The Never-Ending Stöckli Discussion

[anders_nor]

can anyone comment on the stiffness of the SL LASER 2021 155cm? my GF borrowed the ski with race plate & 16 din? binding I belive from a friend, will doublecheck, she was much happier on it than her rossi fis sl 157s saying it was much softer and easier to ski, can anyone confirm?

I do belive the 155 was the the FIS version, so guessing jr/female vs female on 155/157?

 

[AmyPJ]

I demo’ed the Nela 88 today at Palisades. I almost skipped it, since demo-ing there has gotten more complicated. They used to have a mid-mountain demo station where you could swap out skis without having to take off your boots, but it’s not open due to the staffing shortage, so you actually have to ski down to the bottom and walk through the village. So I had to be judicious in my selections as I figured I could only get to 3 or 4 skis today. And I’ll have to add one or two more demo days to my plan.

I had done some more research and I was afraid the Nela wouldn’t be “all mountain” enough for when I hit some moguls or want to ski in the trees a bit. The tail has almost no rocker and a more squared off shape, so I thought it would make releasing the tail more difficult in those situations.

The guy at the demo shop and I actually chatted about that and he said that he did notice that when he skied the SR compared with some of the other skis they had there. But after the Volkl Secret and Mindbender 98 (I wanted to try the 88, but they don’t demo it - still looking for that one), based on my comments, he said I should give the Nela 88 a try. He actually recommended it over the 96 (and people here always recommend wider) - he thought I’d like it better.

Wow! Color me impressed! Cut through the crud and I took it on some bumps, and it performed way better than I had anticipated. I had no issue releasing the tails and they were nimble, but also went through the ungroomed stuffand the slush that had started to form (it was a bit warm today).

I may still try the 96s - but I definitely liked the 88s. I actually kept them and am going to ski a few more runs on them at Alpine tomorrow and also see what demo skis they have available there. I’m still a little nervous about their versatility. And I really want to try the Santa Ana 93s and try and find the Mindbender 88s.

Oh, I went with the 152s over the 160s. I’m 5’1” (155 cm). The demo shop guy and I talked about the ski length and thought the shorter ski would be more “forgiving” with the tail release.

Your impressions echo mine exactly--no rocker in the tail, and a squared off shape...hmmm, will they get caught up in funky snow? No, they in fact feel so predictable and that tail makes them that much more fun on groomers because it doesn't wash out like my Santa Anas did. And ditto on going shorter, as I typically like a ski in the mid 160s for an all-mountain ski and I'm on the 160 and it feels perfect. To me, they are a magical blend of light and stable.

 

[kimberlin]

Your impressions echo mine exactly--no rocker in the tail, and a squared off shape...hmmm, will they get caught up in funky snow? No, they in fact feel so predictable and that tail makes them that much more fun on groomers because it doesn't wash out like my Santa Anas did. And ditto on going shorter, as I typically like a ski in the mid 160s for an all-mountain ski and I'm on the 160 and it feels perfect. To me, they are a magical blend of light and stable.

I too have found those qualities to be same on my Nela 80s. These skis are so darn nimble, unflappable , and on groomers feel like skiing over velvet. One thing I discovered with mine after I had Solomon Warden bindings added (not first choice, but was pinched for time due to ski trip next day! ), is that despite the weight of those big ugly bindings, I believe they enhance the stability underfoot of such a light ski. This serendipity was unexpected and has not hindered their maneuverability in any way. As a very petite woman a light ski can be a good thing or a bad thing. The binding seems to keep me grounded , as opposed to being tossed around . Could be Stockli too.

 

[AmyPJ]

I took the Nelas out today in the wettest, nastiest, mankiest snow I have ever skied combined with fog and rain and just hideous visibility and they were so smooth and easy. Most of the time a "crud buster" ski is heavier, but these are the best combination of light yet nimble and smooth in crud. I wanted to stay out longer but the visibility was just too much as I was getting dizzy--a bummer because the snow up high was quite nice and I was having fun.

