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ScotsSkier

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Ok, not being that well versed in Rossi/Look offerings I am trying to work out what is the difference between the Axial 3 and the Rockerflex race bindings. I suspect it is the mounting points for ethics's heel piece which appears be "floating" on the rocker flex but not sure. The rOckerflex appears to be required on the new R21 race plate while the Axial 3 fits the older R20 and R18 plates (and I assume is the same mount as the previous MFX race bindings.

Any info?
 

BGreen

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Off the top of my head the Axial 3 is a two piece binding (see Look SPX10) and the Rockerflex (Look SPX12-18) is a one piece binding designed for the R21 plate. SPX 10 works on R20. The one piece binding is heavier, but it allows the ski to flex naturally under it. If you are looking for bindings for you, go with the R21 and Rockerflex. If this is for slaloms for a junior athlete and the primary goal is to keep weight down, go with the two piece. Otherwise Rockerflex is your only option. The setup looks gas pedaled, but really it is just compensating for the thick heel piece. I think U14 and under we used the two piece for slalom, and Rockerflex for everything else. U12, particularly lighter athletes, were two piece and R20 for everything.

Make sure you also order the lift kit with longer screws. You are not going to be able to find screws for the toe at your local ski shop. Lift kits come in 1, 3 and 5 mm. Most of our skis were about 3 mm toe down with the R21 and we used stacked 1 mm plates to adjust.
 

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ScotsSkier

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Off the top of my head the Axial 3 is a two piece binding (see Look SPX10) and the Rockerflex (Look SPX12-18) is a one piece binding designed for the R21 plate. SPX 10 works on R20. The one piece binding is heavier, but it allows the ski to flex naturally under it. If you are looking for bindings for you, go with the R21 and Rockerflex. If this is for slaloms for a junior athlete and the primary goal is to keep weight down, go with the two piece. Otherwise Rockerflex is your only option. The setup looks gas pedaled, but really it is just compensating for the thick heel piece. I think U14 and under we used the two piece for slalom, and Rockerflex for everything else. U12, particularly lighter athletes, were two piece and R20 for everything.

Make sure you also order the lift kit with longer screws. You are not going to be able to find screws for the toe at your local ski shop. Lift kits come in 1, 3 and 5 mm. Most of our skis were about 3 mm toe down with the R21 and we used stacked 1 mm plates to adjust.

Thanks but I am pretty sure the axial 3 comes in the connected MFX (maxflex) version as well as 2 piece. Not normally any real weight difference between the 2 piece and the one piece (MFX), just the connected band Biggest weight differences are between the 15 and 18. The 15 and 18 both have the good metal toe but the 18 is quite a bit heavier than 15 so i prefer the 15 on a slalom and the 18 on a GS. the rocker flex/SPX has i believe a different heel mount (closer mounting holes perhaps?) but not certain and that is what i am trying to find out since I am probably going to Rossi for slalom next season. Also trying to work out what the difference is in the R21 and R20 plates and whether there is backward compatibility like with the latest marker piston plates which take the comp and excel bindings.
 

BGreen

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R21 is for Rockerflex, R20 is for two piece. The holes don't line up -- i.e. you can't mix and match. That's for Look/Dynastar. Maybe Rossignol is different. I assumed they were the same, but I never looked. For reasons of club politics, my kids were on Dynastar and the full time program is on Rossignol.
 
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ScotsSkier

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Thanks, The R20 takes the one piece mfx ( but not rockerflex) as well as the 2 piece pix. The R20 has been around for a few years now. The R21 is the latest plate designed for the rockerflex. Just trying to work out the difference in the mounting and whether the R21 also takes the old Px/mix binding. And it is the same plate on the dynastar and Rossi
 
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Swede

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Just sold off one of my daughter's GS pairs with 120 MFX. Have 120 RF:s on both GS ans SL. Both R21:s. As you say SS, the heel piece on the RF is "floating", MFX is not. Pretty sure the MFX was on a R21 race plate.
Look and Rossi RF/SPX the same. Thought they all (Rossi and Dynastar) came with Look from this year?
 

trailtrimmer

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Thanks, The R20 takes the one piece mfx ( but not rockerflex) as well as the 2 piece pix. The R20 has been around for a few years now. The R21 is the latest plate designed for the rockerflex. Just trying to work out the difference in the mounting and whether the R21 also takes the old Px/mix binding. And it is the same plate on the dynastar and Rossi

I put the old 15 din WC Rosi bindings on a pair of the Hero Masters with the R21 plate. I think the R20 and R21 are interchangeable with the current rockerflex and generation older MFX bindings. Haven't tried any without the bridge between the heel and toe.
 

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There are 4 Rocker derived bindings...

PX18 WC Rockerflex: All metal goodness that you expect from a top end race binding 10-18, 3530 g/pr
SPX 15 WC Rockerflex: Metal single pivot toe from the 18, but the SPX heel 7-15 2850 g/pr
SPX 14 Rockerace: two part toe/heel design SPX heel, Multi directional toe 5-14 2320 g/pr
SPX 12 Rockerflex: SPX heel, Multi directional toe 4-12 2520 g/pr

All bindings are Look branded now, no Rossignol bindings any more.
 

Swede

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IMG_2790.JPG


"Floating" heel on RF 120:s.
 

Philpug

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If the goal was to get a shorter mounting distance, why not just back to the Pivot? What is the advantage of the PX/SPX heel over the Pivot?
 

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More "power" they say. Haven't tried any of them (I ski Salomon). Both MFX and RF (spx) very nice bindings for racing.
 
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ScotsSkier

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If the goal was to get a shorter mounting distance, why not just back to the Pivot? What is the advantage of the PX/SPX heel over the Pivot?

maybe for folk like me that dont like the pivot..... :) not sure why they had to change form the PX/axial 3 race heel though, i guess it was one way to make the racers buy new bindings!!! PITA!
 

Primoz

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@ScotsSkier based on this what I have been told by few WC racers, it's suppose to be faster... like 0.1-0.2sec faster on single GS run (and these heels are out now for some 3 or 4 years already, at least on WC tour). Now if that's really true or not is the question, as personally I think there's simply no way to really test such things in alpine, especially not if you want reliable results, but I guess there has to be reason for change. But then again, it can also be just marketing and as you wrote, way to force people buy new stuff.
 
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ScotsSkier

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OK, update. I took a closer look at the R21 plate and think I have it worked out. The toe mounts on both the R20 and R21 plates are the same. The R21 plate is designed for the new Rockerflex heel which has both sets of screws close together (in fore/aft plane). The R21 plate heel mount therefore only has 1 set of metal inserts compared to the R20 with 2 sets of metal inserts which takes the older PX Race/MFX/Axial 3 heel piece with wider spaced screws. However the R21 plate also appears to have "dimples" which could be drilled out to take the older style heel
 
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ScotsSkier

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I dont have the R21 pictures at the moment I'm afraid. Waiting for next years FIS slalom. The 165 is changed a bit and actually has a little bit tail rocker...the changes are supposed to have improved the performance on hard surfaces but I haven't been on it yet
 
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ScotsSkier

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Just an additional aside on this. I now have a couple of sets of Rockerflex bindings here, the SPX15 and the SPX 18. The toe piece is identical on both but each heel piece on the 18 is approx 12 oz. heavier!! .....
 

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