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Has anybody attained new certification this season?

Mike King

AKA Habacomike
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Louisville CO/Aspen Snowmass
I failed both my teach and ski days.

On the teach, I made several mistakes. The first was tying my teach almost exclusively to what I heard my students were working on in their skiing. It was a challenging to link all three of their foci into a single teach, but I came up with a plan. The second was incorporating into my teach a concept that I knew would be controversial in PSIA -- divorcing the upper body from the arc before the skis. And the third thing was some poor terrain management decisions. Looking for terrain suitable for medium radius turns, I wound up consuming almost all of the vertical before being done, so had to take a lift ride and wound up with a short teach. I know I can do better, and am retaking the teach day on April 27th.

On the ski day, I knew there are things that I had not prepared going into the exam. We were so busy the three weeks before the exam that I had very little time to work on the items that I had planned to work on, like the basic and highlighted maneuvers. In addition, the work on canting that had enabled some big strides in creating angulation and the ability to tip the outside ski left me refining groomed skiing rather than skiing terrain. So, these factors showed up in the exam. And it's clear I have a bunch more work to do to get there. Most of my scores were close to passing, but the whole picture is one that shows I've got more work to do. Certainly the conditions didn't help: it was exceedingly firm for most of the day, although the variable terrain in Sun Up bowl was super excellent corn/slush -- the highlight of the day! The lowlight was skiing the ice bumps with frozen slush chunks in Look Ma -- survival skiing for me.

The Level 3 exam is hard. No one in my group of 5 passed.

Anyway, I'm taking the MA exam on the 26th and (as noted above) retaking the teach day on the 27th. It seems to me that I'll be well served by letting a retake of the ski exam until next year.

Mike
 

Tricia

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Your attention to detail gives a good perspective of what it takes to pass L3.
With the way you put yourself out there, I'm sure you'll make improvements as needed.
 

Nancy Hummel

Ski more, talk less.
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I failed both my teach and ski days.

On the teach, I made several mistakes. The first was tying my teach almost exclusively to what I heard my students were working on in their skiing. It was a challenging to link all three of their foci into a single teach, but I came up with a plan. The second was incorporating into my teach a concept that I knew would be controversial in PSIA -- divorcing the upper body from the arc before the skis. And the third thing was some poor terrain management decisions. Looking for terrain suitable for medium radius turns, I wound up consuming almost all of the vertical before being done, so had to take a lift ride and wound up with a short teach. I know I can do better, and am retaking the teach day on April 27th.

On the ski day, I knew there are things that I had not prepared going into the exam. We were so busy the three weeks before the exam that I had very little time to work on the items that I had planned to work on, like the basic and highlighted maneuvers. In addition, the work on canting that had enabled some big strides in creating angulation and the ability to tip the outside ski left me refining groomed skiing rather than skiing terrain. So, these factors showed up in the exam. And it's clear I have a bunch more work to do to get there. Most of my scores were close to passing, but the whole picture is one that shows I've got more work to do. Certainly the conditions didn't help: it was exceedingly firm for most of the day, although the variable terrain in Sun Up bowl was super excellent corn/slush -- the highlight of the day! The lowlight was skiing the ice bumps with frozen slush chunks in Look Ma -- survival skiing for me.

The Level 3 exam is hard. No one in my group of 5 passed.

Anyway, I'm taking the MA exam on the 26th and (as noted above) retaking the teach day on the 27th. It seems to me that I'll be well served by letting a retake of the ski exam until next year.

Mike

Having skied with Mike quite a bit over the year, I know how hard he worked and how far he has come.

He now has much more information and can focus on the feedback he received.

Way to put it out there, Mike! You will do this.
 

Nobody

Out of my mind, back in five.
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I failed both my teach and ski days.

