Safety Beacon in pocket

[Slim]

Wildsnow recently published another article on pocket-vs-harness stowing of your avalanche beacon.

I have tried to think this through before, and read what I could find, but I still found this useful proving some more experiences and pros and cons.

And, I learned a ‘new’ , ‘third’ option: in harness, but pushed around the back, just behind your kidney.

When I tried it out with just the beacon, it seemed like it would be uncomfortable, but once I put my backpack on, it actually wasn’t. I still have to try it out for real, but seems very promising.

It would solve almost all drawbacks of both pocket carry and tradional harness carry:

Well protected against impact and being ripped off, even if you are only wearing a base layer (t is spring after all!) , and well away from any other electronics.

I recommend the article and discussion for a read, even if you have already spent time thinking about it before:

Pocket Vs. Harness - Where Should You Wear Your Beacon? - The Backcountry Ski Touring Blog

Whether to wear your beacon in your pocket or in a chest harness is ultimately a personal choice, but each option has its pros and cons.

www.wildsnow.com

 

[Slim]

@Pequenita , where you the one asking last season about shortening your transceiver harness?

This position would seem to offer good comfort to shorter (female) users.

I will try it out with my daughters (5’10” and 5’2” now) and see what they think.

 

[Pequenita]

Huh. I put a safety pin in the bandolier strap to keep it from spontaneously slipping, and so far it’s been working. My problem has been that the strap spontaneously lengthens, and although there is usually a pack waste belt keeping the beacon from drooping below the waist, the times I’ve worn a beacon inbounds, it’s no longer near my chest or torso at the end of the day!

 

[Ken_R]

I always carry in pocket. A LOT of times I skin up with just my baselayer top. I dont ski without pants so. Easy choice. Yes my pants have a beacon specific pocket.

 

[nemesis256]

That's an interesting idea about putting it on the back, it would keep it away from my other electronics. I just tried it by putting it on normally and then swinging it back in the harness. Is there a better way? Found it a little uncomfortable with the backpack though.

 

[Noodler]

So pants are unlikely to be ripped off, but the pants should have a zippered beacon pocket.

Chest harness certainly impacts layering though. I would think there would be more concern in temporarily removing your harness to deal with layers. Doesn't seem like there are great solutions if your pants aren't beacon-ready.

 

[Doug Briggs]

I wear my beacon in its harness on my right side under at least one mid layer. The mid layer I'd wear closest to me doesn't come off. My phone always goes on my left.

 

[SBrown]

Perhaps I should start a new thread, but there is overlap here ... https://occasionallyepic.com/2020/05/the-uncomfortable-reality-of-beacon-boob/

I may try the back-carry soon, except my harness is packed away somewhere since I don't like using it. Pockets FTW, but this is definitely an issue. Beacon, phone, radio (with two pieces), backpack straps, sternum strap, ugh, all on a torso that has only 2.5 in. between lowest rib and iliac crest. Oh, and two boobs. I wear bibs with giant pockets all over them now, and men's shells, since the pockets are far superior to women's. I still need better solutions.

 

[Slim]

So pants are unlikely to be ripped off, but the pants should have a zippered beacon pocket.

Chest harness certainly impacts layering though. I would think there would be more concern in temporarily removing your harness to deal with layers. Doesn't seem like there are great solutions if your pants aren't beacon-ready.

Unlikely, but not impossible for pants to be ripped of. Beside that, there is the issue of pockets ripping off the pant, and of the beacon being smashed. That’s why I posted that article, and especially the comments, because it has a fair bit of people’s experiences with that sort of thing. Those experiences can help inform our personal decision of where to put it.

.
Chest harness certainly impacts layering though. I would think there would be more concern in temporarily removing your harness to deal with layers.

That is why the harness goes over ONLY your (first) base layer. So that it NEVER has to be taken off.

The problem with that is if you are only wearing one layer, you have nothing covering the beacon.

 

[Slim]

That's an interesting idea about putting it on the back, it would keep it away from my other electronics. I just tried it by putting it on normally and then swinging it back in the harness. Is there a better way? Found it a little uncomfortable with the backpack though.

That’s what I tried too, and it worked for me in my basement.
Of cours dit depends in packs, and beacon and body

 

[Noodler]

That is why the harness goes over ONLY your (first) base layer. So that it NEVER has to be taken off.

The problem with that is if you are only wearing one layer, you have nothing covering the beacon.

Exactly. Which is why what Ken posted would be concerning if you really wanted to strip down to your top base layer. I guess the only safe play is to have at least a thin layer over the base layer and harness, no matter what.

 

[Tony S]

So sad it wasn't actually about bacon.

 

[aveski]

So sad it wasn't actually about bacon.

You can have bacon in your pocket, just not the same pocket as your beacon.

 

[Primoz]

And, I learned a ‘new’ , ‘third’ option: in harness, but pushed around the back, just behind your kidney.
It would solve almost all drawbacks of both pocket carry and tradional harness carry:

Except that it would cause another one, maybe fatal, but luckily not to you. Once you would need it, it would take a while before you would get rid of backpack and all cloth layers to finally access it. Transceivers are, regarding what people think, two way street. It can help your colleagues find you (for this having it on back might not be problematic), but it can also help you find your colleagues. And for this, I would hate to think I need to have 5min break to finally have transceiver out and in search mode.
Then there are two other things. First in my mind, you actually have more chances to damage it on back then on front, as in most of crashes you land on your back quite hard, and vary rarely I go from head first and flat on stomach.
And second, which is way more important, you definitely don't want any weird objects next to your spine when you are crashing. Airbags and their systems are shitty enough to have on bag, so personally I wouldn't add another hard plastic box there.

