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Skiing Camera Option

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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I like to take photographs and I’m quite serious about photography. (I have a website, AnythingButAWedding.) I don’t like skiing with bulky and expensive photography equipment, however. I recently came up with a working solution, which I’d like to share.

My primary camera is a Panasonic G7, which is a micro four-thirds (m43) camera. Micro four-thirds has an inherent advantage over many cameras in that the format allows for smaller camera bodies and smaller lenses. The format is referred to as “cropped sensor” which means that the image sensor (the place where film used to be) is smaller than the size of a traditional 35mm film frame. As such, the lenses m43 cameras have half the focal length of 35mm cameras. For example, a “standard” lens on a 35mm camera has a focal length of 50mm. A lens for a m43 camera, with the same framing is a 25mm lens. Smaller focal length leads to smaller physical size.

If I were to go out skiing for the sole purpose of taking photographs, such as shooting a race or other competition, I would have no problem bringing along a bunch of gear and my best and longest lenses. If my purpose is to go out skiing for fun, however, I do not want all this gear with me. Any fall with a large, hard, fragile camera is likely to result in injury to both the camera and the skier. As a result, I’ve not been bringing my camera. If want a picture, I just use my cell phone.

Now, I’m not opposed to cell phone photography, but you do give up some important features. Apple and Samsung have closed the gap between cameras and phones, but I still prefer a dedicated camera. So, what to do?

Panasonic offers a couple of so-called “pancake” versions of their lenses. These lenses are considerably smaller than regular lenses and give up some performance compared to regular lenses. Their major shortcomings are that they are not as good in low light conditions and are not quite as sharp as their larger versions. Well, light is not usually an issue when skiing – perhaps on a very gray and dark day it might be - but that wouldn’t be a good time for shooting anyway. The loss of resolution with the pancake lenses is minor and mostly in the periphery of the image. This is not a huge issue for casual shooting.

Looking at the gear I have, my favorite “walking around” lens is a 14-140mm, 10x zoom, telephoto. In 35mm terms, this lens shoots from 28mm (wide angle) to 280mm (long telephoto). This is excellent versatility, but the lens is large and heavy. It is not suited for skiing with. I also have a smaller 12-35mm telephoto, which is both faster and sharper than the 14-140mm lens and it shoots from wide angle to short telephoto or portrait length. Still, the 12-35mm lens is quite large and it was expensive. I do not want to risk breaking it. Enter the pancake lens.

Some time ago Panasonic introduced the 12-35mm pancake lens. I never looked at this lens as I have an excellent full-size lens in the same focal length. But skiing adds a new parameter; I need a small and light lens. I checked the specifications for the pancake 12-35mm lens and compared it to my full-size 12-35mm lens. The pancake version is two f-stops slower than the full-size lens and you need to stop it down to about f8 to get image quality close to the full-size lens, but it is significantly smaller and more than half a pound lighter. I found a number of these lenses available on eBay and picked one up for a about a hundred dollars.

With the pancake lens, the camera nestles nicely in a fanny pack, which I wear reversed; most ski falls tend to be on your side or back. The camera is more easily accessed than with a backpack. The weight of the camera with the pancake lens is just over a pound and essentially unnoticeable while skiing.
  • Camera and 14-140mm lens: 2.028 pounds
  • Camera and 12-35mm lens: 1.671 pounds
  • Camera and 12-35mm pancake lens: 1.074 pounds
There’s an old saying in photography that, “The best camera to use is the one you have with you.” Now I can have a camera with me that will shoot a range of focal lengths, has 16MP resolution, can shoot 1080p/60 or 4K video, has focus tracking, and a real viewfinder, just to mention a few of the features over a cell phone. The camera can become part of my standard skiing kit and I’m looking forward to taking some high-quality, interesting photographs with it.
 

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Philpug

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There’s an old saying in photography that, “The best camera to use is the one you have with you.”
Before I even opend this thread, this is exactly what I was going to reply with, thank you for adding it. We used to ski with a DSLR and 4K solid state video camera but now we do everything on the iPhone...because we always have it with us. @Andy Mink uses his Galaxy, which IMHO does take a better shot than the 11 and 12 Pro's that @Tricia and I have, yes jealously there.
 
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CO Dreaming

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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Before I even opend this thread, this is exactly what I was going to reply with, thank you for adding it. We used to ski with a DSLR and 4K solid state video camera but now we do everything on the iPhone...because we always have it with us. @Andy Mink uses his Galaxy, which IMHO does take a better shot than the 11 and 12 Pro's that @Tricia and I have, yes jealously there.
We ski at Cannon a lot and have weird cell phone issues there. Our batteries frequently go dead, even if we switch to airplane mode. Cold perhaps? I'm not sure what the cause is, but with the camera an extra battery is easy to bring along in a warm pocket.
 

