Best Leadville Bike

[scott43]

I like Betsy Welch and get commentary. This is interesting...

Drop bars on a hardtail: Is this the best bike for the Leadville Trail 100?

There's underbiking, overbiking, and then there's Dylan Johnson's set-up.

velo.outsideonline.com

 

[wooglin]

I like Betsy Welch and get commentary. This is interesting...

Drop bars on a hardtail: Is this the best bike for the Leadville Trail 100?

There's underbiking, overbiking, and then there's Dylan Johnson's set-up.

velo.outsideonline.com

Seriously? WTF. 90% of mountain biking used to be on crappy “gravel” roads, and drop bar hard tails were totally competitive. I wish the industry would stop marketing the emperors new clothes and just ride their bikes.

 

[martyg]

Howard Grotts was going to ride. a HT a few years ago. He rode an (if I remember correctly) S-Workls Epic with 100mm of travel. It worked out well.

A lot of athletes feel that a HT is faster, until you actually put it to the test with watt meter and stopwatch.

 

[crosscountry]

What "feels faster" isn't always actually faster.

I have a bike that "feel faster". But when I time it on the same loop. It's not.

That said, "feel faster" is more fun. So I ride it for the fun of it, even if it's no faster. I'd gladly pay more for that fun too, while justifying the extra cost as "faster"!

 

[chris_the_wrench]

Seriously? WTF. 90% of mountain biking used to be on crappy “gravel” roads, and drop bar hard tails were totally competitive. I wish the industry would stop marketing the emperors new clothes and just ride their bikes.

Preach on my man!!!

I can't wait till the tioga tension disc wheel is brought back as a 'game changer'!

 

[cantunamunch]

I can't wait till the tioga tension disc wheel is brought back as a 'game changer'!

Berd Wheels

Welcome to the future of cycling. At Berd, we have engineered an innovative bicycle spoke which is lighter, stronger, more durable, and more fun to ride than steel.

berdspokes.com

if you ask nicely, they'll cut you some spoke covers

 

[cantunamunch]

This is interesting...

Seriously? WTF. 90% of mountain biking used to be on crappy “gravel” roads, and drop bar hard tails were totally competitive. I wish the industry would stop marketing the emperors new clothes and just ride their bikes.

The problem is that the public let it happen by not looking under the rug. The public let the industry tell them that drop bars is the one significant feature of a gravel bike. The public don't want to know the distinctions between CX, gravel and monstercross.

That Factor has a 718mm FC and 67degree HTA, 40mm BB drop. It is 9 cm longer in front, 5 degrees slacker and with almost an inch more BB clearance than a Niner MCR RDO in 56cm (623 FC 71.5 HTA 62mm drop). But all that gets thrown out when the public insist on only knowing category labels. The only 'gravel' bike that comes close to those FC numbers is the Evil Chamois Hagar - and even then they drop the BB too much (and are missing rear travel.)

 

[cantunamunch]

So... did anyone else immediately go look at the new Supercaliber and think zero stem and drops?

 

[Tom K.]

What "feels faster" isn't always actually faster.

I have a bike that "feel faster". But when I time it on the same loop. It's not.

That said, "feel faster" is more fun. So I ride it for the fun of it, even if it's no faster. I'd gladly pay more for that fun too, while justifying the extra cost as "faster"!

+1

My Top Fuel is faster than my old Supercaliber on any three hour loop involving "real" mtb riding.

But damn, I miss the ferrari-like handling and responsiveness of the SC!

So... did anyone else immediately go look at the new Supercaliber and think zero stem and drops?

No. My thoughts were "thank goodness it only comes with a remote lockout rear shock, so my wallet is safe from an illogical desire to build up another race bike".

Though the new rear pivot location looks to provide enough anti-squat that a lockout will be superfluous anywhere but smooth roads and maybe pro-level xcc racing or whatever they are calling those short sprints.

 

[crosscountry]

Seriously? WTF. 90% of mountain biking used to be on crappy “gravel” roads, and drop bar hard tails were totally competitive. I wish the industry would stop marketing the emperors new clothes and just ride their bikes.

But isn't that what Dylan Johnson just did? He's riding his bike in Leadville. It's his bike, his choice to build it that way. What's that got to do with the "industry's" emperors new clothes???

The problem is that the public let it happen by not looking under the rug. The public let the industry tell them that drop bars is the one significant feature of a gravel bike. The public don't want to know the distinctions between CX, gravel and monstercross.

I disagree.

I've been building "Franken's bike" years' before "the industry" coming up with names such as "gravel" or even earlier "mountain" bikes. Those "bikes" has their place and we've been building them in garages and ordering them from custom builders. And hanging odd combo of components on them frames. It took "the industry" years to coin the term and market it to others who doesn't have the connection to build their own.

