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Vincent_Diesel

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The internet had served me nothing conclusive. Mondo sizing using a boot that is marked as 26.5 as an example. Does this mean the boots longest inside length is 26.5 centimeters from toe to heel without the liner? So with a liner, the boot could end up being less than 26.5 centimeters?

Also how are boots able to fit someone between sizes like my Atomics sized 26/26.5?

I'm sure it isn't this simple, thanks for helping me understand.
 

Philpug

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Mondo is a point of reference, basically a starting point when sizing boots. There is no standardization, YMMV.
 

coskigirl

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It's the same thing as any shoe where there might be someone between 12 and a 12.5 or whatever size. They don't make boots to exactly fit every foot which is why proper boot fitting with customization is so key to performance. Generally they start with the smaller size and stretch as necessary if you're between sizes.
 

crgildart

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Also, most vendors don't make shells in .5 sizes. The shells would be 24, 25, 26, 27 and they have liners to fill in and better fit people between those sizes.. So, with a 26.5 you are likely getting the same shell as the 26 but with less padding in the liner..


You will see the BSL (sole lengh) is the same for the 26 and 26.5
https://www.evo.com/guides/ski-boot-sole-length-size-chart
 
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Vincent_Diesel

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Fantastic, thanks for the help. This is new experience for me, and the learning curve hasn't been easy.

I understand that I should always see a proper boot fitter (which I did) BUT I could not pass up a deal the other day on a new set of Nordica boots. My first experience with a boot fitter was a costly mistake, on my part. He recommended me a 26/26.5 boot and I was adamant that I should be in a 27/27.5 because the larger size felt less painful, at the time. After my 10th day on those boots I now realize that after packing out my liners they are far too big (which may have resulted in an ankle injury). Again my mistake and didn't realize liners would pack out/condense to where they are now. I am a recreational skier and not necessarily looking for a race fit in my boots.

Fast forward to today, I am in new boots, 26/26.5. Doing a shell fit I am within proper range of less than a centimeter of heel space. With the boot liner in place, it is most definitely snug. If all goes well at the end of next season I will have a great fitting boot.

When buying a liner in the future it seems like I could be in a liner that is around 26/26.5. I had no idea that liners make up for the difference in sizing. It makes sense now.
 

cantunamunch

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When buying a liner in the future it seems like I could be in a liner that is around 26/26.5. I had no idea that liners make up for the difference in sizing. It makes sense now.

Don't forget that the shape and resting angles - and effective length on boot axis - of the foot change as the support (boot board and footbed) change. It's a bigger governing factor to eventual comfort than the internal size of the liner.
 

otto

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Contrary to crgildarts post, the liner does not make up for any difference in sizing. The shell AND and the liner are exactly the same in 26 or 26.5. Boot manufacturers would be out of business if they were building boot shells or liners on the half size. Most suppliers have made the market work with 9 shell sizes. Some have only 8. A few make 10 shell/liner sizes. At the smallest size some suppliers only make a 23 shell that they put a smaller 22 liner. And some make a 31 shell that they put 32, 33 liners into.

It's time to stop perpetrating the goofy myths about mondopoint sizing that have not been true for 10+ years. Read my lips.... 9 shell sizes, 9 liner sizes... The only difference between a shell and a liner that have a sticker that shows .0 versus .5 is the sticker on the shell, the sticker on the box, or the sewn on tab on the liner. Don't bother to respond and show me the few exceptions to the rule that exist. That's one of the reasons why it remains so confusing for ski shop employees and skiing consumers to understand how the mondopoint system works. It works so that boot shells and liners increase and decrease length by 10mm increments. It is simply a metric measuring stick based on 10mm increments.
 
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Vincent_Diesel

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Don't forget that the shape and resting angles - and effective length on boot axis - of the foot change as the support (boot board and footbed) change. It's a bigger governing factor to eventual comfort than the internal size of the liner.

I thought I was getting closer to understanding all this stuff. Facepalm. So in other words when buying liners don't buy online... get them fitted.
 
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Vincent_Diesel

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Contrary to crgildarts post, the liner does not make up for any difference in sizing. The shell AND and the liner are exactly the same in 26 or 26.5. Boot manufacturers would be out of business if they were building boot shells or liners on the half size. Most suppliers have made the market work with 9 shell sizes. Some have only 8. A few make 10 shell/liner sizes. At the smallest size some suppliers only make a 23 shell that they put a smaller 22 liner. And some make a 31 shell that they put 32, 33 liners into.

