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Stockli Laser AX vs AR

Eric Edelstein

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To me, the AR skied like a wide GS ski. It wanted to be on edge and could slice through crud easily. The AX skied more like a narrow all mountain ski.

The AR seemed to be happier carving whereas the AX seemed a bit more versatile regarding turn shapes and types. Perhaps it was just that the skis had different tunes?

I'd echo Seldom's observations. I have only skied the AX for a few runs at demo events, but spent a week on a pair of brand-new-out-of-the-wrapper ARs on vacation last year in Europe skiing mostly piste, but some boot-deep snow. The AX at 78mm 11.8m +- radius underfoot and the AR at 83mm 12.3m +- radius underfoot have different personalities. The AX feels like a resort-oriented, mostly frontside all-mountain high-performance, carving-oriented design with a good variety of turn behaviors, while the AR feels like a wider, stronger platform definitely smitten with drawing strongly-carved GS radius turns deeply into the hill at higher speeds than the AX. If there were cruddy conditions...I would use the AR as the rock-solid platform of choice to generate float when needed, but freight-train through chop without any deflection or deviation from trajectory. If I was in tighter, bumpier conditions, the AX would do the trick. Both skis are excellent...It's like deciding if you like East coast IPAs or West coast IPAs with your meal..... depends on the meal.
 

Tony S

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Thanks Tony, but calling me a racer may be a stretch! I ski down courses with gates, I wear a race suit, I spend WAY too much time preparing skis for when I do that and I'm competitive in in local races in the Men's 65-69 age group, but I'm not even on the same planet as real racers. Still a load of fun though!
I've seen you ski. I stand by my reality check.
 

Tony S

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If there were cruddy conditions...I would use the AR as the rock-solid platform of choice to generate float when needed, but freight-train through chop without any deflection or deviation from trajectory. If I was in tighter, bumpier conditions, the AX would do the trick. Both skis are excellent...It's like deciding if you like East coast IPAs or West coast IPAs with your meal..... depends on the meal.
Or the coast.
 

Kyle

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I'd echo Seldom's observations. I have only skied the AX for a few runs at demo events, but spent a week on a pair of brand-new-out-of-the-wrapper ARs on vacation last year in Europe skiing mostly piste, but some boot-deep snow. The AX at 78mm 11.8m +- radius underfoot and the AR at 83mm 12.3m +- radius underfoot have different personalities. The AX feels like a resort-oriented, mostly frontside all-mountain high-performance, carving-oriented design with a good variety of turn behaviors, while the AR feels like a wider, stronger platform definitely smitten with drawing strongly-carved GS radius turns deeply into the hill at higher speeds than the AX. If there were cruddy conditions...I would use the AR as the rock-solid platform of choice to generate float when needed, but freight-train through chop without any deflection or deviation from trajectory. If I was in tighter, bumpier conditions, the AX would do the trick. Both skis are excellent...It's like deciding if you like East coast IPAs or West coast IPAs with your meal..... depends on the meal.

FWIW, this take is very similar to our local Stockli rep who I shared a lift ride with yesterday (perhaps he was drawn to my Stormrider 105s?). He was skiing next year's Laser AR (no change except the topsheet graphics). He suggested that the AR was perhaps better for those who mainly prefer to be on edge.
 

Tony Storaro

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SR95:

1613943502046.png


Sorry, I digress...
 

Brad J

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thanks brad. looking forward to your report
I skied the AR's today on very good firm groomers , very solid, very smooth, loved medium to long radius turns, The factory tune is not for me , felt sluggish. They felt a lot like my MX88's but more solid. I bought them for a out west firmer condition ski and they are perfect for that . I need more time and a different tune to really feel dialed in. They really felt the best when there was a little soft snow on the firm surface. I will get them tuned(.5/3 ) over the summer and see how that feels
 

ScottB

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I use 0.5/3.0 tune on my Ax's in NE and it works great for me. Really good grip on hardpack from this ski. I have the 183cm AX and its really strong in the middle and just a bit soft on the ends. Very nice flex pattern. Tip goes through anything well and tail will release easily. I wouldn't say it pivots easily,(like a rockered ski) but its a carving ski, so its not supposed to. I have not been on an AR, so no feedback on the comparison. I have moved my bindings from 0 to +4 and it works at all those mountings. I settled on +1.5cm which shortens the turn radius with almost no loss of high speed stability. On the line, its more of a GS turn naturally. At +4 its almost doing slalom like turns. at 182/3cm its still a substantial ski and not something you flick around from side to side. But give it good input, and it does exactly what you want it to smoothly and damped.

@mdf
That's not the first time I've heard that. Mount point appears to make a big difference on these skis in the longest length. I wonder if I would have like mine if I changed it.


Your welcome to join me on the slopes and "see what I have done" with your old ski. You can ski it, but I won't sell it back to you. ;) I do think you would still like the 175cm better anyways.
 

Dave

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The beloved AX vs the new(er) AR.

I have lots of time on the AX but am wondering about the AR. Does it have the same magic turn initiation? The same versatility? The same smooth feeling?

Thoughts?

B


I own the AR and have some time on multiple versions of the AX. Turn initiation seems different to me between the two, If you like the feeling of the ski pulling you into the turn then it's the AX. The AR seems to respond more to the level of user input (for me at least). Seems like it is almost cheating how easy it is to vary the radius of your turns. Some might say turn initiation with the AR is more vague though, I guess it depends on your prospective. I also owned the SR 95 Tartan version, if you are familiar with that ski, the turn initiation of the AR is very similar to the SR95 in my experience, just a bit more nimble.

