Stockli Laser AX vs AR

[Bruno Schull]

The beloved AX vs the new(er) AR.

I have lots of time on the AX but am wondering about the AR. Does it have the same magic turn initiation? The same versatility? The same smooth feeling?

Thoughts?

B

 

[AlpedHuez]

The beloved AX vs the new(er) AR.

I have lots of time on the AX but am wondering about the AR. Does it have the same magic turn initiation? The same versatility? The same smooth feeling?

Thoughts?

B

Paging @Noodler to the white courtesy telephone ...

 

[Noodler]

The beloved AX vs the new(er) AR.

I have lots of time on the AX but am wondering about the AR. Does it have the same magic turn initiation? The same versatility? The same smooth feeling?

Thoughts?

B

Yes. Similar. Yes.

I would say that when it comes to versatility they both have some, but they differ in application. The AR gets its versatility from having more platform/float than the AX, while the AX's design provides it with a larger performance envelope and a more accessible ski for more skiers.

Have you read my AR review in the Laser AR thread?

 

[Jjmd]

3 questions regarding the Laser AX in a 182.
What are the preferred bindings, if there are any?
Is anyone using a plate?
Anyone playing around with mount points? On all my full on race skis and on my all mt carvers I’m running 1/2 to 1 cm forward and absolutely loving the difference.

 

[mike_m]

Something to consider: the Lasers in a 182 will ski like a very stiff 188. Unless you are over 225 lbs. and value long, stable turns over any versatility and playfullness, you might well consider a shorter length.

Best!
Mike

PS: I mounted my Lasers 1/2" forward and love it at that spot.

 

[Philpug]

Something to consider: the Lasers in a 182 will ski like a very stiff 188. Unless you are over 225 lbs. and value long, stable turns over any versatility and playfullness, you might well consider a shorter length.

Best!
Mike

Very true, I had this epiphany just yesterday when I was updating my 2022 reviews of the Lasers. Stockli Lasers suffer from (early) Kastle MX syndrome, the two core szes of the ski, 167 and 174/5 lengths of the Lasers, the book end sizes do not ski as well or receive the same amount of love.

 

[Jim McDonald]

I spent a day on demo AXs, trying them mounted from 1.5cm forward to 1cm back.
I have my 175s mounted on the line, but was also good at +0.5cm. Some people seem to like them +1cm, but I didn't.

 

[Noodler]

Very true, I had this epiphany just yesterday when I was updating my 2022 reviews of the Lasers. Stöckli Lasers suffer from (early) Kästle MX syndrome, the two core szes of the ski, 167 and 174/5 lengths of the Lasers, the book end sizes do not ski as well or receive the same amount of love.

I think this is where there's value in the Sooth Ski data. They're testing multiple lengths of the same models and showing quantified data of the differences in flex stiffness between those lengths. Still not a substitute for real-world on-snow testing, but can provide validation of the on-snow experience.

 

[Johnny V.]

Something to consider: the Lasers in a 182 will ski like a very stiff 188. Unless you are over 225 lbs. and value long, stable turns over any versatility and playfullness, you might well consider a shorter length.

I'm really enjoying my AX182s (19-20 version) and I'm not real big-5'10" -180-185 lbs. and old enough so I can get a covid shot. Yes, they're fantastic on big high speed turns ( I haven't found the speed limit yet), but I have no problem doing railroad tracks on lower angle groomers and can bent them to change the turn radius. They're fine in small to moderate bumps and have no difficulty doing short swing fall line turns. Bottom line-I'm skiing them, they aren't skiing me (which I've had happen with some skis).

Bindings are the Stockli version of the Salomon 13 din demo binding. I moved them 5 mm forward of center and like the way they ski well enough that I haven't bother with more experimentation.

 

[motogreg]

I have some new-to-me AX's and after a couple days of experimentation I'm at 2 clicks forward (about 1.6 ish cm) and I like it VERY MUCH.

 

[mdf]

I moved them 5 mm forward of center and like the way they ski

That's not the first time I've heard that. Mount point appears to make a big difference on these skis in the longest length. I wonder if I would have like mine if I changed it.

 

[Philpug]

Bindings are the Stöckli version of the Salomon 13 din demo binding. I moved them 5 mm forward of center and like the way they ski well enough that I haven't bother with more experimentation.

5mm forward on a 182cm ski? I will come back to this:

Debunking Demo Bindings

There can be a cost for using a demo binding and that cost might be performance.

www.skitalk.com

You would be better off with a hard mount binding on center, it would be more responsive in initiation and reactive laterally.

 

[Johnny V.]

You would be better off with a hard mount binding on center, it would be more responsive in initiation and reactive laterally.

Probably, but these came with the demo bindings-they were a little used demo pair from a local ski shop.

 

[Seldomski]

To me, the AR skied like a wide GS ski. It wanted to be on edge and could slice through crud easily. The AX skied more like a narrow all mountain ski.

The AR seemed to be happier carving whereas the AX seemed a bit more versatile regarding turn shapes and types. Perhaps it was just that the skis had different tunes?

 

[bad influence]

I was in the ski shop today talking with the guys there. They suggested the AR would be a good daily driver for where I ski in NH/VT. would the AR be a good ski for moguls, crud, daily driver....?

 

[Brad J]

AR be a good ski for moguls, crud, daily driver..

I used my AR in Jackson last year and really liked them in cut up 3D snow, moguls, I needed to be pretty aggressive with them but they really responded, I haven't skied them back east but I plan to tomorrow

 

[Tony S]

I'm really enjoying my AX182s (19-20 version) and I'm not real big-5'10" -180-185 lbs. and old enough so I can get a covid shot. Yes, they're fantastic on big high speed turns ( I haven't found the speed limit yet), but I have no problem doing railroad tracks on lower angle groomers and can bent them to change the turn radius. They're fine in small to moderate bumps and have no difficulty doing short swing fall line turns. Bottom line-I'm skiing them, they aren't skiing me (which I've had happen with some skis).

But ... Reality check for our viewing audience: Johnny is a racer and knows how to work a ski.

 

[ski otter 2]

I'm really enjoying my AX182s (19-20 version) and I'm not real big-5'10" -180-185 lbs. and old enough so I can get a covid shot. Yes, they're fantastic on big high speed turns ( I haven't found the speed limit yet), but I have no problem doing railroad tracks on lower angle groomers and can bent them to change the turn radius. They're fine in small to moderate bumps and have no difficulty doing short swing fall line turns. Bottom line-I'm skiing them, they aren't skiing me (which I've had happen with some skis).

Bindings are the Stöckli version of the Salomon 13 din demo binding. I moved them 5 mm forward of center and like the way they ski well enough that I haven't bother with more experimentation.

This is my experience exactly, on the previous year's 183s, in the Colo. Rockies though. Just exactly. They are so smooth and stable. I'm an old guy, but once raced - middle of the pack usually. But my ski buddy never raced, skis more upright (limited ankle movement from walking golf courses for a living at one time), and has pretty much the same experience as I do, with a bit different technique.

 

[Johnny V.]

But ... Reality check for our viewing audience: Johnny is a racer and knows how to work a ski.

Thanks Tony, but calling me a racer may be a stretch! I ski down courses with gates, I wear a race suit, I spend WAY too much time preparing skis for when I do that and I'm competitive in in local races in the Men's 65-69 age group, but I'm not even on the same planet as real racers. Still a load of fun though!

 

[bad influence]

I used my AR in Jackson last year and really liked them in cut up 3D snow, moguls, I needed to be pretty aggressive with them but they really responded, I haven't skied them back east but I plan to tomorrow

thanks brad. looking forward to your report