Van Deer/Red Bull and WC Racing

[Tony Storaro]

Except that this is just a myth and you can easily buy helmet painted like RB can in store, regardless if it's ski, bike or whatever other helmet. At least in Europe it's not all that hard to buy it if you want to wear commercial for someone who is actually charging you to wear it instead of paying you to wear it. I guess closest Intersport store is first place to shop for this if someone is really interested in having them.

Ah c’mon, don’t be like that. I’d gladly wear the yellow helmet with Reifeisen logo on it without them paying me a cent.
Or Dekra cap. Or Mapei jersey.

 

[Swiss Toni]

Henrik Kristoffersen used Van Deer/Red Bull-branded boots at Sölden. Rossignol/Lange decided not to supply him with boots for this season, so Van Deer/Red Bull made a boot for him. According to reports in the Austrian press, Hubert Immler, whom they employed in 2022, had a hand in designing them. https://skiweltcup.tv/index.php/mar...tioniert-skischuhe-fuer-henrik-kristoffersen/

 

[Primoz]

@Tony Storaro its perfectly fine for me if you do this. I have absolutely no problem with that

 

[Tony S]

You really can’t tell the helmet is the same as the Red Bull can?

Yes, I can tell that the helmet is definitely not a can. One resembles the other, but completely different geometrical form, to be unnecessarily precise. Which means they are built from different blue and silver elements. (And, to be honest, if you don't attach the pic of the can, I couldn't recall how is it designed, as I'm neither a RB fan nor a RB customer.)

That's why I ask, what is the exact rule/limit/line?
"It reminds me" is far from being exact, and can only lead to controversies.

James, I'm with Tom on this. Of COURSE you can tell it's Red Bull branding. The question is how to construct a rule to address the less obvious but commercially equivalent cases.

You might say, "Well, if it's less obvious then the marketing isn't as effective and therefore it's not commercially equivalent." I suspect that experts in this area would beg to differ.

 

[Philpug]

Yes, they’re nice.They’ve sold them in the US.
That and the Julia (Mancuso) helmet they used to sell were the nicest. The Julia was a very nice blue.
i think the RedBull one was a Lindsey. Vonn edition, but could be wrong.

>edit<
Well, half wrong. Looks like it was Briko:
View attachment 214331

I am either wrong or working off of old information ... or both.

 

[Tony Storaro]

I am either wrong or working off of old information ... or both.

You may not be tho, those Brikos are not available anymore. I checked.

 

[gmp]

Henrik Kristoffersen used Van Deer/Red Bull-branded boots at Sölden. Rossignol/Lange decided not to supply him with boots for this season, so Van Deer/Red Bull made a boot for him. According to reports in the Austrian press, Hubert Immler, whom they employed in 2022, had a hand in designing them. https://skiweltcup.tv/index.php/mar...tioniert-skischuhe-fuer-henrik-kristoffersen/

Open file. you may have a different answer.

 

[Swiss Toni]

If you look closely, they are not the same boots. There is a metal forward lean/flex adjuster on the back of the cuff on the Van Deer boot, which Lange boots don’t have. The toe dam on the Van Deer boot is different, as is the cuff aliment adjuster. As I said above, the Rossignol group has decided not to supply him with boots this season. https://www.oe24.at/sport/winterspo...ristoffersen-bangt-um-sein-material/573586761

 

[Tony Storaro]

If you look closely, they are not the same boots. There is a metal forward lean/flex adjuster on the back of the cuff on the Van Deer boot, which Lange boots don’t have. The toe dam on the Van Deer boot is different, as is the cuff aliment adjuster. As I said above, the Rossignol group has decided not to supply him with boots this season. https://www.oe24.at/sport/winterspo...ristoffersen-bangt-um-sein-material/573586761

Who makes these for them? I mean sure if they can build a factory for F1 engines, ski boots must be a piece of cake, but sill…

 

[DocGKR]

I wonder if that means Van Deer will stop using Look plates and bindings....

 

[Primoz]

You may not be tho, those Brikos are not available anymore. I checked.

