Whitewalker 121s should I pull the trigger

[dovski]

P-18's.

How about a DOS Lotus 124, that is what’s hiding behind door 2 and actually found a pair of Spurs in 189cm too

 

[James]

Since you’re likely to have it awhile, getting something tailored for you like a Praxis would seem to make more sense. You can have a back and forth with someone who makes skis. You’re way out on the Bell curve for size.
For example, for a powder ski, I’m dubious that more sidecut is the answer, especially at your size. But I have little experience of powder skis.

I tend to think it’s actually a waste unless you knew you liked it. Might as well make the process interesting and work with someone.

 

[BS Slarver]

For Sale - 2020-2021 191 cm DPS Lotus 124 Alchemist Spoon - skiied 5 times

Little bit of camber with 2mm, sidecut radius is 23m, 191 length, 124 waist, Tip and tail splay is 74mm/33mm, nose and tail measure 149/136, weigh in at 4,307 grams, Rocker/Camber/strong flat tail rocker, some rock damage that has been professionally cleaned up. Just bought the Moment Wildcat...

www.skitalk.com

^^^ Insider deal. Great options out there especially off season. .Agree w @James with the praxis, Kieth is always a pleasure to work with on a summer build, the Salomon Blank, me on the kastle ZX115.

 

[Tom K.]

Liberty Skis Genome - 2024

DON'T FEAR THE GIRTH. For its massive size the Genome is surprisingly nimble, due to tip and tail Bomb Rocker and lightweight construction. You can float, pivot, and romp in deep snow, but can lay down tracks on harder stuff because of the unique camber profile. The Genome will make you a...

libertyskis.com

I've just always wanted a pair of these for really deep days.

 

[dovski]

Liberty Skis Genome - 2024

DON'T FEAR THE GIRTH. For its massive size the Genome is surprisingly nimble, due to tip and tail Bomb Rocker and lightweight construction. You can float, pivot, and romp in deep snow, but can lay down tracks on harder stuff because of the unique camber profile. The Genome will make you a...

libertyskis.com

I've just always wanted a pair of these for really deep days.

So basically you want a mono board lol

yes those would have some float.

 

[dovski]

For Sale - 2020-2021 191 cm DPS Lotus 124 Alchemist Spoon - skiied 5 times

Little bit of camber with 2mm, sidecut radius is 23m, 191 length, 124 waist, Tip and tail splay is 74mm/33mm, nose and tail measure 149/136, weigh in at 4,307 grams, Rocker/Camber/strong flat tail rocker, some rock damage that has been professionally cleaned up. Just bought the Moment Wildcat...

www.skitalk.com

^^^ Insider deal. Great options out there especially off season. .Agree w @James with the praxis, Kieth is always a pleasure to work with on a summer build, the Salomon Blank, me on the kastle ZX115.

So I don’t disagree that a custom ski like a Praxis would be amazing but it would also be exponentially more expensive and hard to justify for a ski I would use a couple times a season at most.

To be clear I don’t need a deep powder ski as we rarely have those conditions and I can always rent if I go cat skiing again.

I’ve heard some really good things about the Whitewalker and get basically pick it up at about 70-80% off which makes very reasonable. My thinking was that if I ski it once and it is terrible I can just sell it on the cheap and break even. My other thought was that I. Those rare deep powder days it is probably a better choice than what I currently have. Do agree that a little longer would be better so poking around to see what I can find at a comparable price.

 

[cantunamunch]

and hard to justify for a ski I would use a couple times a season at most.

To be clear I don’t need a deep powder ski as we rarely have those conditions and I can always rent if I go cat skiing again.

I am going to push back against both those statements -

You say couple of times a season until you figure out how fun they are and start bringing them to all the corn and slush events. Which all of a sudden become more frequent because fun.

Secondly rentals are *very* unlikely to be adapted to tree skiing and your size both. Hell, I'm 40 lbs lighter than you and I can't rely on finding stuff that works.

Need? What is need, other than want, once the basics are met?

