Individual Review Crosson Dissenter 78, 185, taking a chance that paid off

ski otter 2

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Posts
2,203
Location
Front Range, Colorado
Well, here goes.
I watched the Pugski Bode interview (Thanks!), looked at the website, got the skis. I just had a good feeling, about this model in particular. In case you haven't yet watched it:


Maybe the category for this ski is "non-typical, fun, front side biased carver". At home on all corduroy, yes. Wow. But I found them more versatile also - good in some crud and powder as long as it's not too uneven. And they will do mild bumps in crud very well, at a carve. (I'd been told they were not good in crud, but it's more they have some of a race-like skis' aversion to really uneven/big bumpy terrain instead.) To my surprise - and relief - I enjoyed them in mild off piste as well as on.

I only have one day on these, so bear with me, these are first impressions. Subject to change or updates (by myself or others).
(This review sooner rather than later, in response to a request.)

So, what a relief, these things rock - so far so good. At first I had to get used to their strong tips (at this length, anyway), and their stiffness, relative to skis like, say, the Line Blade, Liberty VMTs, or similar skis. But by the end of the first run I'd mostly adjusted. They hold an edge, flex and carve as dependably as a GS race ski (at this length, at least), rock solid that way; yet with much more forgiveness and more of the versatility of something like a Deacon, or a Head iSpeed Supershape WC Rebel RD (in a similar length). But they are pretty much different from such versatile near race skis also, a different animal. It's partly because of the lack of, or very late tip taper, I think, which gives them a steep "V" shape or, to me, narrow fan shape, in front of the boots to the tip (like the Blades and the VMTs and others). The dang things don't hook, or catch an edge, or need such care/or such precise timing in that sort of way, nor with their flex, as a result. Very confidence inspiring. To me they are as forgiving, almost, as a very different type of ski, more all mountain in that way. But they still have the chops close to a race ski - a much more accessible race ski.

Another thing: Bode (in the Pugski interview) mentioned that many skis have their turn shape too far forward, so they chatter, are not dialed in, make less experienced skiers doubt themselves. Well, I think that is another part of the success of this ski: they are dialed in, in this and other ways - just a dialed in carve, hard to make chatter, a right feel to these things with attention to the details, dunno, maybe in a fresh way. It helps that these skis have rubber along the edges and in the tips to help with dampening. That seems to work also.

And it helps that these skis were pretty much perfectly tuned, at least my pair, and needed no follow up tuning, flattening or adjustments.

Bode said in that interview he wanted a ski people (and families) could learn with, that more folks could learn to carve well with - that would give confidence; and as a result, folks could learn to commit more fully to the turn and learn to carve better and more easily. Well, to me, this ski does that, big time. But it's also a ski that a good, experienced skier can love as well, at least so far.

I know this may not be really applicable, but please forgive me, bear with me a bit (and please don't ask me "where I read that?"): what do you get when you cross an FIS GS ski (at this length) with a pair of Line Blades? (Or maybe Head V8s, or Liberty VMTs in 76. 82 or 92)?

Well, maybe with some careful cultivation you get this ski, the Dissenter 78; a Bode Miller/Crosson ski. For me, it has the best of both worlds, so far. The Blade, to me, is such easy carving fun; but it is just so much a noodle. The FIS ski, on the other hand, tends to intimidate some, and wants me on my best game, on less crowded slopes, maybe. Not these, to me.

When I saw them online, they just seemed to have a bit of the shape of those other "fan" shaped or "V" shaped skis, good learning to carve skis; but maybe more dialed in and more ski , maybe more right for me. I just had a good feeling.



Crosson Dissenter 78
165 r. 14; 175 r. 15; 185 r. 16
134-78-110 @ 185
130-78-110 @ 175
Boots: Lange RS 130 LV
bindings: Marker Griffen 13 demos,
mounted BC on the recommended dimple
me 150 lbs/5'10"
The day was the day after a powder day, on top of previous melt and freeze, so a variety of conditions:
some crud, some soft, some firm, some ice underneath in places, some bumps formed and skied off terrain, as well as corduroy.

I thought of getting a pair of Pivots, the bindings Bode Miller was using, but stuck with my usual Marker demo bindings for more narrow skis
that I don't really want to be like race skis, with no race bindings and plate - hopefully more versatile. (Not the recent toe high Marker demos - yuck.)

I had various guesses about the ski beforehand, but these were a surprise, in a good way. Something, for me, very different. Success.
(Bode mentioned he wanted to recommend the longer version. Glad he did. I'd probably have gotten that anyway. :) )

P.S. I don't really know how much of a hand Bode had with this particular model, but it seemed to mesh pretty well with what what he was saying, at any rate.

:duck:
 
Last edited:

Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
SkiTalk Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
36,783
Location
Reno, eNVy
I also was duly impressed with the ski, my only reall caviot was with the 10 cm increments, too many skiers might fall in between sizes and quite frankly I was one of those skiers. I really htink I would have really melded with the Dissenter if it was a 180. I have said it before and will reiterate it here, Bode has a knack of really making the third quarter of the ski exceptional, I felt it in the Bomber 84 and I definately felt it here.
 

EricG

Lost somewhere!
Skier
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
Posts
1,254
Location
VT
I also was duly impressed with the ski, my only reall caviot was with the 10 cm increments, too many skiers might fall in between sizes and quite frankly I was one of those skiers.