Probably because noone using Briko in Red Bull colors anymore for few years now. But if nothing else, go to Amazon and you will find plenty of all sort of Red Bull helmets, from bike, motobike, car, MX or skiing. If it would be Aliexpress I would say they are fake, but I doubt there are fake helmets on Amazon. But then again, maybe they are.

 

[Tony S]

Probably because noone using Briko in Red Bull colors anymore for few years now. But if nothing else, go to Amazon and you will find plenty of all sort of Red Bull helmets, from bike, motobike, car, MX or skiing. If it would be Aliexpress I would say they are fake, but I doubt there are fake helmets on Amazon. But then again, maybe they are.

There is fake everything on Amazon. I've been a victim of that more than once.

 

[DocGKR]

Why would anyone want to use a Red Bull helmet if they were not getting paid to wear it???

 

[Tony Storaro]

Probably because noone using Briko in Red Bull colors anymore for few years now. But if nothing else, go to Amazon and you will find plenty of all sort of Red Bull helmets, from bike, motobike, car, MX or skiing. If it would be Aliexpress I would say they are fake, but I doubt there are fake helmets on Amazon. But then again, maybe they are.

I just checked, cant see anything. Red+Bull+Helmet search returns only motorcycle helmets-2 of them. Perhaps they are hiding the good stuff from me, the b*stards…

 

[Tony S]

If you look closely, they are not the same boots. There is a metal forward lean/flex adjuster on the back of the cuff on the Van Deer boot, which Lange boots don’t have. The toe dam on the Van Deer boot is different, as is the cuff aliment adjuster. As I said above, the Rossignol group has decided not to supply him with boots this season. https://www.oe24.at/sport/winterspo...ristoffersen-bangt-um-sein-material/573586761

AI or no AI, I see that Google Translate still has some work to do.

oe24 asked Van Deer mastermind Toni Giger. The former ÖSV sports director mysteriously: "Henrik will be at the start in Sölden with one shoe." The Salzburger didn't want to reveal which one.

 

[Tony S]

Why would anyone want to use a Red Bull helmet if they were not getting paid to wear it???

Have you never seen someone walking down the street in a Red Sox sweatshirt? Have you never seen a cyclist wearing a Team Sky jersey? People want to be associated with their heros.

 

[James]

Why would anyone want to use a Red Bull helmet if they were not getting paid to wear it???

The Red Bull colored helmet was by far the most interesting colored helmet. Without the Red Bull tag it really would be quite nice. I don’t think Briko is selling it anymore.

People pay good money to wear an English Premier league jersey, which is all ads.

Just cause something is the same colors, doesn’t make it the same.

 

[dbostedo]

The Red Bull colored helmet was by far the most interesting colored helmet. Without the Red Bull tag it really would be quite nice. I don’t think Briko is selling it anymore.

People pay good money to wear an English Premier league jersey, which is all ads.

Just cause something is the same colors, doesn’t make it the same.

View attachment 214401
View attachment 214400

The flag examples are interesting, but not really directly relevant since they aren't trademarks per se, so intentionally aren't unique. The brands however do strive to be unique, and would sue each other if their branding/logos were a similar as those flags I'd imagine

 

[Swiss Toni]

Who makes these for them? I mean sure if they can build a factory for F1 engines, ski boots must be a piece of cake, but sill…

No idea, money doesn’t seem to be a problem so they may have bought an injection molding machine. They might be having them made by a contract manufacturer such as Unimonteco https://www.unimonteco.com/en-UK/lavorazione-della-plastica.php They might even be getting them made by Dalbello, last month they appointed Jonathan Wiant as CEO, he was previously President of Brands at Marker Dalbello Voelkl.

I wonder if that means Van Deer will stop using Look plates and bindings....

Now that Jonathan Wiant is running things, they might change to Marker, they already use Marker bindings on their WC skis.

 

[James]

The flag examples are interesting, but not really directly relevant since they aren't trademarks per se, so intentionally aren't unique.

You mean other than wars and people killing each other over raising their flag?

The bold -really??
Netherlands and Russian flag. Same colors, same stripes, different order. Flying the later from a pickup truck in Ukraine held areas would not end well. You’re probably best off not flying the Dutch flag either because someone might just see the red,white, blue horizontal stripes and neutralize it.