and just started having the snow filling thing 2 years ago. They still look fine - tears are small not noticeable unless you really look for them.

 

[luliski]

Buy the cheap snowboard pants.

She is not in the market (I hope).

 

[cantunamunch]

That's interesting! Is it partially a technique change that's putting your feet farther apart? I'm just trying to picture this, considering it sounds like the boot change really made a quick difference!

It was a bit organic for me: success at skating -> low cut speedskate boots -> more ankle strength, lower stance, wider hip extension -> ski lessons in old boots that OMG let me use skate skills at wider ski stances -> new boots very much needed -> fitter says 'stand where your "neutral" is and I pop out to 8" and he looks at me funny but sets the cuff tilt there anyway -> far fewer torn trousers bonus.

"Medieval ski pants" sure sounds like a genre of objects that should exist in the world.

We are in complete agreement, yesssss. 1000D Cordura - bah! 10 ducat Cowdura!

 

[LuliTheYounger]

She is not in the market (I hope).

I said I was off the market in my first post because I knew I was risking an irate phone call.

 

[Rod MacDonald]

Just file the ski edges in the area of the boots blunt, problem solved.

 

[EricG]

The reinforcement is nice. My pants are at Patagonia right now as I sliced thru them the first weekend of skiing back in November.. I should have asked how long the repair was going to take.. they got them back the first week of December and I should get them back late feb/early March. Luckily I have an insulated set of Obermeyer pants and it’s been cold.

 

[Ogg]

I've even sliced through reinforced pants so I won't buy a pair without it.

 

[James]

Look at the inside surface of your boots. Ever seen a slalom racers?
If there's digs and lines there you def need reinforcement.
Crampons is a good point. Even if they only get used once in 5 years. Pants will be shot andor you'll trip as they dig in.
Ski pant design without reinforcement is incompetent at this point.

 

[Seldomski]

In normal skiing, you won't typically hit the inner leg with the ski edge. It's all the abnormal stuff... like falling. Or if you are in 3D snow, you may get your legs pushed together at different levels when you screw up. I like to play in 3D snow and fall often - usually once daily. So I need the panels!

 

[Ogg]

In normal skiing, you won't typically hit the inner leg with the ski edge. It's all the abnormal stuff... like falling. Or if you are in 3D snow, you may get your legs pushed together at different levels when you screw up. I like to play in 3D snow and fall often - usually once daily. So I need the panels!

Skiing moguls or any 3D snow aggressively will slice up your pants and boots. My brother(former comp bumper) shredded a pair without the patches in one zipper line run. He skied them for a couple of seasons with duct tape cuffs around the bottom which worked better than the panels would have.