Media Coverage of WC racing - Streaming or TV

[wnyskier]

This is a really great post and I won’t try to quote because I don’t know how to do that without making it show the whole thing over again which everyone already just read.

I think there are two significant differences in the US market between ski racing and F1 that are challenging from a TV or streaming broadcasting perspective. One is that F1 is hugely popular globally whereas ski racing is a fringe sport for the general public, and the other is that even for people who don’t know either sport, the number of people in the US who can relate to auto racing is orders of magnitude more than those who can relate to ski racing. Everyone (more or less) drives a car. I agree with everything you say about how ski racing about has all the elements for a great story, and a lot can be done to sell this but I fear it will still be difficult just because it will be hard to appeal to people who are not skiers.

I don't know how to shorten the quote either.....

I believe it's about the personalities, the skiing population is small, but so is/was the popular interest in F1. Case in point is after watching Drive to Survive my daughter's friends now subscribe to the the F1 stream and gather together on Sundays to watch the races together. They didn't even know F1 existed 3 years ago. Didn't follow NASCAR or IndyCar. Not saying ski racing in the US will have the same magnitude of response but it sure will be better than where we are now.

Perhaps this is better managed by the FIS and may be why Eliasch wants to control the broadcast rights to the races.......He's a pretty clever guy.

 

[Swede]

I’ve been saying ever since I saw Drive to Survive season 1, this would be a perfect format for WC skiing.

 

[4ster]

I don't know how to shorten the quote either.....

Just highlight the part you want to quote & hit the ”quote” icon when it pops up below it…

 

[dbostedo]

Just highlight the part you want to quote & hit the ”quote” icon when it pops up below it…

View attachment 150983

Or hit the "Reply" option. "Quote+" will put it in your quote queue, which is useful especially if you want to quote multiple posts. The you can use the "Insert Quotes" option in the reply box. "Reply" in the pop-up is quicker to just partially quote one post, as it pops it straight into the reply box.

Also, you can edit a full quote once it's in the reply box just like any other text, although that can get fiddly sometimes with the way quotes are formatted depending on your device/browser. (If you want to see the text in the old style with quote tags, and without the formatting, you can also click/select the brackets, "[ ]", in the upper right to see the plain text version.)

 

[chris_the_wrench]

Kinda drift off topic, but what about Olympic coverage for streaming? Nbc’s olympic coverage is beyond pathetic! I dont care about commentators or ‘analysis’ so I’d take a foreign broadcast. Something reliable and shows more than ice skating. I like alpine, nordic, hockey, biathlon, luge, etc. I’d be willing to pay for decent service.

 

[Rudi Riet]

Kinda drift off topic, but what about Olympic coverage for streaming? Nbc’s olympic coverage is beyond pathetic! I dont care about commentators or ‘analysis’ so I’d take a foreign broadcast. Something reliable and shows more than ice skating. I like alpine, nordic, hockey, biathlon, luge, etc. I’d be willing to pay for decent service.

NBC plans on using their OTA (read: the slice-and-dice figure skating focused stuff) and cable networks (Olympic Channel and USA Network) in conjunction with the NBC Sports app and Peacock to offer a lot of coverage. I'd imagine the app and Peacock may allow for unedited streaming of events - it's what NBC has done in the past.

If you need other options a VPN is a great way to go, allowing one to watch the unedited coverage from services like CBC and BBC (if you want English language commentary) or ARD (German). I think that Eurosport will also have Olympics coverage, though their streaming service is not free.

 

[wnyskier]

Bormio post race micro rant: Someone needs to tell Schlanger to actually watch the feed. Once again he is reading from a script as big things are happening on course. Worse yet he talks over Weibrecht who is doing a pretty good job of calling the race and adding his personal experiences on the course where appropriate.

The GS feed from Lienz was OK, certainly better than the Peacock commentary but perhaps not as good as Eurosport's Ed Drake. At least one could focus on the skiing rather than having to deal with nonstop blathering.

Last but not least, a huge thumbs up to Ski Dad on YT. This guy knows his stuff and gives a great deep dive into technique and tactics on the WC. Production is very home grown but the content is so far beyond anything I have seen in the public space. If you're into the details this is the place to go.

 

[Muleski]

I posted this elsewhere a few weeks ago, about Ski Dad {Joe Dunn}, noted by @wnyskier ^^^^^.

At the time I also did not mention that Joe is very well wired into the USST. Very friendly {long term friends} with a multitude of coaches, and athletes {present and past.} Joe knows how stuff, to say he least.

I'd love to see him grow and morph this into a bit "bigger" endeavor. Hope that he will.

MS

Don’t know if folks here know who Ski Dad on YouTube is. I do.

He does not seem to mention his name at all. He’s a former NCAA All American at UNH. He is level 3 PSIA, and a level 300 USSS alpine coach, if I recall. Was pretty recently the U16 program director for the Park City Ski Team. Very, very good coach.

