W Champs Parallel Slalom: Men vs Womens times

[Simonsays]

Watching the team event today It struck me this is one of the few times men and women ski the same course.

Times were actually very close, much closer than I had expected. Average seemed to be around ~23.5 seconds. Fastest Man was 21.67 vs 22.57 for fastest woman but often women's times were close or on par with the mens.

All times here: https://www.fis-ski.com/DB/general/results.html?sectorcode=AL&raceid=114194#results

Possible reasons: There's just not that much in it nowadays between world best mens and womens skiers? Did men have to ski on GS reg. skis and did the turn radius not suit course set? Course length and type offers no real strength advantage?

Who else watched it and what did you think?

 

[Tony Storaro]

I watched it. Was too mesmerized by that Norwegian’s attempt to break the current world record in pool diving to notice anything else.

But 21.67 vs 22.57 is almost a full second, so dunno…

 

[bbbradley]

1.1 seconds on a 20 second course is a big gap.

 

[Simonsays]

1.1 seconds on a 20 second course is a big gap.

To be fair I think works out as only 0.9s, so less than a second but agree short course. The one thing that really did stick out and demonstrated just how good the world best are (of either gender) was seeing the times the skiers with bibs 60+ were getting (as much as 15 seconds gap per run). I assume the nature of the world champs limits number of skiers per nation and so you get a lot more skiers who wouldn't qualify for FIS WC or Europa Cup skiing.

 

[markojp]

WC athletes of either gender would pretty much eat everyone here for lunch even in a short course.

 

[bbbradley]

WC athletes of either gender would pretty much eat everyone here for lunch even in a short course.

There's typically a few former US team skiers at the Red Parka Challenge, they are fast but top tier fresh off the college circuit are damn fast too! I get thumped by 'em all quite soundly.

 

[Primoz]

WC athletes of either gender would pretty much eat everyone here for lunch even in a short course.

I wouldn't be so sure about this. Women comparing to men, even if they are WC women compared to recreational men skiers (with racing background) is not all that clear and sure who will win. I know it's not fair to compare women and men, but you said "WC athletes of either gender"

 

[markojp]

I said everyone here, on this site. I'm not buying the idea that Mikaela or most all in the top 25 (even more) wouldn't crush a bunch of 50+ year olds... even Doug Briggs and Scotskier

 

[DocGKR]

As bbbradley states, there are some very fast Masters racers who have WC, EC, Noram, NCAA backgrounds.

However, look at Sarah Schleper's times in recent international races to see how an older, former WC skier compares to current folks racing WC....

 

[Primoz]

@markojp I can say I'm lucky enough to run some gates from time to time when top (men and/or women) racers do their training runs, so I know how times are, and I also know how badly I suck in alpine skiing. On the other side, I happen to xc ski where plenty of top xc guys and girls train, at least occasinally, so you also get some idea about their speed, and while men are faster then superhumans, women are well... not that fast. And I also know, how badly I suck at xc skiing (a bit less then in alpine), that's why I said, I wouldn't really dare to bet on this what you wrote

 

[Tony Storaro]

WC athletes of either gender would pretty much eat everyone here for lunch even in a short course.

I have watched elite skiers both women are men training. My conclusion is that these guys and I are practicing totally different sports. Zero in common except we are all on a pair of planks.
Any comparison between elite skiers and average aficionados is laughable. But that goes for virtually any spot with road cycling being perhaps the most humiliating experience. You would not believe the size of the chasm there, it is heartbreakingly big.

 

[Primoz]

@Tony Storaro just to be clear. I didn't mean "average aficionados". I mean people who are nowadays recreational skiers, but have plenty of EC/WC racing background. For "average aficionados" I completely agree with you and @markojp that there's no way they could be anywhere near any WC athlete regardless of gender.

 

[bbbradley]

But that goes for virtually any spot with road cycling being perhaps the most humiliating experience. You would not believe the size of the chasm there, it is heartbreakingly big.

What about the Peloton riders knocking out 800+ watts for 60 mins?

 

[Mark1975]

I said everyone here, on this site. I'm not buying the idea that Mikaela or most all in the top 25 (even more) wouldn't crush a bunch of 50+ year olds... even Doug Briggs and Scotskier

Will agree with you on 50+ years olds...however I have seen male racers in the 30 to 40 year old age (even mid-40s) bracket smoke USST females. I am not talking about the average beer league racers, but guys who where also elite racers (academy and/or college) in their youth and have kept up on gate training and off season workouts.

 

[Tony Storaro]

What about the Peloton riders knocking out 800+ watts for 60 mins?

Whaaa..? Links,vids? I wanna see that.

P.S. Let me just quote something here:

• British cyclist Bradley Wiggins, who, in 2015, pedaled 54.526 kilometers (33.881 miles) to set the current men's record, is estimated to have averaged 440 watts.

800 you say…..hmmm…..

 

[bbbradley]

@Tony Storaro. I should have added the These riders either cheat or have broken bikes. The typical stats for these include 100% resistance for the entire ride...

 

[Tony Storaro]

@Tony Storaro. I should have added the These riders either cheat or have broken bikes. The typical stats for these include 100% resistance for the entire ride...

Ahhh...ok yeah, their trainers need calibration for sure…
I was talking about real life experience, on the road, when you do 35 km/h and are all smug and happy you are doing not bad at all and all of a sudden someone passes you at 50 km/h while having a casual conversation with his mate..the feeling is, well…not good.

 

[GB_Ski]

I don't know much about ski racing, so I'm probably wrong here. In many other sports, US high school boys competing at regional/national level will outperform if outright dominate Olympic winning female athletes in similar events. That's just biology.

 

[wnyskier]

Seems that no one in this conversation is taking into account course difficulty. Yes, I have seen top level masters racers be close to par with USST women in simple beer league races (i.e. short and flat). However, I doubt that would hold true on a WC/EC SL or GS course.

I seem to recall that Marlies Schild was a forerunner for one of the men's WC night SL back in the day and that she would have been within the top 30. Not likely any masters racer would be able to pull that off.

 

[markojp]

I don't know much about ski racing, so I'm probably wrong here. In many other sports, US high school boys competing at regional/national level will outperform if outright dominate Olympic winning female athletes in similar events. That's just biology.

I've seen Mikaela ski. HS boys don't ski like her.