On the teach, I made several mistakes. The first was tying my teach almost exclusively to what I heard my students were working on in their skiing. It was a challenging to link all three of their foci into a single teach, but I came up with a plan. The second was incorporating into my teach a concept that I knew would be controversial in PSIA -- divorcing the upper body from the arc before the skis. And the third thing was some poor terrain management decisions. Looking for terrain suitable for medium radius turns, I wound up consuming almost all of the vertical before being done, so had to take a lift ride and wound up with a short teach. I know I can do better, and am retaking the teach day on April 27th.

On the ski day, I knew there are things that I had not prepared going into the exam. We were so busy the three weeks before the exam that I had very little time to work on the items that I had planned to work on, like the basic and highlighted maneuvers. In addition, the work on canting that had enabled some big strides in creating angulation and the ability to tip the outside ski left me refining groomed skiing rather than skiing terrain. So, these factors showed up in the exam. And it's clear I have a bunch more work to do to get there. Most of my scores were close to passing, but the whole picture is one that shows I've got more work to do. Certainly the conditions didn't help: it was exceedingly firm for most of the day, although the variable terrain in Sun Up bowl was super excellent corn/slush -- the highlight of the day! The lowlight was skiing the ice bumps with frozen slush chunks in Look Ma -- survival skiing for me.

The Level 3 exam is hard. No one in my group of 5 passed.

Anyway, I'm taking the MA exam on the 26th and (as noted above) retaking the teach day on the 27th. It seems to me that I'll be well served by letting a retake of the ski exam until next year.

Mike
I'll root for you , Mike.
 

BS Slarver

Making fresh tracks
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It’s not an easy process, took me 2x, chin up Mike. Lot of guts to lay all that out here for everyone.
If it’s any consolation I used the same teaching that I used on the first go around that they failed me for. I just didn’t let it go until everyone, including the examiner understood my ideas the second time.

Suffice to say the process is just little subjective
 

Scruffy

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We're all pulling for you, Mike. Keep after it.
 

VickieH

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The certification will be nice, @Mike King. I have no doubt you will achieve it. But the learning, the refinement -- the real value -- is in all that leads up to that point. Everything you have done to date has increased your value to the clients you serve. As a ski student, I thank you for improving your knowledge and ability so you can help us improve ours.
 

Steve

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Sorry Mike.
 

Mike King

AKA Habacomike
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Louisville CO/Aspen Snowmass
Sorry Mike.
No worries. I showed up with what I have. What I have is not quite there yet. So back to training.

Snowmass closes the 25th. I have at least a week and a half of good training there. Then MA and teach exams, and spring training at Loveland and the Basin. That should set me up for a good start next season...
 

LiquidFeet

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You will get that pin, Mike. Congrats on keeping your positive outlook through this whole ordeal. I'm glad to see you're redoing the teaching part so soon and looking forward to your report back.

How will you modify your approach for the retake? Will you avoid the "controversial" thing you introduced last time - divorcing the upper body from the arc before the skis? Did you get direct and useful feedback on that issue in particular? Did the examiner think you were promoting upper body rotation or something of that sort ... or misunderstand you altogether?

And how will you handle the differences in what the students are focusing on this next time?
 
Last edited:

Mike King

AKA Habacomike
Instructor
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Nov 13, 2015
Posts
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Location
Louisville CO/Aspen Snowmass
You will get that pin, Mike. Congrats on keeping your positive outlook through this whole ordeal. I'm glad to see you're redoing the teaching part so soon and looking forward to your report back.

How will you modify your approach for the retake? Will you avoid the "controversial" thing you introduced last time - divorcing the upper body from the arc before the skis? Did you get direct and useful feedback on that issue in particular? Did the examiner think you were promoting upper body rotation or something of that sort ... or misunderstand you altogether?

And how will you handle the differences in what the students are focusing on this next time?
The feedback from the examiners, one of whom is a very doctrinaire PSIA'er, was that moving the torso into the turn prior to moving the lower body "may" not be compatible with modern ski technique. I was sorely tempted to send video of Hirscher, Schiffrin, and Kristofferson or just this video:


back to the examiners, but whatever. Yes, we need to be sure that folk don't just dump the body inside. And I don't think I'd teach this to most of my clients. But a group of ski instructors presumably at the Level 3 standard? They ought to be able to handle it, and know the difference between a slight movement of the ribcage and dumping the body inside. Especially with coaching from someone, even me.