It's time to stop perpetrating the goofy myths about mondopoint sizing that have not been true for 10+ years. Read my lips.... 9 shell sizes, 9 liner sizes... The only difference between a shell and a liner that have a sticker that shows .0 versus .5 is the sticker on the shell, the sticker on the box, or the sewn on tab on the liner. Don't bother to respond and show me the few exceptions to the rule that exist. That's one of the reasons why it remains so confusing for ski shop employees and skiing consumers to understand how the mondopoint system works. It works so that boot shells and liners increase and decrease length by 10mm increments. It is simply a metric measuring stick based on 10mm increments.

So I am currently in a 26.0 cm boot. Wow, this totally blows my mind.
 
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LiquidFeet

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Welcome, @Vincent_Diesel, to the Boot Buying confusion.

Rules of thumb for boot buying:

Buy an almost-painfully small boot, fitted to your smallest foot, from a certified master bootfitter in a well-stocked shop, and have that bootfitter enlarge the areas in each boot that are pressing in on your foot's bulges. This is done by grinding the plastic away on the inside, or warming and punching out the plastic. It takes about two hours in the shop to go through this process. This customization is free with purchase, usually. You can return for further punches and grinds as you ski, usually with no charge, for the rest of the first season. Usually.

The plastic boot shell needs to fit your foot's anatomy in three dimensions: length-wise, width-wise, and height-over-thefoot-and-ankle-wise. Be sure the bootfitter checks how your foot aligns with the walls of the empty shell (bare foot in shell, liner removed) to make sure all three dimensions of the plastic shell are designed for a foot that is shaped like yours.
 
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coops

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Mondo shoe sizing is the most sensible shoe sizing system there is - it's essentially metric.

Your Mondo size is your foot length in mm.
(You can put a piece of A4 paper on the floor up against the wall, butt your heel up against the wall, mark where your big toe ends on the paper and take a ruler and measure your Mondo size that easily).

That's it.
Of course, for shoes and especially rigid ski boots, it would be 'nice' if there was also an agreed/consistent sizing system for width and instep height etc....

You may be a size '11 in the States... but pop over to good old blighty, and your size 11 is now a size '10' if you're man, but a women's US 11 is a UK women's 9 and what the dickens... and what do those numbers relate to anyway :doh:

On the other hand, find yourself in Japan or ordering some Asics shoes, you'll be glad to hear they do shoe sizes almost Mondo, but rather than mm they go for cm.
So if you're Mondo 235 then in Japan you can try on a shoe size of 23.5...

https://www.internationalshoesizes.com/mondopoint.htm
 

crgildart

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Contrary to crgildarts post, the liner does not make up for any difference in sizing. The shell AND and the liner are exactly the same in 26 or 26.5. Boot manufacturers would be out of business if they were building boot shells or liners on the half size. Most suppliers have made the market work with 9 shell sizes.
Aren't they also wasting money having more than 9 stickers/sew tags to label all the .5s differetnly if the boots and liners are exactly the same? Perhaps that is a bigger source of confusion???
 

otto

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Aren't they also wasting money having more than 9 stickers/sew tags to label all the .5s differetnly if the boots and liners are exactly the same? Perhaps that is a bigger source of confusion???

Old horse, new tricks...

Some dealers use the .0, .5 markings to help designate what model year the boot is from. Basically order odd or even sizing every other year helps the fitters know if the boot is current or last years model by the .0, .5 sticker.
 

Andy Mink

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Noodler

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As @Philpug told me, sipping from a firehose. The more you know, the more you know. And the more you fret about!

tumblr_kxlezdRbXO1qaukck.png


This one is a little less "generous" ;)

shit_you_know1.png
 

Andy Mink

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tumblr_kxlezdRbXO1qaukck.png


This one is a little less "generous" ;)

shit_you_know1.png
And then there's the stuff you know enough about to know you probably should know more but can't stop when you get there!
 

Andy Mink

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And then there's there stuff that you know just enough about to get yourself in an awful lot of trouble. ;)
Did you know you CAN melt a hole through a boot when doing a punch? Best to find that out on a practice boot!
 

Marker

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I was told there is a limit to how much you can punch a toe box if it will interface and release properly with the toe binding. I thought this sounded a little fishy, especially since the shell fit was good on my boots. But with new custom footbeds and heel lifts it ended well.
 

Steve

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Mondo shoe sizing is the most sensible shoe sizing system there is - it's essentially metric.

Your Mondo size is your foot length in mm.
(You can put a piece of A4 paper on the floor up against the wall, butt your heel up against the wall, mark where your big toe ends on the paper and take a ruler and measure your Mondo size that easily).

That's it.

Very cool. I just did this and measured 25.5mm. My boot size? 25.5 Mondo,
 

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