Womens intermediate carver recommendations

[late4gates]

Looking for a carving ski for my wife who is a confident intermediate. She probably doesn’t need much of a top end. On piste 100%, Blue and Green only. She currently skis Black Pearl 97s but finds them a bit stiff and heavy. This would be a 2SQ choice where she would prefer to stay on the carver as much as possible before going back to the BP just for heavier stuff (we’re Inland Northwest, so it happens).

I’ve been looking at the Wild Belle 84 and the Total Joy. Also the Phoenix R13 CA if I can convince her to ski the BPs more (still open).
Anyway, all advice very welcome, thanks.

 

[Andy Mink]

@Tricia, @AmyPJ to the white courtesy phone.

 

[newboots]

Where in the country do you and she ski?

 

[late4gates]

Where in the country do you and she ski?

North Idaho, eastern Washington, and northern Montana.

 

[Nancy Hummel]

Height? Weight?

97 is a bit wide for groomer only skiing.

I love the Kastle MX 83.

 

[late4gates]

5 ft 5 1/2 inches. She’s probably average weight for her height, but I’m not an expert on these things.

 

[Andy Mink]

She’s probably average weight for her height, but I’m not an expert on these things.

It's better that way.

 

[AlexisLD]

Looking for a carving ski for my wife who is a confident intermediate. She probably doesn’t need much of a top end. On piste 100%, Blue and Green only. She currently skis Black Pearl 97s but finds them a bit stiff and heavy. This would be a 2SQ choice where she would prefer to stay on the carver as much as possible before going back to the BP just for heavier stuff (we’re Inland Northwest, so it happens).

What length/year of skis is she currently using?

 

[late4gates]

What length/year of skis is she currently using?

2020 or 2021 (can’t remember) Black Pearl 97 @ 153 (short). She’d probably go for a 156ish.

 

[Prosper]

Sierra.com has the Liberty V76W 165cm for a screaming deal at $199 and the V82W 165cm for a very good $299. Both have been very positively reviewed and I think @Tricia especially likes the V76W. I think either would be a good choice for your wife. I ski the V76 (non W version) in 165cm and really love it.

 

[AlexisLD]

2020 or 2021 (can’t remember) Black Pearl 97 @ 153 (short). She’d probably go for a 156ish.

You can look here to compare a few of these skis (BP97 is from 2022 however).

Sidecut radius are similar.

Weight are different. Both Total Joy and Wild Belle are lighter, but by different amounts.

Running length are longer in the Wild Belle and the Total Joy due to less rocker. Typically, for piste skis I would go shorter than my powder skis to have a more comparable running length (length of the ski touching the snow when flat on the ground). With that in mind, I would probably go 150/153.

The Total Joy 153 is the same average stiffness as the BP97 153. All the other skis are stiffer in bending by about 20-25%. Stiffer will make a ski come alive at higher speed, give you a higher speed limit (when the ski starts flapping around) and will transmit more of the terrain to your foot/shin. Softer skis are easier to initiate turns and will smooth the terrain by conforming to it. They won't push you out of moguls as much either.

These skis are also softer in torsion. It is a bit hard to directly compare with the BP97 because the width play a role in the amount of torsional stiffness you should have. However, all these skis are at or slightly below average for their size/length in their torsional stiffness, which mean they should be great for intermediate skier. The Total Joy 153 is the softest. A torsionaly stiff ski will require accurate leg motion to engage and release but will track very well and have a lot of edge grip. A torsionnaly soft ski will be more playful.

Many Head skis, including the Total Joy, have very flat stiffness distribution (i.e., stiff tip/tail but soft center). That is pretty unique across all brands. Maybe some people can chip in about that feel on-snow, or maybe you can find some reviews about them...

Note that stiffness and dimension change with the specific length you choose.

 

[AmyPJ]

Looking for a carving ski for my wife who is a confident intermediate. She probably doesn’t need much of a top end. On piste 100%, Blue and Green only. She currently skis Black Pearl 97s but finds them a bit stiff and heavy. This would be a 2SQ choice where she would prefer to stay on the carver as much as possible before going back to the BP just for heavier stuff (we’re Inland Northwest, so it happens).

I’ve been looking at the Wild Belle 84 and the Total Joy. Also the Phoenix R13 CA if I can convince her to ski the BPs more (still open).
Anyway, all advice very welcome, thanks.

That BP 97 is a pretty beefy ski. I can see why she finds them stiff and heavy. Great if you're a charger with no speed limit, but it sounds like she's not that.