Now I will seriously dumb down whatever I teach staying within a single drill with variations, pay more attention to the movement patterns in their skiing during warm up (even if it isn't in the realm of what they are working on), and not try to reach as far in the teach.

My coaches have advised me thus. "Check the boxes, get the pin, then do what you believe in and want to do."

Mike
 

Chris V.

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The feedback from the examiners, one of whom is a very doctrinaire PSIA'er, was that moving the torso into the turn prior to moving the lower body "may" not be compatible with modern ski technique.
Would be interesting to hear a more detailed description of the mock lesson you gave, and what you said in that lesson. Or I could just go watch Tom Gellie video, and probably get a pretty good idea of that, LOL. (You did say "ribcage.")

My coaches have advised me thus. "Check the boxes, get the pin, then do what you believe in and want to do."

Sigh.
 

Chris V.

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It is always a bad idea to allow the impression that there might be anything in your mind other than the accepted dogma of any exclusive organization when being examined to be an accredited representative/member of that organization, if you wish to attain said accreditation.
If only there were a "PSIA Dogma Manual." A big issue I had with the organization was that it was hard to tease out that dogma, that you could get it only through a lot of contact with higher-ups steeped in that dogma, that different individuals might have their own variations on that dogma, and heaven forbid you spend time with a younger trainer not beholden to that dogma. And then it might be luck of the draw determining if the examiner you got subscribed to the same flavor of the dogma that you had learned.
 

Chris V.

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Mike, care to say anything more about why you think you weren't able to pass the skiing segment of the exam? Infected by your rebelliousness in the teaching segment? Objective issues that you'd acknowledge? Do you think the examiner wanted something different from what Belingheri displayed above? (Nice goal!) Not insisting, self-critique is always painful.
 

jimtransition

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The feedback from the examiners, one of whom is a very doctrinaire PSIA'er, was that moving the torso into the turn prior to moving the lower body "may" not be compatible with modern ski technique. I was sorely tempted to send video of Hirscher, Schiffrin, and Kristofferson or just this video:


back to the examiners, but whatever. Yes, we need to be sure that folk don't just dump the body inside. And I don't think I'd teach this to most of my clients. But a group of ski instructors presumably at the Level 3 standard? They ought to be able to handle it, and know the difference between a slight movement of the ribcage and dumping the body inside. Especially with coaching from someone, even me.

Now I will seriously dumb down whatever I teach staying within a single drill with variations, pay more attention to the movement patterns in their skiing during warm up (even if it isn't in the realm of what they are working on), and not try to reach as far in the teach.

My coaches have advised me thus. "Check the boxes, get the pin, then do what you believe in and want to do."

Mike
Sounds like you know what to do next time! From reading your posts here it's clear you have a good understanding of skiing, much better to pass with a rote example of PSIA dogma, than fail shooting for the perfect lesson.
 
Thread Starter
TS
Erik Timmerman

Erik Timmerman

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How does the teach segment work? Is it a "bring your own" or do you have to come up with something on the fly?

Re: Dogma and the rib cage, I wonder if what you thought you said, what the examiner thought you said, and what you actually said are all the same thing.
 

François Pugh

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How does the teach segment work? Is it a "bring your own" or do you have to come up with something on the fly?

Re: Dogma and the rib cage, I wonder if what you thought you said, what the examiner thought you said, and what you actually said are all the same thing.
Probably not. The view from the sidelines, with my only source of dogma being the spill-out from the holy wars, is that it is very important to leave the impression with the examiners that you are, beyond any shadow of a doubt, nothing other than a staunch defender of the faith. Maybe I'm too cynical.
 

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