I'll take that as an affirmative that it can't do what I want. thanks for clarifying.
Sounds like you're looking for something like this. It's from 6 years ago with Tom Gellie beta testing the product for CARV. This level of data overlay has not been productized.I'll take that as an affirmative that it can't do what I want. thanks for clarifying.
Thanks, my wife ended up getting a pair with the black friday deal yesterday. All set!If you're not seeing any discounts, there's always the $40 off referral link. It's usually not the best deal though. This one is generated from my account -
I think you’re fundamentally misunderstanding how it works. It seems as though you’re assuming that pressuring the cuff creates a certain pressure pattern feet that is biased towards the heels (which may or may not be correct) and that Carv’s model would misinterpret that as back seat skiing. That’s not how it works.I still don't understand how the CARV system could possibly understand how well I'm skiing. I say this because the pressure at the soles of my feet are pretty much opposite of what most skiers "think" you would expect. Let me clarify...
When I ski, and I want to be forward/stay forward, I'm dorsiflexing and pulling my feet back like crazy. There is less and less pressure on the balls of my feet, the more forward I am. There's tons of pressure on my heel. Won't CARV misinterpret this as me being in the backseat? While the opposite is actually true. If I'm plantar flexing (pushing on the balls of my feet by opening my ankle joint) then I'm probably in the back seat on my skis.
I still contend that for CARV to really understand the skiing that's happening, they need more sensors (especially up into the cuff of the boot). Then they really could make a definitive assessment of what's happening. The pressure present at the soles of our feet is simply insufficient to provide the data set needed.
I think you’re fundamentally misunderstanding how it works. It seems as though you’re assuming that pressuring the cuff creates a certain pressure pattern feet that is biased towards the heels (which may or may not be correct) and that Carv’s model would misinterpret that as back seat skiing. That’s not how it works.
Carv have developed their algorithm by working with high level examiners and having their data scientists review turns with the examiners to correlate the data from the Carv insole to what the examiner is seeing on the screen. They’ve continued to refine their algorithm to better and better correlate data with specific movements and the model works very well to assess turns and call out the things that are good and the things that could be improved.
In your example, whether your foot is pressing the ball or the heel is kind of irrelevant. If their analysis of thousands of different skiers making thousands of turns had people applying the technique you’re describing and making turns that the examiners assessed as technically sound, they would have the readings from the pressure sensors and accelerometers for those turns, they would be able to understand the combination of data points that correlate to those turns, and they would incorporate it into their algorithm.
If the way you ski is completely unique, or if your idea of good groomer skiing is completely different that the national bodies of the examiners they use, then you have a point. If not, I think you’d likely find that Carv would pretty accurately analyze your skiing and provide data that may be useful to you if data in your skiing is something you would value. Or you could always just try it and return it if you didn’t like it.
can you show us a screen shot of the monitor mode with a single metric plotted? can we only track one metric at a time, or can we track multiple metrics and just view one at a time later?
Get a few more sensors into the system to better understand at least where the lower leg is positioned within the boot. Better yet, add some at the knee, pelvis, and shoulders and then we're really talking about being able to recreate the skiing movements from the data.
There was an acknowledgement by the company ahead of this year’s revision to the algorithm that they could do a better job in considering slope angle and snow condition in Ski IQ scoring, and the algorithm has been refined for this season to address that.Well a certain skier I know (that many here are familiar with, but has been banned from the forum) who skis at a very high level, messed around with CARV last season. CARV completely failed to understand true high level ski turns and assessed that type of skiing incorrectly (IMHO) and lower than less aggressive skiing. It gave him higher scores for turns on less steep terrain and rewarded much smoother, cruising type skiing. My assumption is that the vast majority of "examiners" really aren't skiing with the movements/inputs that we believe lead to the highest level of ski turns. They probably need to be more selective in whose data they should use as examples of high level skiing.
Get a few more sensors into the system to better understand at least where the lower leg is positioned within the boot. Better yet, add some at the knee, pelvis, and shoulders and then we're really talking about being able to recreate the skiing movements from the data.
