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Softer flexing directional skis - an endangered species?

Ryan Perham

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Is it me or is the softer flexing, directional ski an endangered species? It seems that all-mountain directional skis are trending stiffer and damper. Rossignol 7 series is gone and replaced with something with more burly. K2 Pinnacle series is gone and replaced by something much burlier. Many brands have made incremental updates to their skis and they almost always involve additional stiffness or damping. Elan seems to be the only company that hasn't moved in that direction.

I will admit this trend is probably appropriate for the average-sized, expert-level skier. …but it doesn’t leave many options for a lighter weight skier who wants a directional ski that will feel energetic and less demanding. Do you think these skis fail because most people actually don't like them or is it because a vocal minority doesn't like them?
 

Dougb

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Haven’t skied it, but like you said that sounds like the Elan Wingman 86cti to me. That’s a ski I would love to try.
 

anders_nor

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camox? atris? rossignol sender (non ti) rossignol escaper, rustler, some of the mindbenders, ripstick, armada, on3p, jskis

I think most go towards average, and its medium stiffness, Im having issues finding skis that are stiff enough, yet still playful as I'm on the taller/heavier side.
 

Tony S

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Haven’t skied it, but like you said that sounds like the Elan Wingman 86cti to me. That’s a ski I would love to try.
camox? atris? rossignol sender (non ti) rossignol escaper, rustler, some of the mindbenders, ripstick, armada, on3p, jskis

I think most go towards average, and its medium stiffness, Im having issues finding skis that are stiff enough, yet still playful as I'm on the taller/heavier side.
You are assuming that the OP is looking for ski suggestions. He MAY be - don't know - but the way I read the post he's looking for more general discussion of the alleged phenomenon.
 
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Ryan Perham

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You are assuming that the OP is looking for ski suggestions. He MAY be - don't know - but the way I read the post he's looking for more general discussion of the alleged phenomenon.

Yes, a discussion or opportunity to bellyache was more the intent. I know what’s out there. I suppose I do sound crazy suggesting that we’re losing some variety when there’s so many skis out there. I just remember demoing skis 15 years ago and even I found some to be noodles (and some were 2 x 4s). Something average was more my preference in those days. Nowadays, I find the average ski to be stiffer and/or damper than I’d prefer. …so for me, it’s disappointing when the softer flexing skis are discontinued with nothing to take their place. Another observation is that there are quite a few forward-mounted freestyle skis that are quite soft and lively (some more so than I’d prefer). So, it kinda feels like if you want an easier, livelier ski you need to go forward-mounted. Even though, I’m not a charging type, I just don’t like the feeling of a forward mounted ski for whatever reason.
 

Dakine

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IMO, the Blossom #1SC is the softest, yet torsionally rigid ski on the market.
Nothing else quite like it on the market.
Pure finesse.
Lots of fun.
 

Tony S

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IMO, the Blossom #1SC is the softest, yet torsionally rigid ski on the market.
Nothing else quite like it on the market.
Pure finesse.
Lots of fun.
I definitely need to try that.
 

zircon

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Aren't most intermediate skis soft though? and thats kinda the defitnition ?

IMO this is a reason we need to get rid of calling things "beginner"/"intermediate"/"advanced"/"expert" and start describing them by the characteristics that make them appropriate for those types of skiers. I can think of more than one instance (on this forum even) of a competent skier looking for a softer, narrower, easier to bend as a small person, etc. ski being put off from buying something that ticks all the boxes because the entire rest of the internet labeled it "good for an intermediate"
 

Blue Streak

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IMO this is a reason we need to get rid of calling things "beginner"/"intermediate"/"advanced"/"expert" and start describing them by the characteristics that make them appropriate for those types of skiers. I can think of more than one instance (on this forum even) of a competent skier looking for a softer, narrower, easier to bend as a small person, etc. ski being put off from buying something that ticks all the boxes because the entire rest of the internet labeled it "good for an intermediate"
Good point.
And that is even more the case with boots. I see lots of people skiing "expert" boots with 130+ flex, and they never dorsiflex their ankles, either because they don't know how, or the boot is simply too stiff.
 
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Ryan Perham

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IMO this is a reason we need to get rid of calling things "beginner"/"intermediate"/"advanced"/"expert" and start describing them by the characteristics that make them appropriate for those types of skiers. I can think of more than one instance (on this forum even) of a competent skier looking for a softer, narrower, easier to bend as a small person, etc. ski being put off from buying something that ticks all the boxes because the entire rest of the internet labeled it "good for an intermediate"

Good point. I've got less to prove than I did when I was younger, so I'm not too proud to ski an "intermediate" ski. When I was younger I was generally smart enough to demo skis, but I was still swayed by the preferences of very different skiers (heavier, much more agressive, more experienced). I hate seeing a lightweight intermediate ask for a recommendation and someone suggests something like a Head Kore because that's what they like.
 

Tom K.

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Haven’t skied it, but like you said that sounds like the Elan Wingman 86cti to me. That’s a ski I would love to try.

I've got the Wingman 82 and it's a blast. Soft enough to come alive at lower speeds. No, it isn't stable at 60 on cut up groomers. But it sure puts a smile on my face.

This is also one of my favorite things about my Enforcer 100s and 88s. Not overly stiff, but plenty of metal/dampness/weight/whatever to destroy crud.

OP, Blister is a great reference for relative stiffness of the various portions of a ski.
 

Tom K.

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There aren't a lot of 70-ish mm wide carving skis that a light person can bend to their limits and really enjoy without skiing fast.

Right?! I used to have a pair of Fischer Progressor 8000 (8 something, anyway) and they defined a narrow carver that was NOT really stiff.

Never should have let them go......
 

ski otter 2

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Dunno. I can sort of understand this thread, but it's usually not my problem looking for skis. Yes, I enjoy for limited use some softer flexing skis, but....
Usually, what I don't like about them is they get tossed in crud/chop, unpleasantly - especially with the slightest speed. Not damp enough, usually.

I've gotten rid of a number of softer flexers for this reason. Or friends did, warning me to avoid those, which I have. A very few that come to mind: Rossi Super 7 (amazing ski "if only"), Line Sir Francis Bacon (another "if only"), all the Atomic Bent Chets (wow, "if only"), many freestyle skis in general, etc., etc.


The two softer flexers I know of that I have or would enjoy having still, that I can think of off the top of my head: the old ON3P Jeffrey 110 (which was designed to be very soft flexing yet not get tossed,) with its almost symmetrical, twin tips (some ON3P employees ski on these still); and the Nordica Soulrider 97, that is so playful, borderline stable enough in crud, and such a fun and creative carver while playful as a kid in a sandbox.

P.S. I'm a lighter weight skier, at best just under 150 lbs.
 
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Noodler

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Dunno. I can sort of understand this thread, but it's usually not my problem looking for skis. Yes, I enjoy for limited use some softer flexing skis, but....
Usually, what I don't like about them is they get tossed in crud/chop, unpleasantly - especially with the slightest speed. Not damp enough, usually.

Damp? I think you mean "stable". Damp = vibration absorption.
 

Philpug

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Blossom Namaste is a softer more compiant flexing 99, it is supple and smooth and while it can be relaxed it holds well when pushed but does not require you to push it.
 

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