The fact we've build those bikes to fill some niche is an indication those niche exists with no suitable bikes for, and could be useful for others. If anything, it's the customer's (or more likely the bike shop sales staff) resistance to embrace these one day Franken's bike, 5 years later mainstream fashion!

So maybe one day, there will be wide spread drop bar hard tails on the showroom floor. And they'll have a new name for that kind of bikes.

 

[wooglin]

But isn't that what Dylan Johnson just did? He's riding his bike in Leadville. It's his bike, his choice to build it that way. What's that got to do with the "industry's" emperors new clothes???

It's the reporting I was commenting on, not the bike or the rider.

 

[cantunamunch]

It's the reporting I was commenting on, not the bike or the rider.

The thing about the reporting is that reducing sensationalism puts us right back into Velosnooze article-writing.

The entertainment value hinges on having a different story - and writers are trained to meet the public's taste for just that. The old school days of just publishing race results and finishing times and cuddly soft-pitch interview/biopieces were dead 25 years ago.

In other words, bike journalism is really good at giving the public exactly what sells. There's precious little incentive to purely inform or purely instruct.

The corollary is that 'knowledge' derived from journalism isn't actually enabling.

 

[crosscountry]

The thing about the reporting is that reducing sensationalism puts us right back into Velosnooze article-writing.

The entertainment value hinges on having a different story - and writers are trained to meet the public's taste for just that. The old school days of just publishing race results and finishing times and cuddly soft-pitch interview/biopieces were dead 25 years ago.

In other words, bike journalism is really good at giving the public exactly what sells. There's precious little incentive to purely inform or purely instruct.

The corollary is that 'knowledge' derived from journalism isn't actually enabling.

Are you suggesting WE are the problem?

 

[tball]

The fact anyone considers using drop bars for Leadville says all you need to know about the course.

Here's a great video of the race from a helicopter(!!) where you can get a good idea of the course:

 

[cantunamunch]

The fact anyone considers using drop bars for Leadville says all you need to know about the course.

Eh, not sure about that.

I think it tells us about new rules tradeoffs, i.e. achievable speed and allowed aero vs. weaknesses of drop bars (further reach and narrower control) more than it tells us about the course. And it also tells us that, finally, the difference in brake actuation between flat bar levers and drop levers is becoming negligible.

But, hey, let's put a pin in on March 17-23 and see if anyone rides them at the Absa Cape Epic.

 

[tball]

Eh, not sure about that.

There's an honest assessment in the article linked to in the OP:

“If they were putting on Leadville for the first time ever in 2023, they’d probably advertise it as a gravel race,” said Grand Prix competitor and YouTube sensation Dylan Johnson. “But that doesn’t mean I think a gravel bike is the right bike. Leadville falls in this gray area between a gravel and a mountain bike race where you can choose to underbike with your gravel bike or overbike with your mountain bike."

My new hardtail will be perfect with a few upgrades to lighten it a bit (fork, dropper, groupset).

 

[cantunamunch]

There's an honest assessment in the article linked to in the OP:

“If they were putting on Leadville for the first time ever in 2023, they’d probably advertise it as a gravel race,” said Grand Prix competitor and YouTube sensation Dylan Johnson. “But that doesn’t mean I think a gravel bike is the right bike. Leadville falls in this gray area between a gravel and a mountain bike race where you can choose to underbike with your gravel bike or overbike with your mountain bike."

Yes, but, again, that runs smack into the wall of 'what is a gravel bike?'.

I mean look at this thing:

2018 PVD Bird of Prey | Peter Verdone Designs

www.peterverdone.com

It's tighter in back and bigger in front than the size L Chisel you didn't get.

The builder/rider is your size or shorter, and absolutely insists it's a gravel bike. Would he be underbiked at Leadville? Undertrained maybe, but underbiked no.

My new hardtail will be perfect with a few upgrades to lighten it a bit (fork, dropper, groupset).

You're supposed to be saving to replace the FS

 

[tball]

You're supposed to be saving to replace the FS

Yeah, I know. I guess I should see if I can get a Leadville entry before upgrading my hardtail.

 

[martyg]

The fact anyone considers using drop bars for Leadville says all you need to know about the course.

Here's a great video of the race from a helicopter(!!) where you can get a good idea of the course:

Did you break 10 hours?

 

[Tom K.]

The fact anyone considers using drop bars for Leadville says all you need to know about the course.

I didn't want to get into this, but yeah, that, and a sub-six hour winning time? Not an mtb race.

To be clear, still a hell of a contest.

“If they were putting on Leadville for the first time ever in 2023, they’d probably advertise it as a gravel race,”

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