Wintersteiger Jupiter -- For an out of this world tune.

[Philpug]

This thread is for the general discussion of the Article Wintersteiger Jupiter -- For an out of this world tune.. Please add to the discussion here.

 

[cantunamunch]

Are all the Skitalk long term test fleet getting radial tunes now?

 

[pchewn]

How on earth are they fixturing or holding the skis to be flat? The rocker/camber/rocker has to be bent flat for the grinding? How is that done?

 

[Mike Thomas]

How on earth are they fixturing or holding the skis to be flat? The rocker/camber/rocker has to be bent flat for the grinding? How is that done?

It's all done with suction pumps and mirrors.

 

[cantunamunch]

It's all done with suction pumps and mirrors.

Too bad Wintersteiger don't do the doors in that color.

 

[scott43]

I'm a little worried their grind is the same level as their spelling... V-Egde??

Seriously though, nice grind.

 

[cantunamunch]

Seriously though, nice grind.

Egde bothers you and the on/off worm wiggle side winder trail just left of center doesn't?

 

[tube77]

I am curious how one can maintain the side edge with a fixed bevel guide?
If it's varying from 87.4 to 87.8 from tip to center, then which bevel guide should be used? 88 or 87 or both?

 

[cantunamunch]

If it's varying from 87.4 to 87.8 from tip to center, then which bevel guide should be used? 88 or 87 or both?

The error in the bevel guide just due to tool path/coverage and clamping, is bigger than the .4 degree shown. In other words, you use the 87 and sharpen whatever fits against it - which will not be all of the edge.

 

[scott43]

Egde bothers you and the on/off worm wiggle side winder trail just left of center doesn't?

View attachment 158308

I had an English minor in Uni... My ability to detect the Sidewinder Trail is decidedly Grade School level...

 

[BS Slarver]

New Jupiter here in Big Sky at Grizzly Outfitters, my mind was blown on the tune they gave my new AXs. Looks like a lot of tunes to pay for that puppy,

Owners there aren’t afraid to drop the coin and given the volume they do, it won’t be long to recoup it.

 

[Tom K.]

New Jupiter here in Big Sky at Grizzly Outfitters, my mind was blown on the tune they gave my new AXs. Looks like a lot of tunes to pay for that puppy,

Owners there aren’t afraid to drop the coin and given the volume they do, it won’t be long to recoup it.

Hmmm, not that far from Whitefish.

What are they getting for a Full Meal Deal grind and tune?

An impressive piece of kit, for sure.

 

[Philpug]

I'm a little worried their grind is the same level as their spelling... V-Egde??

Seriously though, nice grind.

I saw that too. I was going to mis spell it in my article too but I knew it would give our editor in chief fits.

 

[cantunamunch]

I saw that too. I was going to mis spell it in my article too but I knew it would give our editor in chief fits.

So. Any chance of a SkiTalk nordic service? *puppy dog eyes*

XC Ski Base "Rejuvenation"

My skate ski bases are pretty shiny after many years, and probably a few waxes with the iron set a bit on the warm side. I don't have reasonable access to anybody willing to stone-grind xc skis. Anybody have any poor man's workarounds that will get me close? Thanks!

www.skitalk.com

 

[Tom K.]

So. Any chance of a SkiTalk nordic service? *puppy dog eyes*

I would kill to be able to get a quality xc stone grind in MT, even if it's 5 hours away.

Maybe @BS Slarver could inquire next time he pops into Grizzly Outfitters?

 

[James]

Not a fan of radial tunes. I don’t like the feeling of the middle biting before the tip. (That’s base bevel variance, not edge.)If it stops shops from seriously detuning tips and tails so they can never be recovered, fine.

But all in all, this machine is a big yawn. Who cares about fancy structure for recreational alpine skis? It’s a shiny object to distract people.

Is there some sort of feedback loop that the machine has to check itself, mostly on the base flatness? Until they come out with that, these machines are just making tuning more expensive and or putting shops at serious debt risk. Everything about the machines are expensive, like the grinding stone, which wears out, software upgrades, service.

I’d love to see the real economics of these, because they’re convincing shops they’ll make money with them. Seems like we’re getting into farm machinery territory.

Fancy structure - sorry, it’s worthless, only you pay a lot for it.

That a place in Big Sky has it is more than ironic. I remember 10 years ago when we had a Stockli demo someone brought from his shop in Calgary. I hit a rock right in the middle while scoring some amazing untouched powder. (No one skied it for good reason). We take it to one of the shops and start talking about base and edge bevels. We get back, “ I can see your from the East, I don’t do that stuff. I’ll just fill it. “
That was totally fine. Actually preferable. It’s pretty funny that now people in Big Sky “need” this fancy stuff.

Hah, make the bases Fischer neon yellow and you can’t see a damn thing anyway.

I guess shops don’t have much of a choice these days edp with little reliable experienced labor. Oh well.

 

[cantunamunch]

But all in all, this machine is a big yawn. Who cares about fancy structure for recreational alpine skis? It’s a shiny object to distract people.

Is there some sort of feedback loop that the machine has to check itself, mostly on the base flatness? Until they come out with that, these machines are just making tuning more expensive and or putting shops at serious debt risk. Everything about the machines are expensive, like the grinding stone, which wears out, software upgrades, service.

I’d love to see the real economics of these, because they’re convincing shops they’ll make money with them. Seems like we’re getting into farm machinery territory.

Fancy structure - sorry, it’s worthless, only you pay a lot for it.

This is exactly why @Tom K. and I are interested in nordic applications -

- it DOES make a difference, no matter how slow/pokey/fat/sluggish you are.
- it CANNOT be done with super-cheapo machines, for pressure and aggressive reasons
- there is a completely undeveloped market out there

As to whether it makes sense financially for the shop

 

[DanoT]

Most of the skiing public is not going appreciate the structures that this machine can impart. The real value of the machine is if can be a significant labour saving device in very busy tuning shops. Also, training someone to run the machine is likely a quicker learning curve vs learning to tune skis to a high level by hand, and do it quickly.

 

[James]

This is exactly why @Tom K. and I are interested in nordic applications -

- it DOES make a difference, no matter how slow/pokey/fat/sluggish you are.
- it CANNOT be done with super-cheapo machines, for pressure and aggressive reasons
- there is a completely undeveloped market out there

As to whether it makes sense financially for the shop

Just get one of those specialty nordic machines. Used to be one in Stowe.
Zach Caldwell is not using a $500k machine. Send your skis to him in VT. Or someone like him somewhere else. You will get a better job then some yahoo who’s never seen a xc ski, plugging in numbers on a computer screen. It’s a joke.

Now, maybe he’s not doing it anymore, but he would grind 1-2 thousand xc skis per year.

 

[ThomasD]

Most of the skiing public is not going appreciate the structures that this machine can impart. The real value of the machine is if can be a significant labour saving device in very busy tuning shops. Also, training someone to run the machine is likely a quicker learning curve vs learning to tune skis to a high level by hand, and do it quickly.

I figure the primary value of the machine is as a money extractor for a certain sort of clientele. They need to develop visible badging to go along with it - maybe one with a programable RFID chip to store your preferred settings.

Edit: And if anyone from Wintersteiger is interested in my ideas I am certainly available for on-mountain consultations. Free even (other than lodging and travel expenses, that is.)