Isensors built into the base of the ski would be the only true way...but yea I concur in general..there is more complexity involved, especially in more dynamic skiing. This is part of why i think its important to be able view that actual fore-aft pressure changes throughout the entire turn cycle...from start to finish. One aggregate value for the whole turn doesn't really tell us much unless you're dealing with someone who is chronically too far back all the time (which I know there are a lot of those types), then of course the aggragrate value for the turn would indicate they "generally" need to work on getting and staying forward...but really..during dynamic skiing..we need to be on the front of the ski at the start of the turn, center through the belly and perhaps slightly back even through the finish...but back does not mean "sitting back". and during completion foot pullback is extremely important... but seeing pressure back right there would not be an indicator of a bad thing for that part of the turn. It would be lowering the overall aggragate score for the turn though according to Carv inc.
during init its not clear to me that the pressure would read under your heel even if you are dorsiflexing like crazy and keeping your heel back, etc..once pressure under the ski is in front of the toepiece, I think the pressure meter in Carv would read it under your forefoot too, but I could be wrong about that. Note that pulling your feet back does not initially automatically put pressure in front, you are positioning your feet there during float...and after float, the pressure starts to develop for the new turn and if you got the CoM/BoS relationship right..then pressure should go to the front of the ski, which is the whole point. if its going to the front of the ski, I think you would feel it under your feet too. I hear what you're saying some of that pressure might go into the cuff though.
I think Carv are pioneers in this area and perhaps future versions will have more options like that...how about a detector you tape to your belly button to indicate where your hips are relative to your feet at all times? Or some things like that, Etc.. Like GolfTec. Carve is currently cool...but needs more for high level use and for me would be a short term curiosity only, I would need more detail to get much out of it.
ive skied with Carv since very close to the launch of the product. I’ve introduced a lot of skiers to the product and many of them are at or near the top of the global leader board. many of them are current or former demo team members and Carv discriminates their performance from pretty much everyone else, particularLy me. Is it perfect? No. Are there better approaches to instrumentation? Yes, but they cost tens of thousands of dollars, require pressure plates on the ski, add incredible weight, and are basically lab gear. And they don’t have a database of millions of runs on which to train a neural network model.Well a certain skier I know (that many here are familiar with, but has been banned from the forum) who skis at a very high level, messed around with CARV last season. CARV completely failed to understand true high level ski turns and assessed that type of skiing incorrectly (IMHO) and lower than less aggressive skiing. It gave him higher scores for turns on less steep terrain and rewarded much smoother, cruising type skiing. My assumption is that the vast majority of "examiners" really aren't skiing with the movements/inputs that we believe lead to the highest level of ski turns. They probably need to be more selective in whose data they should use as examples of high level skiing.
Get a few more sensors into the system to better understand at least where the lower leg is positioned within the boot. Better yet, add some at the knee, pelvis, and shoulders and then we're really talking about being able to recreate the skiing movements from the data.
You’re not going to get a useful Ski IQ number for moguls or any off piste skiing. It’s optimized for groomer skiing, and the terrain adjustment features that are coming seem like they’ll adjust for pitch and snow / groom quality on piste and factor that into a Ski IQ score, but it doesn’t sound like they’re trying to make Ski IQ viable as an off piste measurement at this point.Has anyone who is objectively a good skiier (instructor/racer etc) tell me what scores they are getting in moguls and steeps?
My scores are consistent on green and blue groomers, but on the more varied terrain they drop below 100. The terrain obviously makes me more nervous, but I just want to know what score I should aim for in 3D snow? Or is that really a exercise in futility?
Oh and looks like Carv is coming out with a terrain adjustment feature.
and to reiterate, nearly all of the various metrics change during the phases of a turn...a single aggregate value for any whole turn is almost meaningless
I have hotronics and Carv installed. I wear hotronics on outside of the power strap and the car on the front of the strap. It doesn’t interfereAnybody been able to fit these in a boot with Hotronics or some other boot heater? I'm trying to install it, but I don't really have enough room on my Booster strap. I run the Booster inside in the front and the Hotronics battery, combined with my skinny legs there isn't much room left. The Carv battery will probably have to be on the inside, rear on the strap.
Not sure how long before a chairlift destroys it.
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