I fall into this catagory and is why I no longer ski Stockli as I was consistently between sizes. I miss the 5cm days and wish the build scaling was more consistent. But I understsnd the need to streamline the product line and manufacturing.
 

ARL67

Invisible Airwaves Crackle With Life
Skier
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Posts
924
Location
Waterloo, ON, Canada
Nice review OP.
Kinda crazy that they can retail that ski for $499 still, though cheapest shipping option is $73
 

James

Out There
Instructor
Joined
Dec 2, 2015
Posts
19,325
Could they make the Dissenter without the ginormous Head Hammerhead style tip?
 

anders_nor

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Jan 18, 2020
Posts
1,885
Location
on snow
I also was duly impressed with the ski, my only reall caviot was with the 10 cm increments, too many skiers might fall in between sizes and quite frankly I was one of those skiers. I really htink I would have really melded with the Dissenter if it was a 180. I have said it before and will reiterate it here, Bode has a knack of really making the third quarter of the ski exceptional, I felt it in the Bomber 84 and I definately felt it here.
You mean... like what we tallboys always end up? ;)
 

Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
SkiTalk Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
36,783
Location
Reno, eNVy
I fall into this catagory and is why I no longer ski Stockli as I was consistently between sizes. I miss the 5cm days and wish the build scaling was more consistent. But I understsnd the need to streamline the product line and manufacturing.
7-8 cm is fine in most instances but I will say narrower technical skis work better on the 5's. Volkl does a good job here.
 
Thread Starter
TS
S

ski otter 2

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Posts
2,203
Location
Front Range, Colorado
For a guy that's 60lbs heavier than OP - would you plate the 185?
A pisteish all rounder able to handle morning refreeze and noontime slush bumps, notably burlier than a Laser AX but not a complete tank.
On the race plates, only if you want the ski to be more groomer/race ski-like, and less versatile and easy, I would guess. I think the ski is dialed in for no plate, even prototyped for Pivots (extra low mount). But it seemed to work perfectly (at least for me) with the standard Marker demo, which is about 23 mm high, just going by memory, with heal higher than toe by about 2mm - again, from recollection. I usually get a feel if I'm wanting a higher platform, and I did not get that sense with this ski, don't know why.

I think that a much heavier skier would make the ski even easier to flex right, for most; make the ski less burly. maybe. Probably most heavier skiers would like that. (Not that it felt that way to me. For lots of reasons, I often like longer skis, that I'm used to, for my profile.) I think Bode is about 200 to 225 lbs., just guessing and what I was told by a stranger. That's 50 to 75 lbs. heavier than me also.

I just don't know how much less burly, though: probably enough to make the ski less full race ski like, but not sure. Maybe it would be just right at that weight, even better than I experienced. Dunno. I think a review from a bigger guy would help.

This ski is not really an all rounder, probably, and I'm ignorant how it does in slush as the day goes on. So with "noontime slush bumps" - not sure.
(Will know more come spring here, I guess.) I've already been surprised by this ski in good ways, however.

It's more frontside biased than the 175 AX, and more powerful, so far.

In 185, it is more like the 182/183 AX, though - but different also: both not so great in big bumps, very smooth and stable.
But with a 16 radius, this ski is quicker and more short turn oriented by a lot than the longer AX. And to me, its carve was much more dialed in than the 175 AX - for the right skier.
 
Thread Starter
TS
S

ski otter 2

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Posts
2,203
Location
Front Range, Colorado
Update:
Got another day on the 185/78 Dissenters. Really great. (It was old snow, blue bird, kinda perfect snow, first chair. (I left around 1 pm, too soon for slush to form, just right for groomers. Maybe next time on the slush.) Yes, a cheater ski for high edge angles. And big smiles.

These things just crush groomers, very relaxing, easy - but race like still. I found these are great also on anything that gets groomed, say, once a week:
with some mild bumps, mild off piste and uneven, on steep or low angle or in between - these excel. Hard to make chatter, like I said.

At this length, however, the tips are noticeable, have to be taken into account, at least for my profile: not a ski for perfectly good upright or in the back seat styles, gotta at least lean/commit a bit more forward to get them in a zone. So they prefer commitment forward into the fall line, though not a great deal of effort; relaxing, with forward anticipation/commitment/tumble, of some sort - a teaching tool for that. They are relaxing partly because it takes so little effort to flex a carve and hold an edge, so trustworthy. And they are good for longer periods of time than many skis; including, say, my FIS GS skis, for me, just obviously.

I found some basics of race ski style seem to work best, such as getting on the uphill ski early, skiing from my arches, not getting too lazy about being forward enough, without pressuring things. Then they become somewhat automatic. They start to feel like better Line Blades, at least for folks like me.
 
Thread Starter
TS
S

ski otter 2

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Posts
2,203
Location
Front Range, Colorado
Could they make the Dissenter without the ginormous Head Hammerhead style tip?
I've never been a fan of the flathead tip, except on Dynastar race skis (where it doesn't seem to matter). Until now.

It seems to be a common characteristic of both the 78 Dissenters and the Line Blade (etc.; including the K2 Disruptions of all widths - with similar dynamics, though to me way less dialed in).

In mild bumps, not a problem. (For bigger bumps, just guessing still a bit as yet, probably not the right ski, at least for me.)
 
Top