Ski patrollers “practice strike” in Park City.

[Rich McP]

I actually agree with you. My problem could be that I dont understand why an overqualified employee would accept that wage ( which is unspecified) yet its somehow Vail's or whoevers problem. A blunt assessment and i apologize and will drop out rather than continue to offend

It's simple - we love what we do.

No offense, and no apology needed. I'm sure your comment reflects the feeling of many people who have never worn our shoes.

 

[Big J]

It's simple - we love what we do.

No offense, and no apology needed. I'm sure your comment reflects the feeling of many people who have never worn our shoes.

I have worn the shoes. Pro in Germany, volunteer at Keystone. Patrollers must have the dedication to endure all of the training and certifications in order to help others. They also must ski when and where they are told to ski. All for minimum wage and most likely with no benefits. This is all for who they are patrolling for to make a profit. I now buy a seasons pass and ski when and where I want to. In my opinion all Patrollers should be in a union and get paid what they are worth not what they get paid now. I truly appreciate all that they do and often tell them so.

 

[François Pugh]

As a volunteer ski patroller in Ontario Canada who has skied some on Vancouver Island BC, I have a pretty good idea of what's involved in the job. While I have it pretty easy in Ontario, with no avalanches and no challenging terrain, I still think ski patrollers who do it for a living deserve twice the pay they get, and should be treated as a profession just like other first responders to an accident where someone's life depends on their skills and decisions.

Here in Ontario the bar for skiing skills isn't as high as it would be where slopes are steeper and longer; patrollers just have to pass some basic skill tests and ski well enough to safely tow a patient down the slope in a toboggan. About half the patrollers I patrol with got into it from the skiing side of things and half got into it from the medical and safety side of things; a lot of the patrollers I patrol with are medics, life-guards, medical doctors, nurses and the like. Some are good skiers, some are great skiers, some are good enough.

Years ago I was taking a first aid course for work, and the instructor told me about his ski patrolling. I thought that sounds like a good thing to do, maybe when I have time I will look into it. When I was invited to join patrol, about 7 years ago. I thought, well if I see someone wrapped around a tree on the side of the trail I'm going to stop and help him; I may as well know what I'm doing. So, I joined. It is a nice thing to do. The skiing everywhere (not just the exciting runs) and in all conditions doesn't bother me at all; I really do enjoy skiing every run in any conditions. Before I was a patroller I really didn't enjoy the greens as much as I do now, and would seldom be seen on one, now it's all good.

Personally I would be happy skiing without patrol; my upbringing and circumstances has led me to place a high value on self-reliance. I don't think society would accept ski resorts running without patrol. I know our city-run hills won't open without it.

 

[mikel]

Op Ed piece in support of Keystone trying to unionize:

Opinion | Susan Knopf: Support Keystone ski patrol’s effort to unionize

While you’re reading this, some member of the Keystone Ski Patrol might be casting a ballot to unionize. It wouldn’t be the first time. Maybe it will be the last time. One thing is...

www.summitdaily.com

 

[Blue Streak]

Unless I am mistaken, there are no patrols rounding up people against their will and forcing them to work at ski resorts.
All employees are volunteers, by definition. They are not conscripts.
Every day people in resort communities leave and find work elsewhere, because they realize they cannot afford to live in such places.
I can’t.
Nor do I know of a utopia where my wishing it makes it so.
Ski Patrollers don’t make a lot of money.
Ski instructors do not make a lot of money.
Most do it because they love it, at least for a while. Then they do something else.
Get over it.

Colorado Labor Laws | Metro Denver

Colorado's unique modified right to work status is the most progressive in the nation. Learn more about Colorado labor laws here.

www.metrodenver.org

 

[pchewn]

I think the whole model of ski patrol is messed up somewhat.

Why does the ski area need to supply an ambulance service for people who crash?
Why do we insist that the same set of people need to be medical experts, ski safety experts, avalanche control experts, ski-ambulance drivers, search-and rescue, etc....

How about a model where

• Private "Ski ambulance" companies can be positioned on-site at the ski area, respond to medical emergencies, stabilize and transport the victims AND GET PAID by medical insurance just like a wheeled ambulance.
• Ski area operators can hire (and pay at prevailing wages) "Ski area safety" personnel to position the crash pads, rope off the areas, do the avalanche control, etc.
• County sheriff offices can have a "search and rescue" function for lost/missing/trapped skiers, just as they do for hikers, horse-riders, hunters and others in the outdoors.

I just don't understand why ski areas need to be in the "ambulance" business or the search-and-rescue business.

 

[Blue Streak]

Great history, steeped in service.

History - National Ski Patrol

The NSP was originally organized and directed by Charles Minot “Minnie” Dole as a committee of the National Ski Association. Through Dole’s efforts as the first national director of the NSP, the organization spread its esprit de corps across the nation. Upon his retirement in 1950, Dole had...

nspserves.org

Thank you all.

 

[mikel]

Effort fell short at Keystone

In 35-34 vote, Keystone Resort ski patrollers decide not to unionize

Editor’s note: This story has been updated with information about the Breckenridge Ski Resort ski patrol unionization vote. Keystone Resort ski patrol will not unionize. On Monday, votes from a close race were tallied with...

www.summitdaily.com

 

[markojp]

Steven's Pass (Vail) lost about 2/3rds of their pro patrol staff. It's one of the reasons they've had a really hard time getting the area open and running during and immediately after storm cycles. I don't know that anyone is happier with the resort under Vail's ownership. On many fronts, they seem to be running it into the ground.