Lastly, frequency of use cannot be the only underlying basis for defining utility. If it was, airbags wouldn't exist.

PS of course if you're saving shekels for a Cybertruck *shrug*

 

[James]

Liberty Skis Genome - 2024

DON'T FEAR THE GIRTH. For its massive size the Genome is surprisingly nimble, due to tip and tail Bomb Rocker and lightweight construction. You can float, pivot, and romp in deep snow, but can lay down tracks on harder stuff because of the unique camber profile. The Genome will make you a...

libertyskis.com

I've just always wanted a pair of these for really deep days.

Couple years ago we had a guy on those. Well actually the older one that was wider, 146. Conditions that day were pretty damn firm. Even the liftie said to him, “Aren’t those a little wide?” To which he responded, they’re 146!.
I talked to him in the liftline. He was touring around the East, and this is the ski he chose. I repeated, “aren’t they a little wide for the East?” To which he said, they’re great everywhere!”

Need? What is need, other than want, once the basics are met?

Lastly, frequency of use cannot be the only underlying basis for defining utility. If it was, airbags wouldn't exist.

Totally agree. I don’t see the reason to pick up left overs just because they’re cheap. You’ve now committed 1 1/2 seasons likely and then you’re back where you started. It’s not like someone in their 20’s with infinite time.

 

[dovski]

So to be clear I have a couple friends who skied these and loved them. I really like their rocker profile and that they are light weight. For deep pow these should be a super fun surfy ski, and while I believe they made them in 191 at some point , I do not see that length anywhere and believe that 183 is the only option. If I buy them they will be an addition to my quiver and will have not be used in deep pow. If the ski did not intrigue me I would not be considering it. The shape and construction are unique and the fact that they have no edge at the top or the tail is also interesting. Has anyone skied these? If so what did you think?

 

[Mothertucker]

found a pair of Spurs in 189cm

^^^I like this idea, and the Praxis, but of course we are spending your money.

 

[Aeolian]

To be clear I don’t need a deep powder ski as we rarely have those conditions and I can always rent if I go cat skiing again.

While I think you are going a bit short and narrow - the Whitewalker is definitely an interesting ski. It'd be on my list of fun skis to demo. Sounds low risk. Lack of edges tip and tail is a weight saver, but probably not a big deal unless you do flippy spinny things. Lots of folks detune the heck out of powder skis...

A bit of a tangent - but regarding that "rarely have those conditions" in your area thing... Profile says Seattle. Who knows how things will play with climate change. We've had worse years than this in the PNW (e.g. the disaster of 2015). But this has been a pretty bad one. And the past few have been nothing to write home about. So take this observation in a longer context. And with some hope for a good La Niña season in 24/25.

The WA Cascades have historically been undersold. Go back a decade or so (maybe bestsnow.net still has the data....and ignoring 2015...) and Baker often had the most snow. Stevens was frequently top five-ish for snowfall - often with exceptionally good quality. Alpental was globally famous. Crystal was Tabke's home mountain and you could see him there pretty regularly. Yeah, there were somewhat frequent warm spells and pineapple expresses. But overall, the PNW areas historically have gotten more than their fair share of deep fresh snow. Including what I'd certainly call powder. In the spring, a >100 inch typical settled snowpack delivered lots of granular slush, and some real inbounds corn. Put another way, I've gotten back from Heli trips in BC and skied better deeper snow at Seattle area hills.

If we get lucky and get a year or three like the old days, you may well have more use for a ski of genre than you think.

It is now all overrun and formerly secret spots are widely known - otherwise I would not even think of saying this today

 

[cantunamunch]

^^^I like this idea, and the Praxis, but of course we are spending your money.

He's just trying to prime us to snap up his unwanted Armadas next season

 

[dovski]

If we get lucky and get a year or three like the old days, you may well have more use for a ski of genre than you think.