Sibhusky

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My skiing camera is a Panasonic DMC-ZS100. 25-250 mm zoom Point and shoot with decent zoom AND A VIEWFINDER. With geriatric eyes, I don't want to be fishing around for reading glasses and the touch screen panel isn't always usable in brilliant sunshine when you're surrounded by white snow. My old Canon fit in a cargo pocket. This doesn't but goes in my fanny pack along with a bunch of other stuff like a set of goggles. Weight with batteries, but without my case (protection) is 11.01 ounces according to dPreview.
20210319_131101.jpg
 
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Unpiste

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Great post!

My "serious" camera is a Sony A7 series, so a bit too large to be fun skiing with, even with the most compact lenses available. (Great for hiking, though!) I had no idea there were pancake zoom lenses. That 12–35mm lens is impressive!

@CO Dreaming, if your phones are dying even in airplane mode, that does sound like a battery problem. (If the battery is already a little borderline, cold could make the difference between being able to put out enough power to run the phone vs. just not being able to handle it. Instantaneous power, i.e. wattage, and total power capacity, i.e. watt-hours, can degrade in different ways as a battery ages.) One other possibility is that the phone may still have WiFi enabled in airplane mode (lots of airplanes have WiFi), so if Cannon has WiFi at points where you stop, but coverage isn't great, that could drain the battery a bit faster than normal.
 

Flo

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The way your carry your gear is the most important. I sometimes ski with a full-frame (Canon EOS R) and the RF 24-105 F4 IS L lens in a F-Stop backpack. Gear is well protected but it requires to remove the backpack to get it which makes that I don't shoot as much as I want. If I am with mellow skiers in easy terrain I just clip the camera to my backpack strap with the peak design capture clip. Super convenient but gear is exposed if you fall. I like to shoot with this camera as it allows massive crops if needed.

I also shoot video with a GoPro 9. When recording in 5K it allows you to pull 14.7-megapixel images.
 
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Lauren

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We ski at Cannon a lot and have weird cell phone issues there. Our batteries frequently go dead, even if we switch to airplane mode. Cold perhaps? I'm not sure what the cause is, but with the camera an extra battery is easy to bring along in a warm pocket.

On really cold days I stick a chemical pack toe warmer to the back of my phone to keep it warm, seems to extend the battery life quite a bit.

Also...love the idea of the pancake lens for travel/skiing/light weight packing. Would be nice if Nikon made one!
 

SSSdave

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That G7 weight is fine if photography on ski days is a prime objective for creating larger than web sized imagery of which there is certainly quite a bit of. However much heavier than a smartphone or pocket sized digital compact like my tiny 4.9 ounce Canon ELPH190 with its 10x zoom, to the point it would affect advanced level skiing. The less bulk and weight of all manner of pocket junk while skiing the better. I traded in my more versatile moto g smartphone for the ELPH190 primarily for the zoom and much better control button functionality. However now at least a few days will trade off using a GoPro Hero 8. My Canon is old enough now that I need to review what else at sub 5 ounce size is available. Not many choices today given zoomless smartphones for small compacts.
 
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CO Dreaming

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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My skiing camera is a Panasonic DMC-ZS100. 25-250 mm zoom Point and shoot with decent zoom AND A VIEWFINDER. With geriatric eyes, I don't want to be fishing around for reading glasses and the touch screen panel isn't always usable in brilliant sunshine when you're surrounded by white snow. My old Canon fit in a cargo pocket. This doesn't but goes in my fanny pack along with a bunch of other stuff like a set of goggles.
View attachment 128583
DMC-ZS100 is a good choice. Watch out for sensor dust, though. Dust can get in but there is no way to remove the lense to clean it.
 
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CO Dreaming

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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Location
Windham, NH
The way your carry your gear is the most important. I sometimes ski with a full-frame (Canon EOS R) and the RF 24-105 F4 IS L lens in a F-Stop backpack. Gear is well protected but it requires to remove the backpack to get it which makes that I don't shoot as much as I want. If I am with mellow skiers in easy terrain I just clip the camera to my backpack strap with the peak design capture clip. Super convenient but gear is exposed if you fall. I like to shoot with this camera as it allows massive crops if needed.

I also shoot video with a GoPro 9. When recording in 5K it allows you to pull 14.7-megapixel images.
I've thought about a GoPro. Not for skiing, necessarily, but I think it would be fun to clip one to the dashboard (somehow) when I'm driving in really interesting places - sort of like a live stream of a road trip. I attempted something like this with G7, but it's too large and bulky with no good way to secure it.
 

crgildart

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Haven't touched the Cannon since Galaxy S8. The only downside to a decent camera phone is having to take the gloves off to use it easily. Yes, there are touch screen gloves but still difficult compared to bare fingers.. And GoPro helmet mount for all videos of late..
 

teejaywhy

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Hello CO Dreaming.

Thanks for a very good summary of the challenges one faces with "photography while skiing."

Couple of questions for you:
- I have a Panny G85 with the 12-60 kit lens. I have been eyeing the pancake lens. Is yours the Olympus version or does Panasonic make one as well? Do I guess correctly that the pancake lens extends when powered on?
- Would like much to find a small, padded fanny pack to carry a kit like this. I sometimes bring a camera in my backpack, but end up never using it.
 

Tom Co.