And was the US Race Director for Blizzard-Tecnica for many years. From when they got it going until they pulled it back. He is a very knowledgable equipment guy.

Good guy. I believe that he’s largely a stay at home, or stay with the boys, dad right now. They have two toddlers. Wife is in the medical profession. So…he started producing these videos, and is adding videos about teaching/coaching his boys. 4 and 2, I think.

His videos are worth a look. No ego. Not one of the “MA” crowd who tend to drive at least a few of us crazy! These are made to be fun.

Joe Dunn knows his S***, has a great sense of humor, and these are interesting. And entertaining.

BTW, I think it it may have been Joe who brought his friend Marcus Caston to Tecnica-Blizzard.

No vested interest. Just saw the video with 4 year old Bryce, who I am 99.9% sure is named after Bryce Astle. Interesting.

Those will be fun videos, and helpful. BTW, I do not know a good alpine coach who has not had his/her kids out of a wedge ASAP.
They all seem to “coach” their kids without the kids really knowing that they are being coached or taught.


The WC content is very “legit” as well. For sure.

 

[Muleski]

I was pretty "brutally frank" about NBC and Schlanger's role earlier the season. The reaction by many was that he's a nice guy, just doing his job, not HIS "fault." I subsequently made the point that all of that is true, and reformed my criticism towards NBC. I also think that if the USSS/USST wants to make gains under their new leadership THEY need to somehow "influence" those with the broadcast rights, and collectively "do better."

Steve Schlanger might be the greatest guy o the planet, and he may be a real sports generalist who can do a pretty average at best job with a large number of sports. He is NOT good at this one, at all. And, he is not new to it. He does not add much. For me, he adds close to nothing. It's infortunate.

I also just saw Ski Racing's headlines of today's action. I think it's FAR too much "homerism" to report The Lienz GS win by Tessa Worley in Shiffrin's "absence". Like, surely a woman still in her prime would have zero shot at winning had MS been there! I think we might as well be used to it all being about MS, all the time, at least through the OWG's and probably the season. Not sure if it "helps" anything. Not like skiracing.com is mainstream news.

 

[wnyskier]

I also just saw Ski Racing's headlines of today's action. I think it's FAR too much "homerism" to report The Lienz GS win by Tessa Worley in Shiffrin's "absence".

Saw that as well, it's disappointing that SR would go that route. I think it shows a lack of respect for the other athletes that are in regular contention for the win. The podium today was made of some of the most experienced and professional women in the sport.

A long time ago SR used to be the flagship ski racing publication in the US. Not sure what the future plans are for SR but in the world of ski racing media, social and otherwise, it is becoming less and less relevant. There is little reporting, mostly just repackaging of newsfeed items and press releases.

 

[geepers]

Last but not least, a huge thumbs up to Ski Dad on YT. This guy knows his stuff and gives a great deep dive into technique and tactics on the WC. Production is very home grown but the content is so far beyond anything I have seen in the public space. If you're into the details this is the place to go.

Yep, SkiDad is educational and quirkly off-beat at times.

Damn, I wish he could use race footage - pita ContentID doesn't allow some reasonable copying (a few secs here and there).

 

[Swede]

I was pretty "brutally frank" about NBC and Schlanger's role earlier the season. The reaction by many was that he's a nice guy, just doing his job, not HIS "fault." I subsequently made the point that all of that is true, and reformed my criticism towards NBC. I also think that if the USSS/USST wants to make gains under their new leadership THEY need to somehow "influence" those with the broadcast rights, and collectively "do better."

Steve Schlanger might be the greatest guy o the planet, and he may be a real sports generalist who can do a pretty average at best job with a large number of sports. He is NOT good at this one, at all. And, he is not new to it. He does not add much. For me, he adds close to nothing. It's infortunate.

I also just saw Ski Racing's headlines of today's action. I think it's FAR too much "homerism" to report The Lienz GS win by Tessa Worley in Shiffrin's "absence". Like, surely a woman still in her prime would have zero shot at winning had MS been there! I think we might as well be used to it all being about MS, all the time, at least through the OWG's and probably the season. Not sure if it "helps" anything. Not like skiracing.com is mainstream news.

There have been periods when MS has been so much better than the rest of the field that such a claim could have been somewhat legit. But not now and not in GS. Women’s WC GS is an open affair where 5-6 athletes can win.

 

[BrianB]

Compared to Soelden, I missed Ed Drake in the Lienz broadcast. The commentator said a few amusing things, I mean this in a good natured way, like how Brignone was a taller skier, (paraphrasing) how Frasse Sombet was different than other competitors because she was always trying to look more than one gate ahead (which J4s are taught to do) and wondering whether we might see Gut-Behrami in the slalom.

 

[Rudi Riet]

Compared to Soelden, I missed Ed Drake in the Lienz broadcast. The commentator said a few amusing things, I mean this in a good natured way, like how Brignone was a taller skier, (paraphrasing) how Frasse Sombet was different than other competitors because she was always trying to look more than one gate ahead (which J4s are taught to do) and wondering whether we might see Gut-Behrami in the slalom.