I think the AR has more versatility relative to the AX, others will disagree. AR is going to be better in chop, I think it is a better bump ski, maybe slightly better in 3d snow. AR can also have a subtle looseness about it that I don't notice in the other Lasers I have been on. Seems to respond to a slightly neutral stance better. That said, AR is still firmly an old school ski and in the frontside camp.

All the Stocklis I have been on have the same snow feel. Silky smooth, albeit a bit muted.

For those asking about the AR as a bump ski, I think it rocks. My DD for the last three years was the Laser SC, the AR is not as good a bump skis as the SC...but it's not far off.

Bottom line for me is that the AR is one of the best skis I have ever been on and easily my favorite Stockli.
 

Noodler

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I own the AR and have some time on multiple versions of the AX. Turn initiation seems different to me between the two, If you like the feeling of the ski pulling you into the turn then it's the AX. The AR seems to respond more to the level of user input (for me at least). Seems like it is almost cheating how easy it is to vary the radius of your turns. Some might say turn initiation with the AR is more vague though, I guess it depends on your prospective. I also owned the SR 95 Tartan version, if you are familiar with that ski, the turn initiation of the AR is very similar to the SR95 in my experience, just a bit more nimble.

I think the AR has more versatility relative to the AX, others will disagree. AR is going to be better in chop, I think it is a better bump ski, maybe slightly better in 3d snow. AR can also have a subtle looseness about it that I don't notice in the other Lasers I have been on. Seems to respond to a slightly neutral stance better. That said, AR is still firmly an old school ski and in the frontside camp.

All the Stöcklis I have been on have the same snow feel. Silky smooth, albeit a bit muted.

For those asking about the AR as a bump ski, I think it rocks. My DD for the last three years was the Laser SC, the AR is not as good a bump skis as the SC...but it's not far off.

Bottom line for me is that the AR is one of the best skis I have ever been on and easily my favorite Stöckli.

Just want to note that my impressions of how these skis differ and how they ski are almost totally opposite of your take, but we agree that they feel great on snow.
 

Dave

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Just want to note that my impressions of how these skis differ and how they ski are almost totally opposite of your take, but we agree that they feel great on snow.

LOL, well at least we agree on something!! I've never owned the AX, had a day demoing the older version that they came out with that was too soft (16/17??) and then two more days demoing within the last couple of years. So decent amount of time on them.

I sure do love the AR though. Best thing I can say about them is that I never even think about them when I ski...they just feel like an extension of me.
 

TahoeWarrior

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Both are outstanding skis. There are heaps of comments around SkiTalk on both. I own the AR, but was really on the fence between the two and would be 100% happy with either. Happy to debate each more. AX is slightly more playful, if that can be used on a serious ski, and does not need to be "driven" all the time. The AR is more requires more attention and if given charges a tad harder. Here is a quick comment I made on each last year:
 
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AndréL

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Both are outstanding skis. There are heaps of comments around SkiTalk on both. I own the AR, but was really on the fence between the two and would be 100% happy with either. Happy to debate each more. AX is slightly more playful, if that can be used on a serious ski, and does not need to be "driven" all the time. The AR is more requires more attention and if given charges a tad harder. Here is a quick comment I made on each last year:
I think your review of the AR is enough for me to take the plunge and buy them this weekend! I experienced the same feeling of a ski that rewards being driven but can work just fine at slower speeds. I think it fits the bill perfectly for east coast groomers and the messy snow piles of afternoon skiing.
 

TahoeWarrior

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I think your review of the AR is enough for me to take the plunge and buy them this weekend! I experienced the same feeling of a ski that rewards being driven but can work just fine at slower speeds. I think it fits the bill perfectly for east coast groomers and the messy snow piles of afternoon skiing.
I can only speak from my experience, but I've fallen more in love with my ARs over the last few months since my initial purchase. They continue to impress me. I hope you have the same experience - it's the best ski I've owned.
 

justaute

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Just want to note that my impressions of how these skis differ and how they ski are almost totally opposite of your take, but we agree that they feel great on snow.

I find comments from the two of you quite interesting. As an advanced-intermediate skier, I find myself liking carving more and more. That said, on the same day that I'm carving, I still would like to take a few runs in the trees and over a few moguls. Hence, I posted my questions on the main Stockli thread. I just can't seem to decide between AX and AR. FWIW, my home resort is Snowbasin, UT.
 

Noodler

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I find comments from the two of you quite interesting. As an advanced-intermediate skier, I find myself liking carving more and more. That said, on the same day that I'm carving, I still would like to take a few runs in the trees and over a few moguls. Hence, I posted my questions on the main Stöckli thread. I just can't seem to decide between AX and AR. FWIW, my home resort is Snowbasin, UT.

Since you're a self-professed advanced-intermediate, you would most likely be happiest on the AX. That's the ski that is more accessible and has the wider performance envelope. Your current technique will be challenged by the AR while the AX will probably help you improve your skiing. Look at this decision as an investment in your future skiing potential and pick the tool that's going to help you get there. :)
 

KingGrump

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Since you're a self-professed advanced-intermediate, you would most likely be happiest on the AX. That's the ski that is more accessible and has the wider performance envelope. Your current technique will be challenged by the AR while the AX will probably help you improve your skiing. Look at this decision as an investment in your future skiing potential and pick the tool that's going to help you get there. :)

:golfclap:

Too much ski can often set a skier back years.
 

flbufl

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168 cm AX this year, 175 cm AR next year. Problem solved.

I find comments from the two of you quite interesting. As an advanced-intermediate skier, I find myself liking carving more and more. That said, on the same day that I'm carving, I still would like to take a few runs in the trees and over a few moguls. Hence, I posted my questions on the main Stöckli thread. I just can't seem to decide between AX and AR. FWIW, my home resort is Snowbasin, UT.
 

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