Amen to that ... even this year we had a couple great powder days at Alpental, and two years back was off the hook. So yes these skis may get used more than once or twice a year on a good year, but they will not be my daily drivers. I also seem to have amassed a larger quiver than most lol

Ok in fairness there are 5 of us, but I have done quite well with regard to picking up skis at make you buy it prices and to date have only unloaded one because I really did not like it .... but even then I still did ok.

He's just trying to prime us to snap up his unwanted Armadas next season

As my kids outgrow them or as I replace them in my quiver I do sell skis but to date just one pair on skitalk, so far it has been a lot easier to get rid of gear locally on Craigslist or trade it in at Powder7 for new gear (yes they have a great trade in program there)

 

[GregK]

Whitewalker line are light, stiff skis with a more centered mount designed for butters and slashing in fresh powder. They float just okay for their width and wouldn’t put anyone much over 175lbs on the 183cm 121. They suck in tracked snow or crud because of their lack of weight and would be scary on anything firm.
So not a versatile ski at all and not for someone 275lbs!

Powder skis like any other ski CAN BE very versatile so that you do use them more often as many are fantastic in crud days after a storm, in Spring snow as well of course in fresh or tracked snow.
You’ve got a set of the Enforcer 110(but the original lighter versions I think) that are similar as they can be used in a variety of conditions for a wider ski. The Enforcer 115 instantly comes to mind as it’s a wider, more appropriate width and length for your size. Will be much more stable than the 185cm Enforcer 110 and the float and crud performance is on another planet compared to it. Available on deals still as it’s no longer made and I’d try for an even bigger discount as these should be 50% off retail at least.

Nordica Enforcer 115 Free Skis 2023

For those who demand more, the Enforcer 115 Free delivers. As the widest and stiffest ski in the Enforcer Free collection, it craves deep powder days and sweeping turns. For exceptional stability and response, it pairs a balsa wood core with carbon and two sheets of metal, which dampen...

ski-depot.com

Also saw the K2 Reckoner 122 available for $350 CAN and add another 10% off if you add to the mailing list. Available in the appropriate 191cm size too. Not quite as versatile as the Enforcer 115 but much better than the Whitewalker 121 would be.

K2 Reckoner 122 Skis - Men's

Save BIG on Reckoner 122 Skis - Men's from K2. FREE SHIPPING in Canada on qualifying orders.

www.thelasthunt.com

 

[dovski]

Ok so on to plan B,

how about the DPS Lotus 124 in 185cm what do folks think of that option? Have a line on a super cheap pair of lightly used demos

while I enjoyed skiing the Spur, in 179 it is a very heavy ski and feels more like an Alaska or heli ski vs a PNW deep pow skis that said I can snatch it with demo bindings for around $300 so also an option .

I think the masses have convinced me that the Whitewalker 121 is not going to work for me.

last question for the group what do you think of the atomic bent chetler 120, that is also an option and I know a couple folks who swear by it.

 

[dovski]

So quick update:

• I was going to buy a Spur 189 demo ski off Powder 7 that was going to work out to $19 after trading in two older pairs of skis, unfortunately that sold while I was skiing in Mt Bachelor
• Ended up buying the DPS Pagoda Lotus 124 in 185cm Demo ski from Powder 7 for a around $200 after trade in credit
• Then found a pair of Spurs in 169 on Ebay that were mounted to my son's BSL. The seller has skied them 3 times and let them go for around $300, so now my son has a pair of powder skis too.

Will post some picks once everything arrives but think this worked out for the best and at a fraction the cost of the Whitewalker setup Now we just have to wait for a POW day to let em rip.

 

[silverback]

Did someone say cat skiing below the tree line?

