^There's a Red Bull Powertrains F1 joke in there, I'm sure of it.
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Van Deer/Red Bull and WC Racing
- Thread starter Philpug
- Start date
About 15 years ago I was riding in a popular local cycling road race and one of the sponsors was Red Bull. So I decided to have a Red Bull they were handing out, just prior to the road race thinking the jolt would give me an edge. We were about 20 miles into the road race, I was in the main pack (peloton) and said "boys I need to pull over" and I blew chow on the side of the road. Of course the peloton was long gone and I finished the race on my own, but that is the last time I have consumed a Red Bull.
After reading through all of these posts on Van Deer, I started down the internet rabbit hole and noticed something. The tip protectors on the Van Deer FIS SL skis are identical to those used on Fischer SL skis. Is Fischer actually the manufacturer for these skis, or does Augment/Van Deer have their own factory and they are just reusing the Fischer tip protectors, or....? The similarities certainly are not a coincidence.
Thread Starter
TS
RDVB/Augment has their own factory in Mittersill Austria.
Are they possibly only building the all mountain skis in house and then farming out the FIS stuff to Fischer? As far as I know, that tip protector is exclusive to Fischer and it seems a bit implausible that Fischer would get any benefit from selling a $2 plastic part to a rival startup.
Last year those Fischer tip protectors were sold out everywhere and were nearly impossible to find. Maybe all of the spares were sold to Augment/Van Deer.
I guess I'm not seeing what you're seeing because those don't look identical to me.
No, Fischer is not making the Augment/VD race skis. There are only so many ways to shape a tip protector, so they are all fairly similar.
Thread Starter
TS
While there are similarities, there are some visual differences.
I need to find a better picture of the Fischer.... They are both even using the same, custom Torx drive sex bolts to attach the protector. These are not an off-the-shelf bolt and are not used by any other company for their race skis.
The shape is not just similar, it is identical. They are even using the same custom Torx drive sex bolts to attach the protector.
Thread Starter
TS
So, you are basing where they are producing their skis based in tip protectors which are probably all produced third party to specs?
Thanks man! Seriously didn’t know it is called that.
They are also called binding post screws. One half looks like a normal screw (male side), the other half has a normal screw head , but is an internally threaded tube (female side). All tip protectors mount with some variation of this design.A side question-what is a sex bolt?
Like @Philpug said, much of the parts are sourced to 3rd party vendors to spec. Hard to imaging any ski factories with the facilities to manufacture small quantities of custom screws. Same with the epoxy, titanal sheets, ptex, etc...
The factories nowadays are more like auto assembly plants. Parts from all over the world. That's why when there is a kink in the supply chain. All goes to s**t.
The factories nowadays are more like auto assembly plants. Parts from all over the world. That's why when there is a kink in the supply chain. All goes to s**t.
I am just asking questions.
Sure, someone else may be doing the injection molding and someone else might be machining the screws, but they are produced to Fischer's spec's and Fischer would own the design as well as the injection molds. Every ski company has their own unique design for their tip protectors and their own unique screws for attachment. The only time they are the same is on sister skis like Rossi/Dynastar, Atomic/Salomon, and Blizzard/Nordica.
At a minimum, Augment/Van Deer are buying their tip protectors from Fischer. This in itself would be a bit odd, especially since Fischer's tip protectors are arguably the worst in the business.
A bit off topic, but I have spent way too many hours building 3D models to recreate the tip protectors from several brands, including Fischer's. Fischer's design for the protector and screws is the most unique out of all the ones I have studied.
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Maybe both Augment/Van Deer and Fischer are buying their tip protectors from a third party supplier?
Do you really think there is a third party company whose sole business is designing and manufacturing tip protectors for FIS SL skis? If they are not made in-house, they are farmed out to any competent injection molder.
Fischer has been using this same design for probably a decade now. Up until Augment came along, only Fischer was using this design
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- Aug 26, 2016
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They probably buy the tip protectors from Fischer, Albert Kogler, one of Augments founders used to work for Fischer. If you look closely they don’t quite fit, one side sticks out further than the other.
Augment/Van Deer Red Bull skis have a novel construction, it’s unlikely that they could outsource production. Their production facility is equipped to produce 15,000 pairs p.a. their goal for this season is 6000 pairs. VDRB's main interest is in WC ski racing, in recent interview with a Swiss newspaper Toni Giger, the guy Red Bull recruited to run the racing operation said:
“Traditional ski companies sell skis and also have a racing department. Van Deer, is a racing department that also sells skis."
In order to go racing they are obliged to sell their skis to the general public. According to reports in the Austrian press this years production is sold out, if you want a pair you have to put your name on a waiting list.
Augment/Van Deer Red Bull skis have a novel construction, it’s unlikely that they could outsource production. Their production facility is equipped to produce 15,000 pairs p.a. their goal for this season is 6000 pairs. VDRB's main interest is in WC ski racing, in recent interview with a Swiss newspaper Toni Giger, the guy Red Bull recruited to run the racing operation said:
“Traditional ski companies sell skis and also have a racing department. Van Deer, is a racing department that also sells skis."
In order to go racing they are obliged to sell their skis to the general public. According to reports in the Austrian press this years production is sold out, if you want a pair you have to put your name on a waiting list.