 

[applecart]

I took the Nelas out today in the wettest, nastiest, mankiest snow I have ever skied combined with fog and rain and just hideous visibility and they were so smooth and easy. Most of the time a "crud buster" ski is heavier, but these are the best combination of light yet nimble and smooth in crud. I wanted to stay out longer but the visibility was just too much as I was getting dizzy--a bummer because the snow up high was quite nice and I was having fun.

I'm so glad to hear about everyone's impressions of the ski. I'm going to demo them in Feb out at Taos and I'm concerned that they will be too light, but doesn't sound like they feel that way to you!

 

[AmyPJ]

I'm so glad to hear about everyone's impressions of the ski. I'm going to demo them in Feb out at Taos and I'm concerned that they will be too light, but doesn't sound like they feel that way to you!

Not at all, and it's no secret around here that I like a damper ski typically. These are the perfect blend of stable and light and playful. I can't wait to get out in some sunny crud where I can see better and let them go a little more.

 

[switters]

I've been skiing the Head SuperShape e.Magnum 170 cm as my dedicated short-turn carver. I'm curious about replacing it with a Stockli ski, but I'd like something with the same (or at least very similar) 13 m radius @170 cm. Looks like the Laser SL has a 14.5 radius @170 cm and the Laser WRT ST has a 14.8 radius @172 cm. I'm 6'3 and 165 lbs, expert skier. I have the Blizzard Firebird WRCs, which I take out when I want to rail some longer radius turns and when I can go fast without worrying that I'm going to run someone over—so for this ski, I do want something in the 13-14 m radius if possible.

What are the main differences between these two skis? Which would be best for me, given my situation? And is it even possible to get a pair now? I checked Powder7, SkiEssentials, and other places that usually sell them, but they're all out of stock.

 

[AlpedHuez]

And is it even possible to get a pair now? I checked Powder7, SkiEssentials, and other places that usually sell them, but they're all out of stock.

Corbetts.com has a WRT ST in 172 with the SRT binding. I was considering that, but I ended up getting the 180 (with WRT plate/binding) as I wanted more of a GS feel.

I would say that the main difference between the SL and the WRT ST is that the SL wants to always be turning, and only short slalom turns, whereas you can vary the turn shape of the WRT ST, from slalom to more GS turns, and let the ski run out quite a bit more.

I know @Tony Storaro would have some thoughts on this, having owned and skied both.

 

[switters]

Corbetts.com has a WRT ST in 172 with the SRT binding. I was considering that, but I ended up getting the 180 (with WRT plate/binding) as I wanted more of a GS feel.

I would say that the main difference between the SL and the WRT ST is that the SL wants to always be turning, and only short slalom turns, whereas you can vary the turn shape of the WRT ST, from slalom to more GS turns, and let the ski run out quite a bit more.

I know @Tony Storaro would have some thoughts on this, having skied both.

Is that $2k price (Canadian, which I guess comes out to $1,580 US, about typical for this ski + binding combo? Seems like I saw it for less somewhere before, but maybe not.

I like the idea of the 172 cm WRT ST for the variability of turn shape. One thing I haven't loved about my Supershape e.Magnums is that they tend to be a little squirrely at higher speeds and longer turn radii. That's not surprising, given the dimensions and sidecut of that ski, but if the Laser WRT ST really does live up to its promise of being stable with longer radius turns but still able to bend into shorter radius turns, it would be a perfect carver for me.

 

[Noodler]

Is that $2k price (Canadian, which I guess comes out to $1,580 US, about typical for this ski + binding combo? Seems like I saw it for less somewhere before, but maybe not.

I like the idea of the 172 cm WRT ST for the variability of turn shape. One thing I haven't loved about my Supershape e.Magnums is that they tend to be a little squirrely at higher speeds and longer turn radii. That's not surprising, given the dimensions and sidecut of that ski, but if the Laser WRT ST really does live up to its promise of being stable with longer radius turns but still able to bend into shorter radius turns, it would be a perfect carver for me.

Do you have the opportunity to get on some ski demos somewhere (not just Stockli)? I think you would benefit from some self discovery to determine what you really need from a ski. Me thinks you aren’t actually a tight sidecut skier, but would prefer a more versatile design. You should strongly consider the Laser AX.