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I have a Canon Power Shot ELPH 360 HS that I use for skiing and backpacking. It weighs in at 5.1 ounces or 148 grams. This Canon has a 12 X optical zoom. For a point and shoot, it takes good pictures and easily fits in a coat pocket. I think it cost just under $200.
My Canon is old enough now that I need to review what else at sub 5 ounce size is available
 

James

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AND A VIEWFINDER.
That’s key. Esp for skiing with bright light.

I’ll say this for gopro. I’ve been in guided situations where there isn’t time to take a shot, or it’s too scary to pull a camera or phone out. The GoPro can shoot automatically or somehow is remote triggered? Guy I was with had one and got some really nice shots.
 

Sibhusky

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I had small Canons for years, but they stopped having viewfinders. And ultimately I wanted more zoom every once in a while. Not that often for skiing, admittedly, but I got a Panasonic travel zoom and started to realize the shortcomings of my old Canon Powershot SD990 IS. The "travel zoom" is way too bulky for skiing, I use it for wildlife and close up nature shots. (I'm not even sure if I'd use it for travel, actually, my handbag already weighs a ton.) Back in my 20's and 30's I got really into having a quality camera with a ton of lenses and took photography classes and bought two shelves of photography books, all read cover to cover. But I abandoned all that for "the best camera is the one you have with you". And if it's a hassle to have with you, it never gets used. The ZS100 is verging a little on too big, but its versatility overcomes that.
 

Ken_R

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@CO Dreaming

What type of Images do you want to take while skiing? What are your favorite skiing related images?

To me they are 1) wide angle landscape type shots that show the beauty and expanse of the location and 2) Action shots of people skiing, usually made with a telephoto lens for space and to compress the scene to add more detail and drama.

Take the gear you need to make the images you want to make.

I have a bunch of camera gear but 99.9% of the time I only take my iPhone since when I am skiing the skiing is my priority and with it I can make really good wide angle landscape shots. Now for telephoto action shots of people skiing that is where I would need more serious gear. I would take either one of the awesome superzoom pocket cameras available or a mirrorless interchangeable lens camera with a good telephoto zoom lens. There are plenty of good options available nowadays.
 
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CO Dreaming

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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Hello CO Dreaming.

Thanks for a very good summary of the challenges one faces with "photography while skiing."

Couple of questions for you:
- I have a Panny G85 with the 12-60 kit lens. I have been eyeing the pancake lens. Is yours the Olympus version or does Panasonic make one as well? Do I guess correctly that the pancake lens extends when powered on?
- Would like much to find a small, padded fanny pack to carry a kit like this. I sometimes bring a camera in my backpack, but end up never using it.
The lens is Panasonic. It has image stabilization and does extend when in use (not very much). It does not extend or zoom electrically, you have to manually turn it. Auto focus is very fast but there is no manual focus ring. Overall, it's a decent lens, but it is still only a short telephoto. If you want killer shots of jumping or other close up shots, you'll need to bring your long telephoto.
 
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TS
CO Dreaming

CO Dreaming

1992, Snowbird on K2 710s
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Windham, NH
@CO Dreaming

What type of Images do you want to take while skiing? What are your favorite skiing related images?

To me they are 1) wide angle landscape type shots that show the beauty and expanse of the location and 2) Action shots of people skiing, usually made with a telephoto lens for space and to compress the scene to add more detail and drama.

Take the gear you need to make the images you want to make.

I have a bunch of camera gear but 99.9% of the time I only take my iPhone since when I am skiing the skiing is my priority and with it I can make really good wide angle landscape shots. Now for telephoto action shots of people skiing that is where I would need more serious gear. I would take either one of the awesome superzoom pocket cameras available or a mirrorless interchangeable lens camera with a good telephoto zoom lens. There are plenty of good options available nowadays.
Your requirements are very close to what I want in a camera. I would add that I want to be able to get good video skiers for fun and training purposes. I'm not a phone junkie, so my phone is just an Apple 6s. It takes decent pictures, but has none of the control that you get with an advanced camera. Plus, I have a whole drawer full of camear gear. Advanced phones are not cheap. I'd rather use the camera gear that I have and make low-budget addtions, if necessary.
 

SSSdave

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That’s key. Esp for skiing with bright light.
I’ll say this for gopro. I’ve been in guided situations where there isn’t time to take a shot, or it’s too scary to pull a camera or phone out. The GoPro can shoot automatically or somehow is remote triggered? Guy I was with had one and got some really nice shots.
My GoPro Hero 8 has voice control functions however web reports indicate it is inconsistent. My quiet indoor testing showed that was true which could be a disaster if it doesn't respond to a power off command while video recording is active that then drains the already limited battery life. Also may get into wrong modes like taking a still photo instead of starting a video. Outdoors given complex noises I'd rather use a Bluetooth system with certain handshaking that would require a tiny accessory with a few buttons and LEDs.
 

pete

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Some Go-Pros and other brands (Sony I think) have remote controls that are arm bands or such to control the camera.

An early Go-Pro I would, helmet mounted, simply reach up and hit the record as it had audio beep but the sure fire way was to have another skier push the button and confirm it fired up. Or go with a chest mount

 
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