Protest

www.praxisskis.com

He missed the recommendation

 

[dovski]

He missed the recommendation

No I saw it, but the longest ski they had was 177, and the flat skis were almost double what I payed for 2 pairs of skis with bindings. It would have been triple if I had pulled the trigger on the Spurs in 189 before my ski trip as they were under $20 with my trade ins .... just proves that you snooze you loose. All that said, Powder7 has a great program where they give you trade in credit for your old skis and they also have some of their lightly used Demo skis priced quite nicely. So I bought the 2023 DPS Pagoda Lotus 124s in 185 CM with Warden bindings for $589 but also got $370 in trade in credit for two pairs of skis we do not use anymore., I think that is a killer deal for an almost $2K setup. The Spurs I missed out on from them were priced at something like $389 with Jester bindings, also 2023 skis, so my out of pocket would have been $19. Just saying for a Powder Ski I will only use a handful of times each year spending $1k plus on a setup probably does not make much sense, but $200-$300 does. Also remember this ski is going into an existing quiver that include:

• 2021 Stockli Laser AX - 175 cm
• 2022 Stormrider 95 - 184
• 2024 Stormrider 95 - 182
• 2019 Enforcer 110 - 185 (the green one)

So as you can see I've got a nice spread, though my SR95 is my daily driver on most days (older pairs are now my rock skis). AX comes out on hard packed and icy days and Enforcer 110 has been my POW ski for quite some time. After Cat skiing I decided I wanted a proper pair of POW skis as there are a handful of legit POW days each year where a ski like that would be super fun. Also as the kids are growing up and moving out I am hoping to do a little more of the deep pow skiing as I am no longer tied to their schedules

I think the only thing left on my shopping list is potentially a narrower Freeride ski for my son as there are times where conditions at comps are super icy and a mid 80's ski would be nice to have. Not a must have but a nice to have if we can find the right ski at a reasonable price. We may end up getting a pair of Rustler team skis from a friend which would give my son an all Blizzard Quiver, certainly not a bad thing lol.

 

[AltaSkier]

To echo what others are saying, I think you need a longer ski. I like powder skis long, they add stability in the fore/aft direction which really helps.

I tend to open up the speed in pow, because, well, it's more funner. You have 90lbs on me, but for reference, I like a pow ski around 190cm, and 195s don't scare me off, depending on the ski. I also like a straighter sidecut, something in the high 20's at a minimum.

I think your decision on the DPS Lotus was a good one. I've never skied that ski, but it is very high on my list.

The thing about a deep pow day is that they get etched in your memory. A great day in 30" plus of fresh is the stuff you will remember on your death bed. Why let a poor ski choice cheat you out of your dying wish?

 

[dovski]

To echo what others are saying, I think you need a longer ski. I like powder skis long, they add stability in the fore/aft direction which really helps.

I tend to open up the speed in pow, because, well, it's more funner. You have 90lbs on me, but for reference, I like a pow ski around 190cm, and 195s don't scare me off, depending on the ski. I also like a straighter sidecut, something in the high 20's at a minimum.

I think your decision on the DPS Lotus was a good one. I've never skied that ski, but it is very high on my list.

The thing about a deep pow day is that they get etched in your memory. A great day in 30" plus of fresh is the stuff you will remember on your death bed. Why let a poor ski choice cheat you out of your dying wish?

So earlier this year I went cat skiing in BC and every run had 5-8' of fresh pow, super deep and super fun. I was on a Blizzard Spur 179, which was shorter than my daily driver but worked really well. I really liked the Spur but did wish it had a little more tip and tail rocker like the Lotus 124. Agree that the DPS in a 191 would be ideal, but had this crazy good deal on the 185, so willing to give it a shot. At around $200 out of pocket how can I go wrong, and it is definitely be much more of a POW ski than anything else in my quiver. Should I get to the stage where I am heli skiing in Alaska or interior BC every weekend, then yes it is time to spend some real $$ on the ideal ski, but I do not see that in my near future unless I get that winning lottery ticket ... though that means I need to start playing the lottery lol.

To be clear I was tempted by the Whitewalker because it really is a cool looking ski and the sale price was enticing ... but once I bought and mounted bindings the price was getting up there and as everyone pointed out probably not the right ski for me, though I still want to try it if there is ever the chance to demo it.

Here is hoping for an amazing POW season that makes good use of these new skis