 

[crgildart]

I think the whole model of ski patrol is messed up somewhat.

Why does the ski area need to supply an ambulance service for people who crash?
Why do we insist that the same set of people need to be medical experts, ski safety experts, avalanche control experts, ski-ambulance drivers, search-and rescue, etc....

How about a model where

• Private "Ski ambulance" companies can be positioned on-site at the ski area, respond to medical emergencies, stabilize and transport the victims AND GET PAID by medical insurance just like a wheeled ambulance.
• Ski area operators can hire (and pay at prevailing wages) "Ski area safety" personnel to position the crash pads, rope off the areas, do the avalanche control, etc.
• County sheriff offices can have a "search and rescue" function for lost/missing/trapped skiers, just as they do for hikers, horse-riders, hunters and others in the outdoors.

I just don't understand why ski areas need to be in the "ambulance" business or the search-and-rescue business.

It's a tough sell in areas where there are people lining up to do most of that for pocket change, free skiing, and a couple family passes.

 

[HardDaysNight]

I don't know that anyone is happier with the resort under Vail's ownership. On many fronts, they seem to be running it into the ground.

Yes, this seems to be the modus operandi whichever area this gang of looters infests. Accompanied, of course, by protestations of commitment to the customer and bogus PR-driven opinion polls emailed every few days which result in precisely zero improvements.

 

[markojp]

It's a tough sell in areas where there are people lining up to do most of that for pocket change, free skiing, and a couple family passes.

That's not how it works out this way. How many times do we need to remind people that it's f#^$ hard and sometimes dangerous work. Free skiing.... right. There's nothing free about it for our full time pro patrollers. They bust their asses for all of us. They don't go out and tootle around with their kids. They're on call. They're dealing with very challenging terrain, weather, snow pack, etc... it's a real deal first responders job.... full circle... IT'S WORK. REAL WORK.

 

[crgildart]

That's not how it works out this way. How many times do we need to remind people that it's f#^$ hard and sometimes dangerous work. Free skiing.... right. There's nothing free about it for our full time pro patrollers. They bust their asses for all of us. They don't go out and tootle around with their kids. They're on call. They're dealing with very challenging terrain, weather, snow pack, etc... it's a real deal first responders job.... full circle... IT'S WORK. REAL WORK.

Hard work? Yep! Tons of specialized knowledge and experience required? Yep! Yet they love it enough to do it for less than a family living wage. FWIW, EMTs also don't make good money either and often don't even have benefits. For the same mediocre compensation which would you rather do? Work night shifts cleaning up crime scenes for $12/hr or deal with spring break drunk college kids on the mountain?

 

[markojp]

Hard work? Yep! Tons of specialized knowledge and experience required? Yep! Yet they love it enough to do it for less than a family living wage. FWIW, EMTs also don't make good money either and often don't even have benefits. For the same mediocre compensation which would you rather do? Work night shifts cleaning up crime scenes for $12/hr or deal with spring break drunk college kids on the mountain?

We don't have spring break drunk kids on the mountain. I'm just not understanding your posts on this one. Help me out here. I just don't get it.

 

[crgildart]

We don't have spring break drunk kids on the mountain. I'm just not understanding your posts on this one. Help me out here. I just don't get it.

I'm glad they are trying to organize. but I'm not sure how effective it will be until the resorts recognize unions and legislators strike down those bogus right to work laws. As long as other people can and will show up and take the job their efforts are not going to be successful. Regular EMTs also have a very hard job requiring similar skills and knowledge but 24/7 and they are also not paid nearly what I think they deserve.. Yet, people are lining up for the open positions when they are available.

 

[markojp]

They aren't, cr. I don't know if you saw my earlier post. Stevens pass can't fill positions and lost about 2/3rds of their patrol staff due to $$$ and benefits status issues. It's absolutely affected their operations.

 

[Big J]

Steven's Pass (Vail) lost about 2/3rds of their pro patrol staff. It's one of the reasons they've had a really hard time getting the area open and running during and immediately after storm cycles. I don't know that anyone is happier with the resort under Vail's ownership. On many fronts, they seem to be running it into the ground.

Stevens was my home area until we just moved to Virginia. I did not know that 2/3rds of the Patrol quit. From what my wife and I observed I would have to agree that they do seem to be running it into the ground. My Ortho surgeon got a free pass for skiing there and treating people for free before Vail took over and cancelled it. I bought a pair of Head Monster 88 from the demo shop (I know you have this ski as well). The guys that work there said that they did not even have the skis they demo for sale up there. Pretty much most people I talked to that worked up there did not seem to be overjoyed with the situation. We bought two of the Epic Veterans Pass again as they are such a good deal. We can and do ski mid-week for crowd avoidance and can fly to ski.

 

[crgildart]

They aren't, cr. I don't know if you saw my earlier post. Stevens pass can't fill positions and lost about 2/3rds of their patrol staff due to $$$ and benefits status issues. It's absolutely affected their operations.

And that's typical of what... 1/100th of the resorts in North America? And by "lost", did those patrol change careers or go to other resorts?

 

[pais alto]

They aren't, cr. I don't know if you saw my earlier post. Stevens pass can't fill positions and lost about 2/3rds of their patrol staff due to $$$ and benefits status issues. It's absolutely affected their operations.

FTR, where I worked is having trouble hiring and retaining patrollers.

 

[Big J]

I was Pro and Volunteer patrol in the past. It is so much easier to just buy seasons passes for us now. We buy the Epic Veterans Passes as they are a very good deal even though we have no great love for VR.