Does she want a true carver, or just a narrower all-mountain ski? To me, it sounds like a narrower, less demanding all-mountain ski is what she's seeking.

I haven't skied the Wild Belle 84 yet, but I have skied the Total Joy. It's actually a very good option but I don't know how it does in heavier crud.

The sky's the limit on skis in the 80s width. Narrowing it down to what type of ski in that range would be helpful in giving recommendations.

 

[Tom K.]

My wife has a pair of Head Something or Other Joys. She's a good skier, on and off-piste, but she's never going to be a true carver. Too fast for her tastes.

She finds the "carvy" Joy skis to be annoying when things start getting roughed up much, and has pretty much gravitated to skiing her Black Pearl 88s on groomer days because "they blast through the piles without getting yanked around". She does not like the Heads at all in true crud.

As @AmyPJ said, she might really prefer a narrower, lighter all mountain ski like a Black Pearl 82, which I believe is softer than the 97 (perhaps somebody can verify this -- or not).

 

[my07mcx2]

wife went from a bp to a bc camox and she loves it. way more playful and flex.

 

[newboots]

wife went from a bp to a bc camox and she loves it. way more playful and flex.

BPs come in four or five different widths - makes a difference!

I ski the BP 82s, very comfortable for groomers, enough width (for me) to smooth out the crud most of the time. When I first skied them, I couldn't identify what was better, just that they were "more fun" than my old Quattros. I'm not familiar with the snow out West, though, and a little wider might make more sense. In the East, I prefer narrower for handling hard pack and ice.

 

[AlexisLD]

she might really prefer a narrower, lighter all mountain ski like a Black Pearl 82, which I believe is softer than the 97 (perhaps somebody can verify this -- or not).

We measured the 82s as stiffer than the 97s in both the 153 and 159 lengths... Piste skis are often stiffer than powder board (need to flex in powder).

But yeah, you have to decide if you want piste or all-mountain...

 

[Sheena]

I think there are plenty of great options out there. As a short (I am 5') and not so ahem petite skier I love my head monster 88 skis. I have owned a pair since 2006 I believe, replacing with newer models as needed. I have tried other skis over the years, but the Head Monster 88 are by far my favorite for low powder days, crud, mixed snow, and they absolutely rip on groomers. They feel steady and are just all around great for me.

I also am a slower skier relatively speaking and and probably upper intermediate skier on my good days. Lol.

I did demo the joy series skies several years ago and those had a similar feel, but they felt a little "lighter" to me for my taste in crud, skied out snow.

 

[late4gates]

She’s not a charger, and 100% on piste (she recently decided on that definitively). She’s also less interested in pure carvers because she wants to ski it most of the time. If I were to use male/unisex skis as an analogy I would say she’s looking for something between an Enforcer 88 (but for piste only) and a Head V10. Maybe a Dynastar 4x4 82 - an all condition groomer ski. Not a Firebird or a Supershape. These in terms of conditions but targeting an Intermediate. We are both seniors too.

 

[late4gates]

I think there are plenty of great options out there. As a short (I am 5') and not so ahem petite skier I love my head monster 88 skis. I have owned a pair since 2006 I believe, replacing with newer models as needed. I have tried other skis over the years, but the Head Monster 88 are by far my favorite for low powder days, crud, mixed snow, and they absolutely rip on groomers. They feel steady and are just all around great for me.

I also am a slower skier relatively speaking and and probably upper intermediate skier on my good days. Lol.

Thanks Sheena. This is pretty much the profile she’s after.

 

[Seldomski]

Following this thread... my wife has been skiing Volkl Kama, circa 2019, and probably could use a new ski and fits the ability mentioned in the first post.

SkiEssentials

www.skiessentials.com

She is 5' 1" and prefers cruising blues and needs a ski that is confidence inspiring and can handle the afternoon chop and the 'icy patches' out west since she is NOT an early riser and thus is skiing afternoons in cut-up conditions. On paper, the Kama seems to be ideal for her. But I think maybe the construction for shortest length (<150 cm) might be too stiff or have a bad flex pattern based on how she skis with them. I am not sure these scale well down to the shortest length.

I've ruled out Liberty because of the tuning issues I've seen repeatedly on this forum. The new ski needs to have a passable tune out of the wrapper since we travel to ski and there is no tuning local to us. We can get it tuned at the resort, but they need a good starting point since slope side tuners tend to be less... competent.