 

[Slim]

@Primoz
I think you misunderstood the way I tried wearing it (which I think was the way the Swedish guys were doing).
No need to remove pack to acces it, that would be bad indeed, since you’d be left without your shovel and prove by the time you reach the victim!

No worry about spinal injury either, it was just on the side behind me. Kidney or other organ injury, perhaps, although I felt like my pack protected it quite well from impact.
Definitely something to verify though.

 

[Choucas]

I have a zipped (front) pocket (sewn in pocket not a cargo pocket) with a beacon slot and a ring that the beacon cord attaches to. If everything gets ripped off and the beacon goes away, I'm probably a goner anyway. I can access it quickly and immediately go into search mode. I keep the beacon attached to the clip while searching so I don't have issues if I drop the beacon. Pocket is right front. Cell phone goes in another zip pocket back of left thigh. The clip inside the pocket is made of plastic with a rather wimpy metal gate. No lock on the gate. Ultimate mod would be to replace the plastic clip with a locking metal carabiner.
This set up has worked well for me while doing on hill beacon drills.

 

[Noodler]

@Primoz
I think you misunderstood the way I tried wearing it (which I think was the way the Swedish guys were doing).
No need to remove pack to acces it, that would be bad indeed, since you’d be left without your shovel and prove by the time you reach the victim!

No worry about spinal injury either, it was just on the side behind me. Kidney or other organ injury, perhaps, although I felt like my pack protected it quite well from impact.
Definitely something to verify though.

I think a picture would definitely be worth 1000 words in this case. I'm still having difficulty envisioning exactly how this is setup.

 

[OnEdge]

I'm admittedly new to all of this, but I do find the pants pocket easier to manage than the body harness - beacon comes out easier and goes back in easier with the pants pocket when drilling (maybe from all practice with all of the cell phone checking over the years). Unzipping the jacket, reaching across my body with the opposite hand, fumbling with the BCA clip with mittens on and then doing the reverse to put the beacon back to shovel is much slower (maybe an absence of practice).

Also, as an east coast skier anything hard around my rib cage makes me worry about the increased potential for a broken rib in a bad fall. That doesn't seem to be a concern that others have, so maybe its just not a real risk with the softer snow and the design of the beacon and harness.

And for those folks who have the beacon for skiing certain inbounds terrain where its required or recommended, it sure seems more convenient to drop it in the pants pocket in the morning than dealing with the harness. But if spending a full day out in the sticks, strapping on and checking the function seems like an important part of the preparation ritual.

Although with the beacon in the pants pocket, you don't look nearly as cool when hanging out after skiing with the jacket off and harness exposed. Or for some of us, slinging lunch to kids in the cafeteria in between their morning and afternoon group programs...

 

[Primoz]

Unfortunately I had moment, where I needed to put this into real life several years ago (I'm sure someone can find that story here) so few other things that might be helpful, at least from my perspective. One thing is getting transceiver out, which might actually be easier on pants pocket (another thing is, none of pants I'm using has proper loop for transceiver in their pockets). But once you are done with fine search, you need to get probe and shovel out, and continue with your process. Having tranceiver just hanging on elastic rope of chest harnes doesn't really bother much (I know, not best in case of secondary avi), neither does just "throwing" transceiver into half open jacket. Getting transceiver back into pants pocket, especially with gloves on can be slower.
But then there's also how chest harnesses fit. The one from Pieps fits like crap for me, Ortovox is slightly better, but with both I need to sort of reset them through clothes when putting ABS backpack's waist belt. With Mammut on the other hand, I don't even know that I have transceiver there, and personally I still think it's safer on chest (well slightly lower), then on top of my thigh in pants pocket. As for getting to transceiver in case of emergency... I normally have 1 or 2 layers above transceiver (unless in spring, when going up in t-shirt... I know you should never have transceiver on top of clothes, but those times can be exceptions ). For up, I normally have it under midlayer, and for down, in 90% of cases, I just put hard shell over everything once on top, so I need to unzip hard shell and midlayer, which is, even with thick skiing gloves less then 2 seconds. In worse case, when it's really -15c or so, I put down jacket over midlayer and under shell, but never bother to put transceiver harness over midlayer then, so there's extra layer, but still doesn't add much to time needed to get transceiver out.

 

[Tricia]

Perhaps I should start a new thread, but there is overlap here ... https://occasionallyepic.com/2020/05/the-uncomfortable-reality-of-beacon-boob/

I may try the back-carry soon, except my harness is packed away somewhere since I don't like using it. Pockets FTW, but this is definitely an issue. Beacon, phone, radio (with two pieces), backpack straps, sternum strap, ugh, all on a torso that has only 2.5 in. between lowest rib and iliac crest. Oh, and two boobs. I wear bibs with giant pockets all over them now, and men's shells, since the pockets are far superior to women's. I still need better solutions.

The solutions for women continue to be a little different than the usual focus on BC ski apparel.
I had an interesting conversation with a custom ski clothing company about the features that are missing in ski clothing, but for women especially.