Today's British commentator on Peacock was Carlton Kirby, one of the Eurosport regulars... for bike racing. I sent him an email (he and I correspond periodically) asking why he was doing skiing commentary and he was pinch hitting for Lienz coverage. Apparently the commentator originally lined up is in COVID quarantine.

Kirby did his best but it was a bit of a Schlanger-going-solo situation: a person who isn't completely in his element having to cover a sport for which he's not a specialist and can typically rely on a more versed color/co-commentator. It wasn't ideal but it is what it is - I appreciate Kirby's affability and it showed in this situation, one in which he was definitely a bit of a fish out of water.

Just my $0.02.

 

[James]

The commentators aren’t at the venues these days? Seemed that way with Schlanger/Weibrecht

 

[S.H.]

The commentators aren’t at the venues these days? Seemed that way with Schlanger/Weibrecht

(US) Commentators haven't been at (non-US) venues for YEARS

They're working off the world feed from studios. I'm guessing Porino is still in his garage, and Schlanger at an NBC studio in CO or CT (not sure where he's based).

 

[wnyskier]

As I watched the second run SL from Lienz while eating my oatmeal, my wife was listening and suggested viewers should start playing the drinking game where you take a shot every time the Steves say "Shiffrin", then took it back after MS was mentioned half a dozen times in 3 minutes. As far as Peacock is concerned it is the MS show and nothing more. She doesn't even need to be at the race to dominate the commentary.

 

[goweje]

Carlton Kirby was a new low. He was consistently wrong in predicting splits times, offered nothing technically and didn't even have anything to add in terms of basic biographical info. But the coup de grâce for me was when he suggested that Shiffrin hoped Moltzan would ski poorly because she's not currently "on form." Shiffrin of course proceeded to win the second run and take the victory.

The NBC guys were never on sit accept for US events and world champs. Prior to covid they were calling the races from the NBC studio in CT.

I think the criticism of Schlanger is unfair. In sports commentary there are play-by-play people and color commentators. Schlanger is a PbP guy. He has a nice rapport with Porino, does a solid job setting the stage and knows the racer's bios. He also knows how to bring levity to the broadcasts when appropriate. Dan Hicks is NBC's big gun that they bring in for world champs, Killington and the Olympics. Do you think Hicks is better? I think Hicks is worse and I generally like Hicks for other sports. He does a nice job with golf in particular.

Solo Schlanger was rough, but that should be more of an indictment of NBC than anything else. Even Porino when he had to call Kranjska Gora solo wasn't great and he used to be more of the PbP guy when he was working with Doug Lewis. It really is a two man job.

You have to blame NBC. Peacock is a joke and clearly they've done a 180 and have decided to pull back from winter sports en masse. They're now using the Olympic Channel as a kind of ESPN classic, mostly showing reruns of old events rather than building interest in Olympics sports by showing live action. Commentary has been cut or reduced across the board (alpine, x-country, biathlon). They seem to view the world cup events for these sports as loss leaders and a cost of doing business (business being broadcasting the Olympics every four years).

The brain trust at US SKi & Snowboard also deserves criticism. You have to pressure your broadcast partner to put your content where people can actually watch! Some news reports suggest that Peacock's real stand alone subscriber numbers are in the low single digit millions. Did they agree to allow NBC to take almost all their races off broadcast television? If you're forced to go OTT, other partners make more sense. Also, has anyone tried their ski and snowboard live platform? That seems to have had almost no impact.

 

[dbostedo]

You have to pressure your broadcast partner to put your content where people can actually watch! Some news reports suggest that Peacock's real stand alone subscriber numbers are in the low single digit millions.

I wouldn't be surprised if that number was correct, but in part that may be because some tens of millions of folks get Peacock included as part of their cable service. (I know my cable company - Cox - includes it, as does Comcast, if you have their internet service and cable. That's ~25M households I think, per some quick Googling.)

Unfortunately, that "built-in" subscriber base may also mean that Peacock doesn't have a lot of motivation to improve, as they're just a selling point to keep cable subscribers, not really a stand alone service a la Hulu/Netflix/Paramount+/Amazon Prime/Disney+/etc.

All of that said, I have been able to watch any race I wanted, including the Austrian ones, which has been better than some prior years.

 

[chris_the_wrench]

You have to blame NBC

It doesn’t take much for me to criticize nbc’s coverage of ANY sporting event! Pathetic would be where I would start and decline from there. Nbc should stick to sitcom comedies and snl. Every ‘two ‘years they butcher the Olympics, motorsports broadcast is pathetic… I enjoy watching the ski racing but the comentary is so bad I have to watch it muted.

I assume nbc’s pathetic coverage stems from their desire to make every broadcasted event entertaining to someone who is watching that sport for the first time or they only watch one event a year(indy 500) or every 4 years(olympic skiing)….