 

[KingGrump]

Numbers are numbers. Often not truly representative of reality. Mixed with marketing and hype ---> smoke and mirrors. We live in a wonderful time. Don't we?

The WRT-ST is a fairly benign ski. Decent in low speed and short turns. Comes alive with speed.
If you are really looking for a short turn specialist. Why not get a pair of FIS SL. The FIS SL (any brand) is a lot more fun in short turns than the WRT-ST. No issues with longer turns and/or higher speeds. Take some skill though.
Both my son and I found our Atomic FIS SL to be lot more fun. The FIS SL is more versatile. Better in bumps. The WRT-ST feels smoother at speed. Mid-week skiing kind of speed.

Ski buying is very much a head game.

 

[Tony Storaro]

I've been skiing the Head SuperShape e.Magnum 170 cm as my dedicated short-turn carver. I'm curious about replacing it with a Stöckli ski, but I'd like something with the same (or at least very similar) 13 m radius @170 cm. Looks like the Laser SL has a 14.5 radius @170 cm and the Laser WRT ST has a 14.8 radius @172 cm. I'm 6'3 and 165 lbs, expert skier. I have the Blizzard Firebird WRCs, which I take out when I want to rail some longer radius turns and when I can go fast without worrying that I'm going to run someone over—so for this ski, I do want something in the 13-14 m radius if possible.

What are the main differences between these two skis? Which would be best for me, given my situation? And is it even possible to get a pair now? I checked Powder7, SkiEssentials, and other places that usually sell them, but they're all out of stock.

The Laser SL will be hunting for you. They will be watching you. Intensely.At all times. They will be biding their time. Waiting for you to make a mistake.
And when you do, which is inevitable, they will bite your head off.
WRT ST won't. You can drive the WRT ST at WAAAAAAAAAY higher speeds than the SL.
WRT ST for me is a million times better ski. SL....ish. But not SL. Which in my book is good.


Again-for me. IMHO. An opinion of someone who hates short turns and prefers to ski medium/long turns as fast as the terrain allows. If you are different and like doing many many turns, please disregard the above.

Oh yes, there is no comparison with the Magnums. Different worlds. The Magnums have absolutely nothing on the WRTs. If you want a HEAD equivalent of the WRTs you need to look at their Race department. Some of the WC Rebels are fantastic.

 

[Tony Storaro]

big ugly bindings

The Wardens are great!

 

[Tony Storaro]

Comes alive with speed.

Totally.
Unlike the SR95 and the AX, that are there for you from turn 1, no matter how fast you go, the WRT need some speed.
BUT by far not as much speed as the GS.

On a blue slope, means not very steep, on the WRTs you count 5-6 Mississipis straight down the fall line and then it is yeeeeehaaaaaaaa....
Bur frankly, on the WRTs blues are only a way to get from one black to another super black-the terrain these thrive on.

 

[KingGrump]

straight down the fall line

 

[Tony Storaro]

Ahahahah, well, cmon, just for a couple of seconds...
Ask Conan the Barbarian what is best in life: Put your skis flat, see them driven before you down the fall line, hear the lamentation of your hood when wind tears it off.

 

[KingGrump]

I supposed we are dealing with different part of the same river.

Yours.


Mine.

 

[Tony Storaro]

I supposed we are dealing with different part of the same river.

Yours.
View attachment 154439

Mine.
View attachment 154440

No no no no!

Mine:

Look, we will all gonna die some day, aint that right? I'd rather do it on an almost vertical icy slope than in my bed at home, but never mind, it is just me.

Like the ending of the original Point Break if you know what I mean. A brief quote:

"Pure adrenalin, right?! The ultimate rush. Other guys snort for it, jab a vein for it, all you gotta do is point the tips down"

C'mon compadre!

 

[dbostedo]

...almost vertical icy slope

I would hardly describe any piste as "almost vertical". Not that they don't feel that way sometimes.

 

[Tony Storaro]

I would hardly describe any piste as "almost vertical". Not that they don't feel that way sometimes.

One can dream right? The 50 years wave, right?